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Does All Mean All...Does World mean All

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Yeshua1

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Miss E said:
You and I have that different. I believe the opposite. We believe, THEN Jesus changes our heart, giving us a new heart, taking away our heart of stone. You must first have faith, then Jesus will grant you the Holy Spirit and change your heart.
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Even our saving faith itself is the gift from God towards us!
 
timtofly

timtofly

Well-Known Member
AustinC said:
That is exactly universal salvation.


Since all will not be saved, salvation cannot be for all. It must only be for some. If it was for all...all would be saved.

A completely false statement and unsupported by scripture. In other words, you made it up.


Show me how the passages I quoted ( not just a sentence) is out of context. Once again you make an unsupported assertion.


Prove this assertion from scripture passages, kept in context, or know you are making unsupported assertions.


Prove it with scripture or know your assertion is unsupported.


Show your assertion in scripture as you are stating your philosophy.


I condemn no one. The Bible tells us about the rebellion of mankind. Why else would Christians be ambassadors preaching reconciliation (1 Corinthians 5)


Do you refuse to read the Bible? From Genesis to Revelation we read of God choosing. To deny God's choosing is to deny the Bible's very words.


Not at all. Prisoners have free will, but have no capacity to be free. To be released, a person greater than themselves must choose to pardon them.


What false doctrine? Show us in scripture or know your assertions are empty.


Please show us this definition in scripture as it relates to the capacity for a prisoner to free himself.
You are openly stating a human philosophy.


Do you declare that God has zero control over his creation and does not direct the affairs of history? If so, explain Habakkuk.


Again, you are speaking your philosophy with zero scripture.


This is a perfect example of you having no clue regarding the context of 2 Peter while you quote a phrase out of context as your prooftext to support your pretext.


I have shown you passages of scripture that explain how it works. Breaking God's law results in condemnation.


You are now openly stating a philosophy that comes from your human mind, not from scripture. You are digging your own hole.

A human can decide to leave prison his entire life, yet he has no capacity to do so. Only if a higher power chooses to pardon him can he be released and redeemed.

And here is where your flawed philosophy meets its demise. The conclusion you must make is that humans, by their own work, free themselves from prison by their choice to free themselves.
You abandon grace and you embrace salvation by human works, which is what Islam teaches as well as cults.


Of course it was. From before the foundation of the world, God chose whom he would adopt. (Ephesians 1)


Correct, God gave Adam the capacity to disobey and be enslaved by sin. But, only God had the capacity to redeem Adam out of his slavery to sin. Adam could not free himself, no matter how hard he willed it.


Indeed. It was also God's free choice to allow Adam to sin and thus be enslaved by sin.


Humans can sit in their prison of sin all their life and choose to free themselves, but it will never happen. God must choose to pardon their sins and free them from their bondage.

Question: Is God obligated to free any human from their bondage to sin?


That is your assertion. I have no need to prove your assertion. You are making the assertion, it is incumbent upon you to prove your assertion.

Now, do you deny that God is in control of his creation and that some other power now has dominion over God? If you believe God is all powerful and in full control, why do you place human will as being greater than God?

You must prove your assertions in scripture, otherwise you are making unsupported assertions and speaking a human philosophy that is not scripturally correct (meaning you are speaking a false doctrine).
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Avoid it all you want. You still teach a doctrine of Universalism of damnation. You just cannot admit that only Lot will be saved. Your philosophy is way more of Satan than what you allegedly claim of me.
 
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Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
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Miss E said:
How DIFFICULT is it to understand..... that we.....have to choose to love God.... He does the saving, YES, but WE HAVE TO WANT TO BE SAVED AND THAT IS ONLY BY ACCEPTING CHRIST AS OUR LORD.

A relationship is not a ONE-SIDED THING. God loves us, unconditionally, saved and unsaved (granted, more love toward His children since they chose Him but still has love for the lost), and we have to CHOOSE TO LOVE HIM BACK.

This is elementary root of saving faith!!! WITHOUT FAITH WE CANT BE SAVED. Christ chose us before we were born, I don't not agree with that, but we STILL HAVE FREE WILL OTHERWISE WE WOULD BE ROBOTS JUST SERVING A GOD WHO MADE US TO LOVE HIM.
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In our fallen sin natures, we were enslaved, as could not even desire to get back to our maker!
 
Miss E

Miss E

Active Member
Yeshua1 said:
In our fallen sin natures, we were enslaved, as could not even desire to get back to our maker!
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So be plain with me. YOU and what's his face believe that GOD MAKES THE CHOICE FOR US IF WE ARE SAVED OR NOT.

Is that really what you believe?

Because that still boggles my mind.
 
Miss E

Miss E

Active Member
Look at it like this.....

When Adam and Eve sinned, they ate the fruit and became aware of Good and Evil.

So.

That means.

We have a choice to do GOOD or do BAD

We have a choice to choose GOD (good) or SELF (bad)

What is the POINT of God creating us if we do not choose to serve and love him on our free will?

Other-wise...

We would be serving a God who..

Has false love, since.... He essentially forces us to love him. And it isn't our free will chioce.

Anybody else reading me? Do I make ANY sense to any believer that believes this truth as I do? As I believe the Bible teaches?
 
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Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
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dam and eve before the fall had real free will, but after they sinned, took on sin natures, and lost that capacity!
 
timtofly

timtofly

Well-Known Member
Yeshua1 said:
John Gill really makes us need to focus and think it thru, as His book can get really "deep"
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So, God does not want us to think and choose. Yet this false prophet wants us to focus and think about positives and negatives? We have to do all this deep, deep thinking, by choice? And just to figure out that chosing one's salvation "creates" a weak "God"?

New Age, no doubt.
 
timtofly

timtofly

Well-Known Member
Miss E said:
Look at it like this.....

When Adam and Eve sinned, they ate the fruit and became aware of Good and Evil.

So.

That means.

We have a choice to do GOOD or do BAD

We have a choice to choose GOD (good) or SELF (bad)

What is the POINT of God creating us if we do not choose to serve and love him on our free will?

Other-wise...

We would be serving a God who..

Has false love, since.... He essentially forces us to love him. And it isn't our free will chioce.

Anybody else reading me? Do I make ANY sense to any believer that believes this truth as I do? As I believe the Bible teaches?
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I agree with you. Some make choices to post. Some make choices to write books, that creates a choice to read them or not. Else it is determinism and their own weak God, they are creating in their feeble attempt at determinism. Determinism and fate are equally false human philosophies of Satan, who even gives humans a choice between 2 competing philosophies. Yet God is weak because of free will?? Is God weak, because Satan exist?
 
Miss E

Miss E

Active Member
timtofly said:
I agree with you. Some make choices to post. Some make choices to write books, that creates a choice to read them or not. Else it is determinism and their own weak God, they are creating in their feeble attempt at determinism. Determinism and fate are equally false human philosophies of Satan, who even gives humans a choice between 2 competing philosophies. Yet God is weak because of free will?? Is God weak, because Satan exist?
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God is NOT weak. God shows his mercy and grace to us, as sinners, and He is glorified by His love and mercy toward sinners. Everything about sin turns out to glorify God in the end because he uses sin and turns it (namely sinners) into beautiful saints.

Are you even a Christian? Why are you calling my God weak?
 
timtofly

timtofly

Well-Known Member
Yeshua1 said:
dam and eve before the fall had real free will, but after they sinned, took on sin natures, and lost that capacity!
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What is real free will? They could not freely eat of the one tree, could they? They only had one command, and many choices. We do not even need one command, to choose do we? We only have commands to show us how strong sin can come against us. We do not need to be commanded to make even the hardest of choices, do we?
 
timtofly

timtofly

Well-Known Member
Miss E said:
God is NOT weak. God shows his mercy and grace to us, as sinners, and He is glorified by His love and mercy toward sinners. Everything about sin turns out to glorify God in the end because he uses sin and turns it (namely sinners) into beautiful saints.

Are you even a Christian? Why are you calling my God weak?
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Not me, I am accused of being a free wheeler with a weak God....


If God be for us, who can be against us?
 
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