going to church 3 times a week

[webdog]

How would you know if that was God's plan? It seems to me, from what I can tell in the NT, is that God's plan is the meet with the church. He didn't put a limit on it, as some people seem to want to do. So I think the burden of proof is on you, isn't it?

He didnt' put a requirement on it either did He?

I am not sure on what basis you pull out the legalism card. What do you think legalism is? And how does that apply here?

If you don't see legalism in HBSMN's threads...you need new glasses.

 

[Pastor Larry]

I'd rather have a zeal for God than church.

How can you have zeal for God without having zeal for the church, which is the body of Christ? I think we fall prey to this kind of sloganeering that has no basis in Scripture.

I think there are a variety of ways to structure a church's meetings. There is nothing sacred about the particular days of the week it occurs on. My concern is with the attitude that considers church dispensable. I don't see that in the NT.

 

[Pastor Larry]

He didnt' put a requirement on it either did He?

Yes, he said meet together, and gave us the pattern. He did not provide any exceptions that I am aware of. (That's not to say that there aren't some, but simply to challenge the biblical basis for what is being said here.)

If you don't see legalism in HBSMN's threads...you need new glasses.

I don't know who HBSMN is and I don't recall reading anything by this person.

 

[webdog]

On waht biblical basis would you not attend a meeting of the church?

Here's one. The Great Commission. Do missionaries attend their "home church"?

If I was witnessing to a lost person at 6:30...and church starts at 7...do I say "gotta go"?

Why would spending time with your son mean missing Wednesday night (or however your church is set up)? There are 167 other hours during the week that you could spend with him. Or you could take him with you to church. Novel idea, I know. But one worthy of consideration.

This is the problem with jumping into a thread not having a clue what is being discussed. If my son's soccer game so happens to fall on a Wednesday night, I'm spending that time with him.
Oh, please don't insinuate I don't take my son to church. Your insults are sickening, Pastor.

 

[James_Newman]

I think you are missing the point. It's not a desire to abstain from fellowship with our church family, but a mandated order that fellowship every time the doors are open is required for a good spiritual walk. I love going to church and being with my church family. Tonight's our small group night...and I can't wait! However, if I had to work tonight, or go to a family member's home, or even if my wife and son just needed to spend some quality time with me, I will miss group, and I believe God does't look down on that. Divorces happen all over America because a husband will forsake his family and put the church family over his. I believe this is wrong.

Here's the problem. If you can't make quality time for your family outside of the quality time that you should be setting aside for God, then you are setting your family above God plain and simple. Your family comes first, and church, which is the body of Christ, the pillar and ground of the truth, comes second. You may think this is right, but your family will not be blessed by being exalted above God. If you think you need to spend more time with your family, take the time from something less important, like your job.

 

[webdog]

Yes, he said meet together, and gave us the pattern. He did not provide any exceptions that I am aware of. (That's not to say that there aren't some, but simply to challenge the biblical basis for what is being said here.)

Please supply dates and times. Proof is on you...

I don't know who HBSMN is and I don't recall reading anything by this person.

You must selectively read threads, then.

 

[webdog]

Here's the problem. If you can't make quality time for your family outside of the quality time that you should be setting aside for God, then you are setting your family above God plain and simple. Your family comes first, and church, which is the body of Christ, the pillar and ground of the truth, comes second. You may think this is right, but your family will not be blessed by being exalted above God. If you think you need to spend more time with your family, take the time from something less important, like your job.

James, it's not always that easy. I work second shift. EVERY weeknight is out. Should I just quit my job so I can attend every weeknight church event?
I find the bolded interesting. Do our lost family members know this? Of course not. Should I then send out emails to all of them telling them not to plan any birthday parties on Sunday evening because I wouldn't be able to attend? Exactly HOW does family come first, James?

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

He did put a requirement on it.

Hebrews 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together... If you stay out of even one service when you could have gone, you are disobeying this portion of the verse.

but exhorting one another... we are to be diligent about encouraging others to be in the Church.

and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching... We are to be in the Church more and more as the day of the Lord is nigh at hand.

Psalms 133:1 <<A Song of degrees of David.>> Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!

Can it truly be said we are at unity with the Body if we would rather be out of Church when they are assembled?

 

[webdog]

He did put a requirement on it.



Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together... If you stay out of even one service when you could have gone, you are disobeying this portion of the verse.

but exhorting one another... we are to be diligent about encouraging others to be in the Church.

and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching... We are to be in the Church more and more as the day of the Lord is nigh at hand.

Psalms 133:1 <<A Song of degrees of David.>> Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!

Can it truly be said we are at unity with the Body if we would rather be out of Church when they are assembled?

Your problem is reading into the text that missing a service is the same thing as neglecting to meet together. This is apples and oranges. Not neglecting to meet together simply means what it says, not what you are adding to it. You still have not proven that missing a night service is neglecting to meet together, or what Scripture tells us what neglecting to meet together is.

 

[James_Newman]

James, it's not always that easy. I work second shift. EVERY weeknight is out. Should I just quit my job so I can attend every weeknight church event?
I find the bolded interesting. Do our lost family members know this? Of course not. Should I then send out emails to all of them telling them not to plan any birthday parties on Sunday evening because I wouldn't be able to attend? Exactly HOW does family come first, James?

I think you misread me, brother, I said that if you are putting your family before God you are out of order. I was referring specifically to your immediate family, but if your extended family falls into the same sphere, that is even worse. Should you email them to let them know you go to church on Sundays? Don't they already know?

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

Pastor Larry,

when webdog refers to HBSMN, he is speaking of me. He finds the fact that I choose to believe and stand on the Word of God concerning the Church to be legalistic.

As I pointed out, it is not legalistic since it is commands directly from the Word of God.

Try this, webdog...

Matthew 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

If we choose to be with family over Christ, we are not worthy of Him. The Church is indeed the Body of Christ, you should think so much of your family that you would want them to be in Church regardless of games, tv shows, weddings, birthdays, or any other worldly event that does nothing to edify the Body of Christ.

 

[Pastor Larry]

Here's one. The Great Commission. Do missionaries attend their "home church"?

Most do. A missionary should be a member of the church that he is at. Hopefully he is planting one. A "home church" is really a "sending church." His home is where he lives and ministers hopefully.

If I was witnessing to a lost person at 6:30...and church starts at 7...do I say "gotta go"?

Of course not. Do you really think this is relevant? Again the structure of churches differ.

This is the problem with jumping into a thread not having a clue what is being discussed.

I do have a clue what is being discussed here. I believe I gave the first response. I am well aware of the topic.

If my son's soccer game so happens to fall on a Wednesday night, I'm spending that time with him.

You just said you work second shift “every week night is out.” So I am confused. How can you spend time at your son’s soccer game if you are at work? And do you really think spending time at your son’s soccer game is the same as spending time with him? I think you should attend as many of your children’s games and activities as possible. I also think that many children are overextended in these things. I coach high school soccer and I know that parents attending games is important. I also know that is not "spending time with your son."

Oh, please don't insinuate I don't take my son to church. Your insults are sickening, Pastor.

I didn’t insinuate that, and I made no insult, and it is shameful for you to assert that I did. You don't have to get personal every time someone disagrees with you. My point about taking your son to church is that many (including you apparently) make this dichotomy that I can either go to church or spend time with my son. I think you can do both at one time.

Please supply dates and times. Proof is on you...

God didn’t give dates and times. He gave it to churches to accomplish certain things and churches set up their structure to accomplish that. You know “Supply dates and times” is a very weak argument. I have nowhere suggested any minimum number of services one must attend. I have been talking about priorities and attitudes.

You must selectively read threads, then.

I do. I always have. I have publicly stated that. Many people say nothing worth reading, and so if someone has established a pattern of inanity, I skip them. If a topic doesn’t interest me, I skip it. If I am in a hurry, I skip a lot. I typically skip long posts. So I read very selectively. Not everything on here is worth my time.

 

[annsni]

How can you have zeal for God without having zeal for the church, which is the body of Christ? I think we fall prey to this kind of sloganeering that has no basis in Scripture.

I think there are a variety of ways to structure a church's meetings. There is nothing sacred about the particular days of the week it occurs on. My concern is with the attitude that considers church dispensable. I don't see that in the NT.

I don't have a zeal for church - however, I DO have a zeal for my brothers and sisters in Christ and love to be with them daily. I have a ball with our friends from church and we encourage each other and pray for each other constantly. There's a big difference between the body of Christ and scheduled church services.

 

[James_Newman]

I don't have a zeal for church - however, I DO have a zeal for my brothers and sisters in Christ and love to be with them daily. I have a ball with our friends from church and we encourage each other and pray for each other constantly. There's a big difference between the body of Christ and scheduled church services.

But don't you think that if the body of Christ schedules a church service, it ought to show up?

 

[dan e.]

this is laughable.

 

[webdog]

I think you misread me, brother, I said that if you are putting your family before God you are out of order.

Is the church family God?

Should you email them to let them know you go to church on Sundays? Don't they already know?

They don't know every night our church has something going on, no.

 

[webdog]

Try this, webdog...

Matthew 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

If we choose to be with family over Christ, we are not worthy of Him. The Church is indeed the Body of Christ, you should think so much of your family that you would want them to be in Church regardless of games, tv shows, weddings, birthdays, or any other worldly event that does nothing to edify the Body of Christ.

The church is the body of Christ...not Christ. Your proof text fails again.

It would also help to understand what is truly "worldly". Weddings, birthdays, etc. are not "worldly"...sinful.

 

[webdog]

I'm getting a vibe from thist thread that many believe the church = God. That's kind of scary, and borders on idol worship.

 

[Pastor Larry]

I don't have a zeal for church - however, I DO have a zeal for my brothers and sisters in Christ and love to be with them daily.

Perhaps the confusion is in what the church is. The church is not the building. It is the people and the purposes for which they meet. So to say you don't have a zeal for church but for brothers and sisters in Christ is self-contradictory it seems to me.

 

[annsni]

It depends. Sunday morning is church time to me. Sunday morning is not scheduled anything else - even sports that are played on Sunday morning/noon are not signed up for in our family. Sunday morning to us was decided years ago - we go to church. Even before DH was a pastor - Sunday morning meant church. We do not have a Sunday evening service because our pastor felt that it was more important for families to be together than to have to race out for yet another church service and I appreciate that about him.

Now, if our church comes up with another church service, say on Wednesday nights - what would we do? We'd probably be there because we would like to be there - especially if it is something that is something for our family. However, right now, there is a Wednesday night program for the kids. We go when we can because the kids enjoy it but it's honestly not a top priority.

Understand that I love our church - I love the staff (again, my DH is one of 9 pastors and we're all good friends - and the staff now numbers 45 and we're close friends with all of them too) and I love the people in the church. So, I love being at church. But to make church attendance the sign of spirituality is not what the Bible says at all. Yes, we're to not forsake the gathering together. Ya know what? If our family consists of believers, we're CONSTANTLY amongst the body of Christ. In my family, we have 6 people. Jesus is in our midst whenever we're together in His name. When we're on vacation, we don't race back to get to church - and often we skip going to even local churches because, honestly, each time we do the kids have a bad time (and I'm uncomfortable leaving the little ones with strangers) and the churches (often old New England churches) are pretty much dead. 2 years ago, we tried to get to a church that I heard would be great for us on Martha's Vineyard - we had to take a cab, they ended up meeting elsewhere, we got there and the service was nice, the music was nice - but not ONE person said "Hi" to us and it cost us $70 total to get there and back - not worth it IMO. Instead now we have our own worship together - singing, praising God, praying and DH will give a small "sermon" to us. We get more out of this than attempting to go to some other church.

Again, in the case of "going to church", I don't see Scripture putting an amount on the number of times we have to go. However to get together with the body of Christ for exhortation and fellowship? I do that just about daily OUTSIDE church.