Humans Do Not Generate Their Own Faith

[Barry Johnson]

This is a perfect example of man judging God and demanding that God tell him why God does what God does.

God tells His ambassadors to go, preach reconciliation. To those whom God chooses, the message will be received with joy, belief, faith and repentance. To those whom God has not given as sheep to Jesus, those will not believe, indeed cannot believe.

When you say 'reconciliation ' I think of this verse . To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. That is Reconciling the whole world ...literally. " It IS finished " ..not for a secret gnostic, special group .

 

[Barry Johnson]

None of the South American tribes heard the gospel until Cortez and the Catholics arrived. That means that for hundreds of years all of them died without having the opportunity to reject the gospel that they never heard!

Ok now your speculating about what is going on out there which is subjective.

 

[Barry Johnson]

We don't need to move on Barry.
I can see that we disagree, and that no amount of clarification will ever lead to our agreement.

I see that 1 Corinthians 2:6-16 develops that no one but those who have the Spirit will ever receive the things of God, for they are only known by the Spirit of God...
And to whomsoever the Spirit will reveal them.

That the natural man, who is the person who is not indwelt by the Holy Ghost, will ever be able to receive the things spoken by Paul in his epistles.

This is my final reply to you in this thread.
I wish you well, sir.

Of course . Another drive by respone . You have not demonstrated ( again ) from the scriptures, your point . And its clear you misunderstand 1cor2,6 . I'm not trying to win any competitions here ,but you are showing that you are dependant on the system and not the bible .

 

[Barry Johnson]

" For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God." ( 1 Corinthians 1:18 ).

According to this, those that perish think that the preaching of the cross is foolishness, while those who are saved do not.

So, how many men can believe the Gospel when it is preached?
I see that it is only those that are saved, i.e. the elect.

So now your saying ,people are saved before they Believe the Gospel?Which is not christianity.

 

[Barry Johnson]

We don't need to move on Barry.
I can see that we disagree, and that no amount of clarification will ever lead to our agreement.

I see that 1 Corinthians 2:6-16 develops that no one but those who have the Spirit will ever receive the things of God, for they are only known by the Spirit of God...
And to whomsoever the Spirit will reveal them.

That the natural man, who is the person who is not indwelt by the Holy Ghost, will ever be able to receive the things spoken by Paul in his epistles.

This is my final reply to you in this thread.
I wish you well, sir.

Just remember the part where you departed from the text. Verse 6 clearly says the MATURE . So its the Mature / Spiritual who recieve the wisdom Paul speaks among the MATURE . But as for the Carnal / Natural / Babes he cannot speak these things , because whilst being carnal they are unable. Not sure ? Hebrews 5 11Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing. Also
12¶For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
13For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
14But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
Now look at 1 cor 3
1¶And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual ( Mature ) , but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. ( Clearly these are immature believer's here and its the same context as the verses leading upto .
1cor 2 is simply addressing the Carnally behaving Believer's as to why they are not maturing . They want the wisdom, but as yet are unable. Calvinism ( and every reformed commentary) takes the Idea of the T in TULIP and needs a verse to imply the unsaved cannot believe the Gospel , so 1cor2 will do . Until the verses are simply read without the system.

 

[Barry Johnson]

" For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God." ( 1 Corinthians 1:18 ).

According to this, those that perish think that the preaching of the cross is foolishness, while those who are saved do not.

So, how many men can believe the Gospel when it is preached?
I see that it is only those that are saved, i.e. the elect.

Acts 13
46Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
47For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.
48¶And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
Notice no mention of God doing the ordaining . No mention of ' before the foundation of the world ' This is imposed onto the text .
Also.

1. to put in order, to station
   1. to place in a certain order, to arrange, to assign a place, to appoint
      1. to assign (appoint) a thing to one
   2. to appoint, ordain, order
      1. to appoint on one's own responsibility or authority
         
         
      2. to appoint mutually, i.e. agree upon

Click for Synonyms
KJV Translation Count: 8x
The KJV translates Strongs G5021 in the following manner: appoint (3x), ordain (2x), set (1x), determine (1x), addict (1x).
Strong's Definitions: τάσσω tássō, tas'-so; a prolonged form of a primary verb (which latter appears only in certain tenses); to arrange in an orderly manner, i.e. assign or dispose (to a certain position or lot):—addict, appoint, determine, ordain, set.
Acts 15.2
When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined ( same greek word ) that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.
Clearly Acts 13 the Gentiles determined , set themselves , disposed, themselves to believe.
42¶And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath
They themselves wanted to hear again . They chose to believe after hearing the Gospel.
Your going to add " well they can't believe because of ...go to the calvinist 'proof text 'check list verses why people can't believe according to the 5 points . Rather than simply reading they actually just believed after hearing the Gospel.

 

[AustinC]

When you say 'reconciliation ' I think of this verse . To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. That is Reconciling the whole world ...literally. " It IS finished " ..not for a secret gnostic, special group .

2 Corinthians 5:11-21 Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade others. But what we are is known to God, and I hope it is known also to your conscience. We are not commending ourselves to you again but giving you cause to boast about us, so that you may be able to answer those who boast about outward appearance and not about what is in the heart. For if we are beside ourselves, it is for God; if we are in our right mind, it is for you. For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised. From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation.The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

 

[Barry Johnson]

2 Corinthians 5:11-21 Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade others. But what we are is known to God, and I hope it is known also to your conscience. We are not commending ourselves to you again but giving you cause to boast about us, so that you may be able to answer those who boast about outward appearance and not about what is in the heart. For if we are beside ourselves, it is for God; if we are in our right mind, it is for you. For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised. From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation.The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them. The world . you see 'The world 'right ?

 

[Dave G]

2 Corinthians 5:11-21 Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade others. But what we are is known to God, and I hope it is known also to your conscience. We are not commending ourselves to you again but giving you cause to boast about us, so that you may be able to answer those who boast about outward appearance and not about what is in the heart. For if we are beside ourselves, it is for God; if we are in our right mind, it is for you. For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised. From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation.The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

IMO, the problem with God reconciling the world to Himself ( which Barry brought up in his post above ), and the word "world" here meaning all men everywhere, is that according to the language of the text, God actually reconciled a people to Himself, and their sins are not imputed to them:

" But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement." ( Romans 5:8-11 ).

Following the pronouns, I see that the "we" here is believers, not unbelievers.
Why?
Because of the phrases, "being now justified by His blood" and "we shall be saved from wrath through Him".
Also, the entire letter of Romans is not addressed to unbelievers, but only to believers.


Now to 2 Corinthians 5:
Here is part of the text in the AV:

" For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:
15 and [that] he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.
16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we [him] no more.
17 Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
18 And all things [are] of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 to wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech [you] by us: we pray [you] in Christ’s stead, be ye reconciled to God.
21 For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him." ( 2 Corinthians 5:14-21 ).


If "world" means all men indiscriminately, then all men are actually reconciled to God by the death of His Son.
Therefore, they will have nothing to answer for on Judgement Day.

But the context of "world" in verse 19 was already established in verse 15 ( "they which live" ), verse 17 ( "if any man be in Christ" ) and verse 21 with the word "us", which is believers, not unbelievers.

Do you see it?

 

[AustinC]

that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them. The world . you see 'The world 'right ?

Is the all universal in this passage? Is the world universal in this passage? Barry, are you a universalist?

2 Corinthians 5:11-21 Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade others. But what we are is known to God, and I hope it is known also to your conscience. We are not commending ourselves to you again but giving you cause to boast about us, so that you may be able to answer those who boast about outward appearance and not about what is in the heart. For if we are beside ourselves, it is for God; if we are in our right mind, it is for you. For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised. From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation.The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

 

[Sai]

Ok now your speculating about what is going on out there which is subjective.

Wrong answer brother. The ungodly rightly accuse Christianity of this, the Bible provides the answer to this specific objection.

 

[Sai]

Wrong answer brother. The ungodly rightly accuse Christianity of this, the Bible provides the answer to this specific objection.

It was impossible for everyone to have been exposed to the light of the gospel but everyone was exposed to enough divine revelation seen in creation that they will be condemned to eternal damnation.

 

[Van]

None of the South American tribes heard the gospel until Cortez and the Catholics arrived. That means that for hundreds of years all of them died without having the opportunity to reject the gospel that they never heard!

God has mercy upon whom He has mercy and the rest (including those who never even had the opportunity to hear the gospel) receive perfect justice.

If that seems "unfair" or "wrong" or some other term for disparaging the reality presented in scripture, then there is nothing more to be said.

 

[The Archangel]

Acts 13 is just one great example . They refuse to believe the truth so as to be saved . In one instance the Jews choose to put it from themselves . The Gentiles in Acts 13 choose themselves to accept the message .

But, that isn't what the text says.

[48] And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed. (Acts 13:48 ESV)
​

The reason for the belief of the Gentiles is given--they were appointed to eternal life.

The Archangel

 

[The Archangel]

Jews are the Sheep, Not English / Americans in 2020 .

If you believe that--in order to be consistent--you should never do evangelism as commanded in Matthew 28 as Jesus was commanding the disciples, not all believers.

The Archangel

 

[Sai]

God has mercy upon whom He has mercy and the rest (including those who never even had the opportunity to hear the gospel) receive perfect justice.

If that seems "unfair" or "wrong" or some other term for disparaging the reality presented in scripture, then there is nothing more to be said.

Sad from the emotional level as a created being yet true.

 

[Barry Johnson]

IMO, the problem with God reconciling the world to Himself ( which Barry brought up in his post above ), and the word "world" here meaning all men everywhere, is that according to the language of the text, God actually reconciled a people to Himself, and their sins are not imputed to them:

" But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement." ( Romans 5:8-11 ).

Following the pronouns, I see that the "we" here is believers, not unbelievers.
Why?
Because of the phrases, "being now justified by His blood" and "we shall be saved from wrath through Him".
Also, the entire letter of Romans is not addressed to unbelievers, but only to believers.


Now to 2 Corinthians 5:
Here is part of the text in the AV:

" For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:
15 and [that] he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.
16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we [him] no more.
17 Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
18 And all things [are] of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 to wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech [you] by us: we pray [you] in Christ’s stead, be ye reconciled to God.
21 For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him." ( 2 Corinthians 5:14-21 ).


If "world" means all men indiscriminately, then all men are actually reconciled to God by the death of His Son.
Therefore, they will have nothing to answer for on Judgement Day.

But the context of "world" in verse 19 was already established in verse 15 ( "they which live" ), verse 17 ( "if any man be in Christ" ) and verse 21 with the word "us", which is believers, not unbelievers.

Do you see it?

Let's deal with this first.
If "world" means all men indiscriminately, then all men are actually reconciled to God by the death of His Son.
Therefore, they will have nothing to answer for on Judgement Day.////
This is the Elephant in the room here, and the reason for your syllogism.
You start with the assumption that its the death Of Christ which saves . ( Which is calvinism, shock ! ) Why do you assume that if Jesus has died for the sins of the world ,( reconciled the world ) that this means all will have to go to heaven ? how does the death for the SINS OF THE WORLD mean that they will also be glorified ?
Christ’s life, not his death is what saves. (Rom. 5:10; 1 Cor. 15:17)

Sinner is saved by regeneration, not atonement. (Tit. 3:5)

Glorification is what’s limited, not atonement. (Rom. 3:23; 8:17-30). When Christ said, “It is finished,” on the cross, everyone was still in their sins as per 1 Cor. 15:17.

. Atonement is one component of many components in salvation. It alone is not what saves. (Tit. 3:5; Rom. 5:10)

. Atonement is a prerequisite for salvation, not the execution of it. (Rom. 5, 8; 2 Cor. 5; Tit. 3:5).

The Atonement must be received. (Rom. 5:11, 17; Jn. 1:12; 1 Cor. 15:1-4)

The Atonement does not glorify anyone. (Rom. 8)
. What Calvinists call “the golden chain of redemption” contains no direct reference to the atonement. (Rom. 8:29-30)

Belief that salvation for anyone was secured on the cross constitutes a denial of the necessity of the resurrection (1 Cor. 15:17)

Salvation is eternally secured by the sealing of the spirit, not “election.” (Eph. 1:13-14; 4:30; 2 Cor. 1:22)

There is no sealing of the spirit before Pentecost or after the harpazo of the church. (Eph. 4:30; John 14:17; Heb. 6:4-6; 10:26-29)
. There are two aspects to salvation: presence/effects of sin and lack of glorification. Nothing that eradicates sin glorifies the sinner. Both aspects must be resolved for salvation to occur. (Rom. 3:23; 5:8; 8:17-30)
. Conviction of the Holy Spirit is necessary for salvation, but occurs to sinners alike, regardless of consequent faith or unbelief. It is not irresistible or unconditionally selective. (Jn. 16:7-11)
. Grace is a ubiquitous reality, not a selective force. (Tit. 2:11-13)

Grace is just fine on it’s own as it’s found in scripture. Any modifier other than “free,” such as “sovereign,” “irresistible,” or “prevenient” indicate someone is either confused or attempting to confuse. (Rom. 3:24; 5:15; Jn. 1:16; Tit. 2:11-13)

. ”Die(d) to save” is not a Bible phrase or concept. It is therefore senseless to pit it against “died to make men savable” since the premise is false to start with. This false dichotomy indicates confusion about what saves.

Sinners are born of God by the will of God after they receive Christ. (Jn. 1:12-13)

Monergism/Synergism is a false dichotomy invented in the 1890s. Calvinists are synergists based on their own definitions of these terms.
. God is pleased to save those that believe, not cause belief in those he saves. (1 Cor. 1:21; Rom. 10:9-10)

Free gift unto justification of life to all men must be received. It’s not “universalism” unless irresistible grace supplants the biblical requirement to receive. (Rom. 5:11-18; Jn. 1:12; 1 Cor. 15:1-4)

 

[Barry Johnson]

Is the all universal in this passage? Is the world universal in this passage? Barry, are you a universalist?

2 Corinthians 5:11-21 Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade others. But what we are is known to God, and I hope it is known also to your conscience. We are not commending ourselves to you again but giving you cause to boast about us, so that you may be able to answer those who boast about outward appearance and not about what is in the heart. For if we are beside ourselves, it is for God; if we are in our right mind, it is for you. For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised. From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation.The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

Sinner is saved by regeneration, not atonement. (Tit. 3:5)

Glorification is what’s limited, not atonement. (Rom. 3:23; 8:17-30). When Christ said, “It is finished,” on the cross, everyone was still in their sins as per 1 Cor. 15:17.

. Atonement is one component of many components in salvation. It alone is not what saves. (Tit. 3:5; Rom. 5:10)

. Atonement is a prerequisite for salvation, not the execution of it. (Rom. 5, 8; 2 Cor. 5; Tit. 3:5).

The Atonement must be received. (Rom. 5:11, 17; Jn. 1:12; 1 Cor. 15:1-4)

The Atonement does not glorify anyone. (Rom. 8)
. What Calvinists call “the golden chain of redemption” contains no direct reference to the atonement. (Rom. 8:29-30)

Belief that salvation for anyone was secured on the cross constitutes a denial of the necessity of the resurrection (1 Cor. 15:17)

Salvation is eternally secured by the sealing of the spirit, not “election.” (Eph. 1:13-14; 4:30; 2 Cor. 1:22)

There is no sealing of the spirit before Pentecost or after the harpazo of the church. (Eph. 4:30; John 14:17; Heb. 6:4-6; 10:26-29)
. There are two aspects to salvation: presence/effects of sin and lack of glorification. Nothing that eradicates sin glorifies the sinner. Both aspects must be resolved for salvation to occur. (Rom. 3:23; 5:8; 8:17-30)
. Conviction of the Holy Spirit is necessary for salvation, but occurs to sinners alike, regardless of consequent faith or unbelief. It is not irresistible or unconditionally selective. (Jn. 16:7-11)
. Grace is a ubiquitous reality, not a selective force. (Tit. 2:11-13)

Grace is just fine on it’s own as it’s found in scripture. Any modifier other than “free,” such as “sovereign,” “irresistible,” or “prevenient” indicate someone is either confused or attempting to confuse. (Rom. 3:24; 5:15; Jn. 1:16; Tit. 2:11-13)

. ”Die(d) to save” is not a Bible phrase or concept. It is therefore senseless to pit it against “died to make men savable” since the premise is false to start with. This false dichotomy indicates confusion about what saves.

Sinners are born of God by the will of God after they receive Christ. (Jn. 1:12-13)

Monergism/Synergism is a false dichotomy invented in the 1890s. Calvinists are synergists based on their own definitions of these terms.
. God is pleased to save those that believe, not cause belief in those he saves. (1 Cor. 1:21; Rom. 10:9-10)

Free gift unto justification of life to all men must be received. It’s not “universalism” unless irresistible grace supplants the biblical requirement to receive. (Rom. 5:11-18; Jn. 1:12; 1 Cor. 15:1-4)

 

[Barry Johnson]

But, that isn't what the text says.

[48] And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed. (Acts 13:48 ESV)
​

The reason for the belief of the Gentiles is given--they were appointed to eternal life.

The Archangel

And could you expound on that ? I can quote the verse also ...

48¶And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

see ,when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
???
What are you assuming in the text ? let me Guess your presup and bias . You think this is saying And when the Gentiles ,who God had already regenerated ,giving them the gift of repentance and faith caused them to be glad ,to glorify the word of the Lord ,and as many were elected before the foundation of the world to be saved ,believed.
However ( aside from all the points I've already given with the context ) There is no Mention of God doing anything in the verse , its assumed and there is no mention of 'before the foundation of the world ' .Its assumed . Which is
Eisegesis (/ˌaɪsɪˈdʒiːsɪs/) is the process of interpreting text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases. ... Exegesis is drawing out text's meaning in accordance with the author's context and discoverable meaning.

 

[Barry Johnson]

If you believe that--in order to be consistent--you should never do evangelism as commanded in Matthew 28 as Jesus was commanding the disciples, not all believers.

The Archangel

How does that logically follow? My point is about Jesus refers to the ' Sheep ' as Israel .