Have you heard the voice of God? Or, if He talks, what ways do you hear Him?

[blessedwife318]

That YOU don't hear from God is not obliging those that do and have to be in error.

Actually you are in error here as I do hear from God everyday as I read His Word

 

[blessedwife318]

I have not read a single person who has contributed to this thread that makes such a claim. For you to post what you just said as if they did is error.

Yeah thats because no one has. I am not saying that anyone has. I was actually staying the opposite that no one puts their writings on the same level as Scripture.

This argument is like stating a banana is a lemon because they are both yellow.
Again, there is not a single person on this thread (that I have read) that has made that claim.

Which is why I didn't say anyone did. I was saying that I also enjoy reading dead theologians, they have good insight.

That YOU don't hear from God is not obliging those that do and have to be in error.

As I said before I do hear from God every time I open His Word and read it. I do find it instresting that those of us defending the Suffiency of Scripture are the ones accused of not hearing from God even though we say that God speaks through His Word.

Sorry, that you want to compare those who testify of the intimate times with the Father as comparable to Papists.

That was not my intent as I was just trying to explain the history of the reformers battle cry. Not to mention I have intimate times with His every time I open the Bible and read it.

I do not know of a single person on this thread has made a claim of exalting personal experience above the Scriptures. It is obligatory for you to post and report any such claims, for (if I remember the forum terms and rules) such a claim is not allowed. But, more, it is important because YOU have made such a derogatory alignment to prove that such has been posted.

Well I was asked way back in post 27 how I knew that CJ Mahaney's words were not Scripture. I will have to double check the TOS as far as what you said should be reported. What derogatory alignment have I made?

If you cannot, then your writing is as biased as the opinion you have shared. For, you are not, as I pointed out by quoting the appropriate definition, following the traditional definition. You are expanding it to include what YOU think is ungodly, and making the grand claim that the term agrees with you.

I actually have no problem with the definition you posted and as far as I am concerned am well within the historical norms of the battle cry. How do you think I am expanding it?

To that end, I have made now THREE times this statement: that if I am in error as to the definition that I posted and the LIMITS of the definition by the historical reading, then show me the proof that I may change my thinking.

As I just said I don't have a problem with the definition and as far as I am concerned I am with it it.

Until then the obligation falls upon those who have made such an inappropriate enlargement to recant and make apology.

What enlargements?

 

[Iconoclast]

Jerome,

"This is the mark, the peculiar mark of those who are Christ’s peculiar people—they hear His voice. Sometimes it truly sounds in the ministry; sometimes it thrills forth from that Book of books, which is often grossly neglected; sometimes it comes in the night watches; His voice may speak to us in the street. Silent as to vocal utterance, but like familiar tones that sometimes greet us in our dreams, the voice of Christ is distinctly audible to the soul. It will come to you in sweet or in bitter Providences. Yes, there is such a thing as hearing Christ’s voice in the rustling of every leaf upon the tree; in the moaning of every wind;

Good sermon Jerome as CHS speaks of the elect hearing of God's electing Covenant love...
from the same sermon;

I. Who is the proprietor of the sheep? They are all Christ's. "My sheep hear my voice." How came the saints to be Christ's?

They are his, first of all, because he chose them. Ere the worlds were made, out of all the rest of mankind he selected them. He knew the race would fall, and become unworthy of the faculties with which he endowed them, and the inheritance he had assigned them. To him belonged the sovereign prerogative that he might have mercy on whom he would have mercy; and he, out of his own absolute will, and according to the counsel of his own good pleasure, made choice severally and individually of certain persons, and he said, "These are mine." Their names were written in his book: they became his portion and his heritage. Having chosen them of old so many ages ago, rest assured he will not lose them now. Men prize that which they have long had. If there is a thing that was mine but yesterday, and it is lost today, I might not fret about it; but if I have long possessed it, and called it my patrimony, I would not willingly part with it. Sheep of Christ, ye shall be his for ever, because ye have been his from ever. They are Christ's sheep, because his Father gave them to him. They were the gift of the Father to Christ. He often speaks of them in this way. "As many as thou hast given me:" "Thou hast given them me," saith he, over and over again. Of old, the Father gave his people to Christ. Separating them from among men, he presented them to him as a gift, committed them into his hand as a trust, and ordained them for him as the lot of his inheritance. Thus they become a token of the Father's love to his only begotten Son, a proof of the confidence

Think of this mark on their ear. "My sheep hear my voice." They hear spiritually. A great many people in Christ's day heard his voice who did not hear it in the way and with the perception that is here intended. They would not hear; that is to say, they would not hearken or give heed, neither would they obey his call or come unto him that they might have life. These were not always the worst sort of people: there were some of the best that would not hear Christ, of whom he said, according to the original, as translated by some, "Ye search the Scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life." They would get as far as curiosity or criticism might allure them; but they would not go any farther: they would not believe in Jesus. Now, the spiritual ear listens to God. The opening of it is the work of the Holy Spirit, and this is a mark of Christ's chosen blood-bought people, that they hear not only the hollow sound, but the hidden sense; not the bare letter, but the spiritual lesson; and that too not merely with the outward organ, but with the inward heart. The chief point is that they hear his voice

 

[HAMel]

Oh, blessedwife318. You rely upon Romans 10.

So what then do you do with Romans 1:20? (NIV)

"For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse."

...translated, this means that way back in 1386 some guy woke up one morning is the deepest and darkest part of Africa, gazed out over his domain and just came to realize there is a higher power.

Did he get saved at that point or did he die and currently in hell?

 

[agedman]

Actually you are in error here as I do hear from God everyday as I read His Word

You are correct, blessedwife318, it was inappropriate for me suggest that you don't hear from God everyday because it is evident that you read His word, know (more than the typical pew sitter) His word, and rely upon His word and the enlightenment of His word by the Holy Spirit.

In my zeal, I enlarged where I should have been far more attentive.

 

[blessedwife318]

Oh, blessedwife318. You rely upon Romans 10.

So what then do you do with Romans 1:20? (NIV)

"For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse."

...translated, this means that way back in 1386 some guy woke up one morning is the deepest and darkest part of Africa, gazed out over his domain and just came to realize there is a higher power.

Did he get saved at that point or did he die and currently in hell?

General revelation is not enough to save anyone, it is enough to condemn everyone.

Here is a bit of context around your proof text.


Romans 1:18-23

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world,[g] in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.



There no salvation apart from Jesus Christ.

Acts 4:11-12
11 This Jesus[a] is the stone that was rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone. 12 And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men[c] by which we must be saved.”

That is why we need to be telling people the Gospel.

 

[blessedwife318]

You are correct, blessedwife318, it was inappropriate for me suggest that you don't hear from God everyday because it is evident that you read His word, know (more than the typical pew sitter) His word, and rely upon His word and the enlightenment of His word by the Holy Spirit.

In my zeal, I enlarged where I should have been far more attentive.

Its ok, passions can run deep on subjects such as this.

 

[HAMel]

Enough of the nonsense already!

...God, according to Blessedwife318 is a bit more than I can handle.

 

[agedman]

Yeah thats because no one has. I am not saying that anyone has. I was actually staying the opposite that no one puts their writings on the same level as Scripture.

Which is why I didn't say anyone did. I was saying that I also enjoy reading dead theologians, they have good insight.


As I said before I do hear from God every time I open His Word and read it. I do find it instresting that those of us defending the Suffiency of Scripture are the ones accused of not hearing from God even though we say that God speaks through His Word.

In reading over many of the posts this morning, it seemed to me that the experiences of those who have heard (be it in an audible sense, or some other impulse) was being seen as not relying upon Scriptures as the final authority and in some manner considered by some as placing such above that of Scriptures. And hence the cry, "Sola Scriptures" was made.

However, if that was not the intent, but the emphasis was to help the reader and remind the reader of the preeminence of the Scriptures that should dominate every aspect of the believer, then some of what I wrote was wrongly designed and would be inconsistent with the intentions of those posts.

Thank you for clarifying. It was most helpful.

That was not my intent as I was just trying to explain the history of the reformers battle cry. Not to mention I have intimate times with His every time I open the Bible and read it.

That is certainly a joy to read. I, too, delight in His word. More than once, when interrupted by the press of the day, such interruption has distracted and silenced the fellowship of that time. What sadness it is that immediacy can demand we wait no longer on the Lord, and must attend to the temporal.

Well I was asked way back in post 27 how I knew that CJ Mahaney's words were not Scripture. I will have to double check the TOS as far as what you said should be reported. What derogatory alignment have I made?

There is this sense when I read the thread that you were placing all communication by God to believers as only through the Scriptures. That any communication outside (extra) the Scriptures was wrong, and those that had such were in violation of the Sola Scriptura doctrine.

You (and another) added the words "ONLY" to the word final and that is misrepresenting "Sola Scriptura."

The Bible does not contain all answers to all matters involving humankind. However, The Scriptures ARE the final authority of all matters involving humankind, but one should consider that the Scriptures are not exclusive for They are not exhaustive.

There are matters the Scriptures do not address that God will not be silent about with the seeking believer.

The believer is to live by the principles of the Scriptures, and there is no communication from God that would ever violate those principles He established.

The mistake (imo) that modern pew sitters have is not knowing the Scriptures to the point of being able to challenge the "spirit" (John's work on discerning) and to judge if the preaching / teaching is correct (Paul's work on discerning).

I actually have no problem with the definition you posted and as far as I am concerned am well within the historical norms of the battle cry. How do you think I am expanding it?

By adding "only" to the definition it became expanded.

But then you did state:

No one has said God does not answer prayers in other ways. Let's face it most prayers are for specific actions and they happen or they don't, meaning that you can infer a yes or no or not yet to your request. That is not extra Biblical revelation and that is not saying I heard God say....

So, either God does "speak" by answering prayer, or He ONLY speaks through the Scriptures. Which is it that you actually hold?

I hold that God will never give any message that is contrary to the Scriptures, but that God can and does communicate as He desires to Humankind.

I quote from the statement I made on Sola Scriptura:

Sola Scriptures is the Doctrine that the Scriptures are the Final, the Supreme authority of all faith and practice.

I have never read (though admittedly both my memory and reading recall is becoming quite limited) Sola Scriptures used as the only way God answers prayer.

Throughout this thread, the term "Sola Scriptures" is being used by some to indicate that God only communicates through the Bible. That is NOT the doctrine

 

[blessedwife318]

Enough of the nonsense already!

...God, according to Blessedwife318 is a bit more than I can handle.

So I quote the Bible and it is more then you can handle. That speaks volumes.

 

[blessedwife318]

In reading over many of the posts this morning, it seemed to me that the experiences of those who have heard (be it in an audible sense, or some other impulse) was being seen as not relying upon Scriptures as the final authority and in some manner considered by some as placing such above that of Scriptures. And hence the cry, "Sola Scriptures" was made.

However, if that was not the intent, but the emphasis was to help the reader and remind the reader of the preeminence of the Scriptures that should dominate every aspect of the believer, then some of what I wrote was wrongly designed and would be inconsistent with the intentions of those posts.

Thank you for clarifying. It was most helpful.



That is certainly a joy to read. I, too, delight in His word. More than once, when interrupted by the press of the day, such interruption has distracted and silenced the fellowship of that time. What sadness it is that immediacy can demand we wait no longer on the Lord, and must attend to the temporal.



There is this sense when I read the thread that you were placing all communication by God to believers as only through the Scriptures. That any communication outside (extra) the Scriptures was wrong, and those that had such were in violation of the Sola Scriptura doctrine.

You (and another) added the words "ONLY" to the word final and that is misrepresenting "Sola Scriptura."

The Bible does not contain all answers to all matters involving humankind. However, The Scriptures ARE the final authority of all matters involving humankind, but one should consider that the Scriptures are not exclusive for They are not exhaustive.

There are matters the Scriptures do not address that God will not be silent about with the seeking believer.

The believer is to live by the principles of the Scriptures, and there is no communication from God that would ever violate those principles He established.

The mistake (imo) that modern pew sitters have is not knowing the Scriptures to the point of being able to challenge the "spirit" (John's work on discerning) and to judge if the preaching / teaching is correct (Paul's work on discerning).




By adding "only" to the definition it became expanded.

But then you did state:


So, either God does "speak" by answering prayer, or He ONLY speaks through the Scriptures. Which is it that you actually hold?

I hold that God will never give any message that is contrary to the Scriptures, but that God can and does communicate as He desires to Humankind.

I quote from the statement I made on Sola Scriptura:

But the Scripure is our Only Authority for faith and practice. You seem to be ignoring the faith and practice part. Of course it's not the only authority on physics and no one claims it is. But when it comes to what we are to Believe and how we are to Live the Bible is the only authority. That's because it is objectives and is not subjective like an experience, thought, feelings, etc are.

As far as the prayer thing as I said most prayer request are for action so maybe the more accurate way of saying it is that God moves in either having something happens or not having it happen.

The canon is closed. There is no more extra Biblical revelation. It is the Word of God that works in people's lives. It is the Word of God we should be directing people to, for growth and understanding, not mystical experience that are subjective.

 

[Jerome]

"But the Lord has a way of sometimes speaking to the heart by His Spirit—I think not usually apart from His Word—but yet there are feelings and emotions, tenderness and trembling, joys and delights which we cannot quite link with any special portion of Scripture laid home to the heart, but which seem to steal upon us unawares by the direct operation of the Spirit of God upon the heart. You who know the Lord must sometimes have felt a strange delight which had no earthly origin. . . .I think we are not half as mindful as we ought to be of the secret working of the Holy Spirit upon the mind. There are certain fanatics who get delirious and dream that they are prophets, and I know not what. But we just put them to the side. This is a very different thing from being guided by the Spirit of God in all the actions of life so as to obey the will of the Lord. . . .One may be a child of God, like Eli, and yet so live that God will not speak with Him. And, on the other hand, one may be a child like Samuel—obedient, beautiful in character and watchful to know God’s will, praying, “Speak, Lord; for Your servant hears”—and then God will speak to you. It is not to all that He speaks, but He would speak to all if they were ready to learn what He had to say." —Charles Spurgeon, "Speak, Lord!"

 

[Iconoclast]

HAMel
Hello Hamel,

So what then do you do with Romans 1:20?

"For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse."

We should believe it with understanding.

...translated, this means that way back in 1386 some guy woke up one morning is the deepest and darkest part of Africa, gazed out over his domain and just came to realize there is a higher power.

yes....and he quickly made an idol that does what he wanted the idol to do;

Psalm 115King James Version (KJV)

115 Not unto us, O Lord, not unto us, but unto thy name give glory, for thy mercy, and for thy truth's sake.

2 Wherefore should the heathen say, Where is now their God?

3 But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

4 Their idols are silver and gold, the work of men's hands.

5 They have mouths, but they speak not: eyes have they, but they see not:

6 They have ears, but they hear not: noses have they, but they smell not:

7 They have hands, but they handle not: feet have they, but they walk not: neither speak they through their throat.

8 They that make them are like unto them; so is every one that trusteth in them.

9 O Israel, trust thou in the Lord: he is their help and their shield.

10 O house of Aaron, trust in the Lord: he is their help and their shield.

11 Ye that fear the Lord, trust in the Lord: he is their help and their shield.

12 The Lord hath been mindful of us: he will bless us; he will bless the house of Israel; he will bless the house of Aaron.

13 He will bless them that fear the Lord, both small and great.

14 The Lord shall increase you more and more, you and your children.

15 Ye are blessed of the Lord which made heaven and earth.

16 The heaven, even the heavens, are the Lord's: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

17 The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence.

18 But we will bless the Lord from this time forth and for evermore. Praise the Lord.

Did he get saved at that point or did he die and currently in hell?

he perished in unbelief

 

[Revmitchell]

[RegaardingHearing From God]..."Retire from the world each day to some private spot. Stay in the secret place till the surrounding noises begin to fade out of your heart and a sense of God’s presence envelops you. Deliberately tune out the unpleasant sounds and come out of your closet determined not to hear them. Listen for the inward voice till you learn to recognize it." ~A.W. Tozer

 

[InTheLight]

Sola Scriptura does not mean the Bible is the final authority it means it is the ONLY authority. Scripture Alone. We dont use tradition, dreams visions, mystism etc. but the Bible Alone to know how God wants us to believe and live. It is totally Sufficient for faith and practice.

No one has said God does not answer prayers in other ways. Let's face it most prayers are for specific actions and they happen or they don't, meaning that you can infer a yes or no or not yet to your request. That is not extra Biblical revelation and that is not saying I heard God say....

1 The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands.
2 Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they reveal knowledge.
Psalm 19:1-2 NIV

Does God speak to us through nature? I say yes.

Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo using Tapatalk.

 

[blessedwife318]

The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they reveal knowledge.
Psalm 19:1-2 NIV

Does God speak to us through nature? I say yes.

Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo using Tapatalk.

No one denies general revelation and as Romans 1 makes clear it is enough to condemn every single person, but it is not enough to save a single person. General revelation does not tells us what to believe and how to live, Only the Bible does that. Only the Bible is Sufficient for Faith and Practice.

 

[InTheLight]

No one denies general revelation and as Romans 1 makes clear it is enough to condemn every single person, but it is not enough to save a single person. General revelation does not tells us what to believe and how to live, Only the Bible does that. Only the Bible is Sufficient for Faith and Practice.

I can agree with that. But the thread title was
If He talks, what ways do you hear Him?

I'm not going to trawl back through the thread but it seems to me that you were arguing that the only way someone can hear from God was through the scripture.

 

[blessedwife318]

I can agree with that. But the thread title was
If He talks, what ways do you hear Him?

I'm not going to trawl back through the thread but it seems to me that you were arguing that the only way someone can hear from God was through the scripture.

General revelation points to God, I wound not consider it hearing from God. Reading or listening to the Bible is how we hear from God.

 

[Revmitchell]

Should anyone believe that A.W. Tozer and Charles Spurgeon have attacked the doctrine of Sola Scriptura?

 

[InTheLight]

General revelation points to God, I wound not consider it hearing from God. Reading or listening to the Bible is how we hear from God.

...the skies proclaim the work of his hands.
2 Day after day they pour forth speech;

You read these verses and you contend that is not hearing from God?