Did you work in the Clinton administration?
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Drinking: Can You Really Handle It?
- Thread starter righteousdude2
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Did you work in the Clinton administration?
I can absolutely keep drinking to moderation - VERY moderation as a matter of fact. Right now it is my choice and my church's request that I not drink (the church because I'm on staff). But when I did drink, I could easily have one drink every few weeks. Heck, I have a harder time keeping my Coke intake moderate!
Ahhhhhh....should of said Pepsi. :laugh:
convicted1
Guest
Drink a Jack n Coffee. What would you call that??
It would probably be a bummer though. You'd sober up before because the coffee would kick in before the ethanol would...
:wavey:convicted1
Guest
Biblical facts that can't be denied:
• Jesus Christ turned water into wine....
• Jesus Christ drank wine
• Apostle Paul told Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach
I, myself, am a tee-totaller. So, to each their own. If Jesus drank wine, and never sinned, why is it a sin for mankind to drink in moderation?
• Jesus Christ turned water into wine....
• Jesus Christ drank wine
• Apostle Paul told Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach
I, myself, am a tee-totaller. So, to each their own. If Jesus drank wine, and never sinned, why is it a sin for mankind to drink in moderation?
Drink a Jack n Coffee. What would you call that??
It would probably be a bummer though. You'd sober up before because the coffee would kick in before the ethanol would...
I prefer Bailys or Zambucca.......Jacks best with crushed ice.....plain & cold. 2 of those & your set for the evening.
Ahhhhh.... is your tea caffeinated or decaf? There are some Religious societies that disallow even caffeine. :smilewinkgrin:
convicted1
Guest
Ab-so-lute-lee caffeine....no unleaded for me thanks....
Biblical facts that cannot be denied:
Jesus Christ did not turn water into an intoxicant - rather to "new" wine which had not any fermentation.
(Note: ALL fermentation of the ancients were bitter - the result of the natural yeast - and it was only later that various methods were developed to not only remove the bitterness but enhance the fermentation.)
Jesus Christ never took an intoxicant - in fact the point at which an intoxicant was offered, He spit it out.
(Note: Claims of Him being called a wine imbiber were made by those who were seeking some excuse to discredit Him and His testimony. They tried all manner of ways to "catch" Him, and finally relied upon bribery of false witnesses in which they found Him guilty. Had the Lord Jesus Christ had actually been guilty of what they charged - being a wine imbiber - the claim would have been taken as factual - it wasn't.)
The apostle Paul had authority of both an apostle and by the fact that a physician was with him (perhaps giving medical advise) to advise Timothy as the MEDICAL use of an intoxicant. It was for a specific ailment with a specific dosage amount.
(Note: To use Tim as stating approval for acceptance of general use of an intoxicant is just not Scripturally sound.)
The OP presents some very good information worthy of close examination.
Simple......I drink (or eat) something for taste. No one ever sat around convincing me to drink or eat anything. Nor may I add, nobody ever dissuaded me from drinking or eating something or another. That appears to be something engendered into southerners & baptists. Ive never seen it stressed as much in the East, West or Midwest.
Absence of lack of teaching is not proof that the teaching is not correct.
John 19:29-30 NIV
A jar of wine vinegar was there, so they soaked a sponge in it, put the sponge on a stalk of the hyssop plant, and lifted it to Jesus’ lips. When he had received the drink, Jesus said, “It is finished.” With that, he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.
Did you not know they offered him drink, twice?
Look for the reaction to the preparation that included an intoxicant.
Btw, "sour wine" (wine vinegar) was wine that had fully turned to vinegar, a very small amount being mixed with a lot of water was often carried by roman soldiers as a thirst quencher - it was NEVER used as an intoxicant - nor can it be. The acid of the wine turned to vinegar is actually hazardous to life when taken in ANYTHING close to what one may use as an intoxicant.
The roman soldier use was possibly done because of the effect of adding the acid might remove or limiting harmful ingredients from the water sources they might encounter.
It was also used in medical brews and poultices in which swelling is a problem.
Because Christ underwent sever physical abuse in which swelling would no doubt have effected his ability to speak, the taking in of the solution would be medicinal.
Again, no proof that Christ drank any intoxicant.
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If new wine has no fermentation, why do those who heard the apostles speak in their own tongues in Acts 2 accuse them of drinking new wine (vs 13)? Then Peter says that they are not drunk as they supposed (vs 15) - so here we see new wine IS intoxicating!!
convicted1
Guest
I want biblical proof that the wine wasn't alcoholic in nature, and that which He spit out was alcoholic. It was vinegar. Look, I am closer to your side, but there's no biblical ground to stand on in regards to be a tee-totaller, imo.
Well, there are a few biblical grounds to stand on to be a tea-totaller:
* respect of others - loving others more than yourself when you have someone in your life who struggles with alcohol
* God calling you to abstinence for ministry reasons or personal reasons
* obedience to authority (this is where I am - my boss wants me to not drink so I do not drink)
But I agree that there is no biblical grounds for a universal command to abstinence to alcohol.
convicted1
Guest
Well, there are a few biblical grounds to stand on to be a tea-totaller:
* respect of others - loving others more than yourself when you have someone in your life who struggles with alcohol
* God calling you to abstinence for ministry reasons or personal reasons
* obedience to authority (this is where I am - my boss wants me to not drink so I do not drink)
But I agree that there is no biblical grounds for a universal command to abstinence to alcohol.
Look, I think a drink in one's hand does harm to their witnessing, myself, but I can't find any grounds for abstinence. I would prefer they do it at home. If they have one drink and hit and kill someone, then what?????
I agree with you on the driving thing but I've definitely seen that it doesn't harm a witness. Actually, back when we would have a drink here or there around all of the unsaved people we know, they were pleasantly surprised to know that being a Christian doesn't mean you can never drink again. It was a great time to explain about moderation and respect - and we really were able to feed into people's lives (and watch some get saved) out of those times.
I've always taken that verse as mocking them in the sense that no one can get drunk on new wine. Kind like saying, "You're drunk on Coca-Cola!" nowadays.
The Greek term here is not the normal term for wine (oinos) but gleukos, which distinctly means grape juice. "Must, sweet new wine" (Abbot & Smith's lexicon).
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