Featured Examining some of the misguided claims of 316 Tradionalists

That’s the biblical answer steaver. Never appeal to your emotions steaver. Read Psalm 5:5 and Proverbs 6:16-19.

God hates ALL who commit iniquity.
He hates those who lie.
He hates those that cause division amongst Brothers and Sisters.

 

Thanks for the clarification. And I agree with Paul.

 

He speaks from the human perspective. All have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God.....wages of sin are death. From our perspective on earth all are bound to hell with accepting Jesus. Only God knows the elect. We all deserve Hell. In "time" we are born as children of the Prince of the air. Outside of time (God's perspective), the elect have always been elect.

*sorry....i knocked ITL's quote out. I put it back in

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That would be all of us. I would say God hates the sin, not the sinner. God is Love.

 

For You are not a God who takes pleasure in wickedness; No evil dwells with You. The boastful shall not stand before Your eyes; You hate all who do iniquity. You destroy those who speak falsehood; The LORD abhors the man of bloodshed and deceit.[Psalm 5:4-6]

That’s not love steaver.

 

Nope. Prayer is effect for those who pray. You may not get the answer you want. But it is for our benefit. God teaches us. Prayer is part of that.

Do you think your prayers save children? So salvation is part raising them correct, part praying for them, part free-will, yet all of God??.

Free-will + parenting + prayer = Salvation ALL of God. That math don't work.

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Again, that covers all of us. So did God hate us before He loved us? And now loves us in spite of the fact we are still doing iniquity?

 

Not what you said. You said "everyone is born a resident of Hell." That directly contradicts the main tenet of Calvinistic soteriology, namely, that God elects people for salvation from "before the foundation of the world."

 

Ridiculous. Name a single sin that a fetus has committed.

 

But you’re not getting it, Brother. Because God IS love, He also hates.

There are six things which the LORD hates, Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him: Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood, Aheart that devises wicked plans, Feet that run rapidly to evil, A false witness who utters lies, And one who spreads strife among brothers.[Proverbs 6:16-19]

This speaks to sins and also sinners. When a rapist is sentenced, is it only his sins that are cast into prison? No. The rapist goes to prison. You can not divorce the sin from the sinner. God punishes sin and sinners in hell.

 

Lunch time, I will answer you Brothers later...if thread ain’t closed.

 

It does not. See post 123

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I see. So God looks down the corridors of time and sees who He elected from eternity past. Understand it now.

 

What do you mean--No? Who is contesting that people are born in sin, some hear the gospel, some don't, and all are responsible before God?

 

No I think it's a matter of perspective. There's is the idea of metonymy and even possibly hyperbolic statements are being applied. I'd kindly suggest one has to rightly divide the word of truth to know the difference. One might even say politically, "I hate Hillary supporters" or the reverse with Trump. I've even seen parents who are say exasperated with a rebellious offspring and exclaim or feel that they hate their own kid. Or they hate their mother-in-law. Does that mean they TRULY do? No and their spirit reaches out to LOVE them unconditionally. If God truly did HATE sinners than how could God EVER exhort us to, "Love our enemies, and do good to them which hate us"?? If he wasn't willing to do the same could anyone with any sincerity not call that hypocrisy?

 

God has to look down the corridors of time to see who he has elected from eternity past.....did He forget who he elected in the past? Did he forget those who's name he wrote in the book of life prior to the foindation of the world?


Or do you mean he sees into the future and sees who he will elect based upon their choosing of Him?
Romans 8 speaks of God foreknowing people in regards to salvation. Not actions.

Election is selection. God does the selecting/electing. We do not select Him or elect ourselves

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No. But you said from God's perspective outside of time, we have always been either elect or unelected. Therefore, when SovereignGrace said that "eveyone is born a resident of Hell", he's obviously in error, if he holds to Calvinism.

No.

No.

Sure. So how can everyone born be a resident of Hell, if God does the electing from eternity past?

 

That's like saying no God, man preaching the Gospel does not = Salvation ALL of God.

 

Election is part of salvation. It is not salvation in it totality. In time you can be elect, yet not justified(saved).

If the elect are never in sin, What are they saved from. Calvinist doctrine does not teach that the elect have never been outside of redemption. From our perspective in time, their was a time we are all lost. Despite being elect. We cannot claim the status of God's child until justification. .... and the process of salvation is not totally complete until glorification.


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