How am I condemned?

[loDebar]

Jhn 3:18

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God

Are you saying man is not condemned until After death?

Man is not condemned now?

but that is as a man, anyway?

 

[loDebar]

if I condemned myself, I wasn't condemned "already"

 

[Iconoclast]

Jhn 3:18

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God

Are you saying man is not condemned until After death?

Man is not condemned now?

but that is as a man, anyway?

Unsaved men...who do not believe...are in the realm of DEATH.... They are physically alive, but spiritually dead.....
The only thing that can change that is God saving them from sins, and quickening them, bring their dead spirits to life...

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

 

[Pastor_Bob]

if I condemned myself, I wasn't condemned "already"

I feel like we’re going in circles. If you would share your opinion, we could agree or disagree and then discuss it. I can’t help but feel that you’re looking for a specific answer only to give a ready-made rebuttal.

 

[loDebar]

you are right,, first born of water , then of spirit to be saved.

Flesh and blood cannot see the kingdom of God. It is spiritual.

Sin is spiritual , not physical, The physical is effected by the spiritual. but your body dos not sin.

You had to be "condemned already" as a spirit, before being a man

what do you think?

 

[loDebar]

I feel like we’re going in circles. If you would share your opinion, we could agree or disagree and then discuss it. I can’t help but feel that you’re looking for a specific answer only to give a ready-made rebuttal.

I was, actually trying to get other answers,

you were condemned as a spirit not a man. So the only way I can see to fufill these verses is you existed as a spirit before being a man.

hard to swallow?

 

[loDebar]

the verse Iconoclast provided
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

being human is the first condition to salvation,

 

[agedman]

I get the sense that there is an attempt at trying to separate what only God’s Word has the authority and ability to separate.

The human is not capable of separating the physical (soul) and spirit.

Therefore sin impacts BOTH the physical and spiritual.

Sin does not effect one and not the other.

 

[JonShaff]

I was, actually trying to get other answers,

you were condemned as a spirit not a man. So the only way I can see to fufill these verses is you existed as a spirit before being a man.

hard to swallow?

I'm not sure how your thought flows with the context of John chapter 3. He says that those who "Do not believe" are condemned already. Simply put, Christ's advent is not what condemned them (John 3:17), it was their unbelief that "already condemned" them. Those who were in unbelief (rebellion against Yahweh) were already condemned. Hope this helps

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Thanks,
How am I condemned "already" ?

Because you're a sinner already., and if you do not believe, you have no Saviour.

I am a man

Thank you for letting me know. It would be the same if you were a woman.

 

[loDebar]

I'm not sure how your thought flows with the context of John chapter 3. He says that those who "Do not believe" are condemned already. Simply put, Christ's advent is not what condemned them (John 3:17), it was their unbelief that "already condemned" them. Those who were in unbelief (rebellion against Yahweh) were already condemned. Hope this helps

when were we in unbelief?

Christ as a man is part of salvation, humanity is the method of salvation,

How did we come to need salvation ? Jesus said we were condemned already. Jesus said He does not judge man.

yet we are condemned, destined for the lake of fire , prepated for the devil and his angels

 

[loDebar]

Because you're a sinner already., and if you do not believe, you have no Saviour.

Thank you for letting me know. It would be the same if you were a woman.

I get the sense that there is an attempt at trying to separate what only God’s Word has the authority and ability to separate.

The human is not capable of separating the physical (soul) and spirit.

Therefore sin impacts BOTH the physical and spiritual.

Sin does not effect one and not the other.

I amnot separating but, God gave us bodies at the time and place of His choice.

Did we exist before our bodies?

Heb 2:14¶
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

We know Jesus had a body prepared for Him
Heb 10:5¶
Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

but our body does not sin, our soul sins.

We have been taught they are equall, They are not, Jesus said to cut off the hand if it could offends The flesh is tempory and for the only purpose for the salvation of mankind through Jesus's shared death

you will agree the soul exist without the body.

 

[loDebar]

Because you're a sinner already., and if you do not believe, you have no Saviour.

Thank you for letting me know. It would be the same if you were a woman.

Because you're a sinner already., and if you do not believe, you have no Saviour.

Thank you for letting me know. It would be the same if you were a woman.

I am familiar with British humor, I watch Time Team , Perot , etc.

Jesus said "man" He actually said , You judge the flesh , I do not

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I'm really not sure what you are driving at. Why can you not simply believe the Scripture when it tells you that he who does not believe is condemned already?

but our body does not sin, our soul sins.

Romans 7:22-23; 1 Corinthians 6:15.

We have been taught they are equal, They are not

Scripture please.

 

[loDebar]

I'm really not sure what you are driving at. Why can you not simply believe the Scripture when it tells you that he who does not believe is condemned already?
Romans 7:22-23; 1 Corinthians 6:15.

Scripture please.

Pro 8:36
But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

1Co 6:18

Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.

fornication is a trespass against the body, We can sin without the body

Mat 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

 

[loDebar]

Gal 5:17

For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

 

[loDebar]

of course, I forgot sins of omission, where we should have done something but did not.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Gal 5:17

For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

You need to understand that sarx, usually translated 'flesh,' very often in the N.T. does not refer to physical flesh but to fallen human nature. 'So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God' (Romans 8:8). If that means those who have a body, then we're all in trouble!
Soma is a more reliable Greek word for the human body.

But I still don't understand what you're on about. Are you trying to show us how clever you are? If so, it's not working.

 

[Pastor_Bob]

So the only way I can see to fufill these verses is you existed as a spirit before being a man.

Are you a member of the LDS organization? This is exactly what they teach.

“Before you were born, your spirit lived with God. This premortal life is sometimes referred to as the preexistence. In this setting, you had the opportunity to grow, mature, and learn many eternal truths from our Heavenly Father. Yet you yearned to be more like Him. Like any loving parent, God wants His children to progress. Heavenly Father understood that you could only progress to a certain point without the experience of mortality. He knew that you needed to: Receive a physical body. Gain experience from overcoming trials and temptations. Learn to walk by faith. Learn to choose between good and evil. So your Heavenly Father instituted His plan to help you reach your divine potential” (Basic Beliefs of the LDS). [copied from a secondary source]

“The Father has promised us that through our faithfulness we shall be blessed with the fulness of his kingdom. In other words, we will have the privilege of becoming like him. To become like him we must have all the powers of godhood; thus, a man and his wife when glorified will have spirit children who eventually will go on an earth like this one we are on and pass through the same kind of experiences, being subject to mortal conditions, and if faithful, then they also will receive the fulness of exaltation and partake of the same blessings. There is no end to this development; it will go on forever. We will become gods and have jurisdiction over worlds, and these worlds will be peopled by our own offspring. We will have an endless eternity for this” (Joseph F. Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 2, p. 48). [copied from a secondary source]

 

[loDebar]

no, I am not and they only do not teach this. They equate humabity as a necessary part of God plans for heaven.

Humanity is necsessary for salvation for lost souls.

Thgey are actually close to Islam in overall teaching