EPH 2:1 Quickeneth

[ray Marshall]

Not "submitting" to the "doctrines of grace", or as it's often called...calvinism, does not mean one automatically believes you have to work for salvation.

I don't like the term, "Calvinism." I believe in the Doctrinea od Grace. Calvin didn't write a speck of the Bible. He taught the Doctrines of Grace which any good minister that sees the beauty of salvation by Grace can preach if GOD gives him the liberty of the Spirit and blesses him to preach there of.

 

[Lux et veritas]

A mature discussion of Joh 3:3-12 would be fantisic. In fact, I agree with the bulk of modern Calvinist commentators, like D. A Carson (my old prof.) and Tenney, concerning the meaning of the passage. The passage does not help your cause, I must say.

We should also do John chapter 1, since that also seems to be a point of contention. Oh heck, let's do chapters 6 and 10 while we're at it.

BB - when you say "Oh heck", could you please elucidate for us all just exactly what you mean by the word 'heck'? I'm serious. I'd like to know what you mean by it.

 

[BaptistBob]

BB - when you say "Oh heck", could you please elucidate for us all just exactly what you mean by the word 'heck'? I'm serious. I'd like to know what you mean by it.

Sorry, I shouldn't have used the expression. From now on if I do, I mean the following:


–noun
1. a comblike attachment on a loom, for guiding the warp threads as they are dressed for the warp beam.
2. a device that guides yarn onto the bobbin of a spinning wheel.
3. a gridlike arrangement of glass or metal rods below the hooks on a Jacquard loom, used for lifting all harness eyes equally or evenly.

 

[Lux et veritas]

Sorry, I shouldn't have used the expression. From now on if I do, I mean the following:


–noun
1. a comblike attachment on a loom, for guiding the warp threads as they are dressed for the warp beam.
2. a device that guides yarn onto the bobbin of a spinning wheel.
3. a gridlike arrangement of glass or metal rods below the hooks on a Jacquard loom, used for lifting all harness eyes equally or evenly.

:laugh: It will take some getting used to, believe me. I think I'll have to post the definitions up on my screen, just to make sure I don't get it confused with the meaning others would more normally attribute to it.

 

[Tom Butler]

Ooh, I feel a thread hijack attempt coming on. So, to forestall it, I'm creating a new thread on Sugar-Coated Cuss Words. Should a Christian say Gee?

 

[OldRegular]

The tenth was made whole because of his faith in Christ.

Luk 17:19 And he said unto him, Arise, go thy way: thy faith hath made thee whole.

Yes but the faith was the Gift of God.

 

[OldRegular]

I don't like the term, "Calvinism." I believe in the Doctrinea od Grace. Calvin didn't write a speck of the Bible. He taught the Doctrines of Grace which any good minister that sees the beauty of salvation by Grace can preach if GOD gives him the liberty of the Spirit and blesses him to preach there of.

Ray

I have been saying that since I have been on this Forum. The Doctrines of Grace or the Sovereignty of God in Salvation are Biblical. Calvinism, taken in its entirety, has some errors such as infant baptism. Also there is so much bias against the term Calvinism among Baptists that its use is counterproductive. Furthermore, there is more to the Doctrines of Grace than TULIP.

 

[ray Marshall]

Ray

I have been saying that since I have been on this Forum. The Doctrines of Grace or the Sovereignty of God in Salvation are Biblical. Calvinism, taken in its entirety, has some errors such as infant baptism. Also there is so much bias against the term Calvinism among Baptists that its use is counterproductive. Furthermore, there is more to the Doctrines of Grace than TULIP.

Old Regular, i have read most of your postings and have stood pretty firm with what youi comment on here. Please explain whay you are referring to about more than the "TULIP doctrine. Just courious.

 

[Lux et veritas]

Ray

I have been saying that since I have been on this Forum. The Doctrines of Grace or the Sovereignty of God in Salvation are Biblical. Calvinism, taken in its entirety, has some errors such as infant baptism. Also there is so much bias against the term Calvinism among Baptists that its use is counterproductive. Furthermore, there is more to the Doctrines of Grace than TULIP.

I agree. Whole-heartedly. And there is more to the Reformed faith, than just the Doctrines of Grace. It is doctrine put into practice. When people ask me about our church, my response is often that we preach the Doctrines of Grace, and Practice the Grace of those Doctrines.

 

[OldRegular]

Old Regular, i have read most of your postings and have stood pretty firm with what youi comment on here. Please explain whay you are referring to about more than the "TULIP doctrine. Just courious.

I may have worded my statement poorly. What I mean is that TULIP does not include all the elements of Salvation.

TULIP
T: Total Depravity
U: Unconditional Election
L: Limited Atonement
I: Irresistible Grace
P: Perseverance of the Saints

Some years ago while teaching a SS Class the book of Ephesians I used the term the "Multifaceted Gem of Salvation". I discussed those facets as follows:

1. Election
2. Regeneration
3. Union with Jesus Christ
4. Effectual Calling
5. Conversion
5a. Saving Faith
5b. Repentance
6. Pardon
7. Justification [by faith]
8. Adoption
9. Sanctification
10. Perseverance
11. Assurance
12. Glorification

The above list is basically the same as Martyn Lloyd-Jones uses in his book, God the Holy Spirit, though I did not follow his exact order.

I spent little time talking about Total Depravity, Limited Atonement, or Irresistible Grace since most of the class was at least Arminian to some extent and I did not consider it profitable. I thought the above discussion properly presented would establish in their minds the truth of the Doctrines of Grace or the Sovereignty of God in Salvation.

It is my opinion that the entire Bible from the first words in the book of Genesis, In the beginning God created to the last words in the book of Revelation, The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [be] with you all. Amen, are a testimony to the Sovereignty of God. By Sovereignty is meant, not simply the omnipotence of God, but the exercise of that omnipotence in the governing of all things. Similarly, from the covering of the nakedness of Adam and Eve with the skins of animals slain by God, to the birth of Jesus Christ-God the Son, His death and resurrection, and finally to the declaration of His return in power and glory, Scripture clearly declares the Sovereignty of the Triune God in Salvation. He not only takes the initiative in Salvation but completes that good work.

Philippians 1:6 KJV Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

I am giving you a quick answer. Hope I haven't messed up somewhere.

 

[OldRegular]

The above Post #90 is not intended to present a chronological order of the events mentioned. However, I do believe that the first event in the Salvation of the Elect is Regeneration or the "rebirth", consistent with John 3 and Ephesians 2, and the Effectual Call must precede the exercise of the Gift of Faith.

 

[ray Marshall]

I may have worded my statement poorly. What I mean is that TULIP does not include all the elements of Salvation.

TULIP
T: Total Depravity
U: Unconditional Election
L: Limited Atonement
I: Irresistible Grace
P: Perseverance of the Saints

Some years ago while teaching a SS Class the book of Ephesians I used the term the "Multifaceted Gem of Salvation". I discussed those facets as follows:

1. Election
2. Regeneration
3. Union with Jesus Christ
4. Effectual Calling
5. Conversion
5a. Saving Faith
5b. Repentance
6. Pardon
7. Justification [by faith]
8. Adoption
9. Sanctification
10. Perseverance
11. Assurance
12. Glorification

The above list is basically the same as Martyn Lloyd-Jones uses in his book, God the Holy Spirit, though I did not follow his exact order.

I spent little time talking about Total Depravity, Limited Atonement, or Irresistible Grace since most of the class was at least Arminian to some extent and I did not consider it profitable. I thought the above discussion properly presented would establish in their minds the truth of the Doctrines of Grace or the Sovereignty of God in Salvation.

It is my opinion that the entire Bible from the first words in the book of Genesis, In the beginning God created to the last words in the book of Revelation, The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [be] with you all. Amen, are a testimony to the Sovereignty of God. By Sovereignty is meant, not simply the omnipotence of God, but the exercise of that omnipotence in the governing of all things. Similarly, from the covering of the nakedness of Adam and Eve with the skins of animals slain by God, to the birth of Jesus Christ-God the Son, His death and resurrection, and finally to the declaration of His return in power and glory, Scripture clearly declares the Sovereignty of the Triune God in Salvation. He not only takes the initiative in Salvation but completes that good work.

Philippians 1:6 KJV Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

I am giving you a quick answer. Hope I haven't messed up somewhere.

Old Regular, You have explained it well and I thank you for your response. May GOD walk with you all the days of your life.

 

[OldRegular]

Old Regular, You have explained it well and I thank you for your response. May GOD walk with you all the days of your life.

Thank you Ray. The Biblical Doctrines of Grace magnify the love and grace of God beyond measure yet some unfortunately see them just the opposite.