It is Calvinist that just don't understand.
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Faith prior to being saved, Romans 10:13-15.
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Brightfame52
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Brightfame52
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Brightfame52
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I hope its not an issue. According to Jesus one must be of God to hear His Words !
Brightfame52
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We believe through or because of Grace if we truly believe at all. Acts 18:27
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
If Grace isn't in operation there can be no believing Faith, not God given Faith. A person must be made Spiritually alive and given Faith in order to believe on Christ and His Gospel. The whole of Salvation and Faith is of Grace Eph 2:8
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
If Grace isn't in operation there can be no believing Faith, not God given Faith. A person must be made Spiritually alive and given Faith in order to believe on Christ and His Gospel. The whole of Salvation and Faith is of Grace Eph 2:8
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
37818
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You do believe God foreknows whom He has chosen, 1 Peter 1:2? Per Galatians 3:26.
37818
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Galatians 3:26, "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus."
37818
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Those who are of God hear God's word. John 8:47. Matthew 13:13. Galatians 3:26.
Brightfame52
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A person is saved by Grace Period Eph 2:5
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)
And by that same Grace comes Faith to believe the Gospel Eph 2:8 for its by Faith so to show its by Grace Rom 4:16
16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Thats because Faith is not of ourselves, its a Gift and by product of Grace !
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)
And by that same Grace comes Faith to believe the Gospel Eph 2:8 for its by Faith so to show its by Grace Rom 4:16
16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Thats because Faith is not of ourselves, its a Gift and by product of Grace !
Brightfame52
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Has nothing to do with it. According to Jesus who hears Gods words Jn 8:47
Brightfame52
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Gal 3:26 ! Ok
37818
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We agree that John 8:47 is true. But as far as I can tell our understand are still at odds on the matter that faith is prior to being born from God. John 1:12-13.
37818
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We disagree. Matthew 25:31-46. God knows whom He saves.
37818
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@Brightfame52
A question I have asked now this third time:
Do you deny that one needs to first believe Jesus Christ paid for one's sins and rose bodily from the dead in order to be saved?
A question I have asked now this third time:
Do you deny that one needs to first believe Jesus Christ paid for one's sins and rose bodily from the dead in order to be saved?
37818
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Galatians 3:26, ". . . by faith . . . ." means the same as in Ephesians 2:8, ". . . through faith . . . ." That the faith is prior. ". . . δια της πιστεως . . . ."
Silverhair
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Dave your sentences are less than clear "Many hate God when saved." could read better this way Many hate God before they are saved. And this one "How many Muslims hate God when converted to Christ." How many Muslims hate God
before they are converted to Christ.
That is what lead to the confusion, my apologize for miss reading you text. #87
People do not save themselves but God only saves those that place their trust in Christ Jesus. We are saved by grace through faith not unto faith. We saved because we believe not so that we will believe.
I know this may be seem to be an insignificant difference, but the question is not whether faith precedes salvation. The question is whether faith precede justification. Salvation is a sum total of all its individual parts. The Mongeristic Ordo Salutis (Order of Salvation), is Election, Atonement, Outward (Gospel) Call, Inward Call (Regeneration), Faith (Repentance), Justification and Sanctification, and Glorification. All of these individual parts make up salvation. The point at which a person becomes declared righteous in the sight of God is justification (Galatians 2:16), and that is accomplished through faith.
1689Dave
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What you are missing is people are born haters of God. And they always choose an idol they call Christ that matches their idea of what He should be like. Only after experiencing Him in their heart and learning of Him, they replace their idol with the true.
I knew I loved Christ when He sent His Spirit into my heart. But I had a false idea about Him at the time. And Church attendance in several different circles only made it worse. I only learned the truth through years of studying His word apart from the false teachers.
Brightfame52
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If we agree on that, its settled, one is saved, born again before they can hear spiritually and believe.
Brightfame52
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I have no problem with Gal 3:26 nor Eph 2:8
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