Is Drinking Wine Wrong??

[Diggin in da Word]

Scripture must interpret scripture, yes. And scripture has been given many times over to show where wine is fermented and where it is not, yet it is rejected.

 

[annsni]

Scripture must interpret scripture, yes. And scripture has been given many times over to show where wine is fermented and where it is not, yet it is rejected.

And you reject when we show that it MUST be fermented drink.

 

[Diggin in da Word]

double post

 

[Diggin in da Word]

triple post

 

[Diggin in da Word]

quadruple post

 

[Diggin in da Word]

what's going on with the BB?

 

[Linda64]

Yet I have not seen any evidence that the word 'wine' is a generic term - or that 'strong drink' is either. They certainly didn't have anything like Jolt in Bible times - strong drink is a fermented, intoxicating drink from all that I can see in outside, neutral sources. I can't agree that we can make the meaning of the word change to conveniently back up an argument. Scripture must interpret Scripture and I don't see your argument backed up by Scripture anywhere.

I am not making the meanings of the word wine or strong drink to change to back up any argument. When you take the word wine and strong drink in context, they will mean what they are supposed to mean. There are alot of generic words in the Bible---water is generic--milk is generic--and so is "wine" and "strong drink".

Let me ask you, has anybody close to you died from alcohol? Alcohol is a toxic drug--it has NO nutritional value whatsoever. It works directly on the CNS (Central Nervous System). It kills more than just the drinker--and all of this started with the first drink. My husband died 6 years ago from alcohol--he had enough of that poison in his body to kill a horse. My son, who is an attorney, told me that he has seen people die from alot less BAC.

It's really strange that all "sipping saints" like to come back with the sin of "gluttony" when confronted with drinking alcoholic beverages--that's like comparing apples with oranges.

 

[Alcott]

Wherever the use of wine is prohibited or discouraged, the reference is to fermented wine. Where its use is encouraged, the reference is to unfermented grape juice.

Don't you wish, little sister?

 

[Diggin in da Word]

And you reject when we show that it MUST be fermented drink.

Yes, I do reject it. Because if taken in context, one will see that fermented wine is forbidden. So, yes, I reject the fermented wine.

 

[annsni]

Yes, I do reject it. Because if taken in context, one will see that fermented wine is forbidden. So, yes, I reject the fermented wine.

The only context is that God is condoning it - so it mustn't be alcoholic and when He speaks against it, it must have alcohol in it. That is making Scripture say what YOU want it to say. Strong drink is NOT generic like water. You know, when water is mentioned, it's water. It's wet, gets you wet and does many other things. Alcohol can make you drunk - no question. But it doesn't necessarily kill you - as a matter of fact, as Gerhard pointed out. In large quantities it is bad, but in smaller quantities is is good for you!! I've even been prescribed alcohol twice by doctors (one of them was a believer) - if it's going to kill me, why would they tell me to imbibe??

Now, I have to say, Linda, I understand where you're coming from. I grew up in a 100% pure Irish Catholic family - I've had LOTS of alcoholic members of my family. None of them died as a result of the alcohol that I know of - most of them lived long and full lives - even my uncle who was a HORRIBLE alcoholic. But when you've lost someone so close to you, things are different. I am sorry for your loss - very sorry.

Ann

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

maybe he believes in the alcohol more than God?

 

[Taufgesinnter]

amazing post Taufgesinnter (what does that mean by the way? is it your name? or what? its neat)!---

take Tauf's advice - do as scripture says - if you want to judge according to scripture - then heed scripture that says not to judge those who drink.

it goes both ways. don't provoke either.

Thanks! "Taufgesinnter" is the German name for "Anabaptist," which is what I was nearly my entire adult life until this year.

 

[FriendofSpurgeon]

To me, this seems so unimportant. At our church (non-Baptist), drinking alcohol is never mentioned. But the Gospel is.

Some Christian friends drink alcohol, others don't. Neither are judged better or worse because of their personal decision.

Also, a lot of this is cultural-based as well. I live in a very Hispanic community. Wine is often served with dinner because, well, that's the way they do it. Just like in the South, you get sweet tea. BTW, I've never known anyone getting drunk from having wine with dinner.

 

[DHK]

You can't get around it no matter how you justify it.
Fermented wine, (yeast--a symbol of corruption in the Bible) cannot be used at the Lord's Table to symbolize the uncorruptible body of the Lord Jesus Christ. Yeast (leavened bread) and fermented wine are strictly prohibited when celebrating the Lord's Table because our Lord was sinless. Why do some here insist on celebrating the Lord's Table with elements that represent sin. How blasphemous!
DHK

 

[annsni]

You can't get around it no matter how you justify it.
Fermented wine, (yeast--a symbol of corruption in the Bible) cannot be used at the Lord's Table to symbolize the uncorruptible body of the Lord Jesus Christ. Yeast (leavened bread) and fermented wine are strictly prohibited when celebrating the Lord's Table because our Lord was sinless. Why do some here insist on celebrating the Lord's Table with elements that represent sin. How blasphemous!
DHK

Grapes have their own yeast to ferment the wine. Even grape juice has yeast in it and thus it must be refrigerated to inhibit the workings of the yeast. God made it that way and you can't get around that.

 

[Jack Matthews]

You can't get around it no matter how you justify it.
Fermented wine, (yeast--a symbol of corruption in the Bible) cannot be used at the Lord's Table to symbolize the uncorruptible body of the Lord Jesus Christ. Yeast (leavened bread) and fermented wine are strictly prohibited when celebrating the Lord's Table because our Lord was sinless. Why do some here insist on celebrating the Lord's Table with elements that represent sin. How blasphemous!
DHK

Interesting comment. I can't find a single reference in the scripture to "unfermented wine." The bacteria count in any unfermented fruit beverage of that day would have been enough to kill someone.

Your assertion that yeast is a symbol of corruption in the Bible is unfounded and without support. It is not consistently used as such. Moreover, once the fermentation process is complete, wine is pure, and has the capability of cleansing the inner body. That probably had a lot to do with why Jesus chose it as a symbol, that and the fact that it was being served at dinner that night and was handy.

 

[Linda64]

yeast

YEAST, n.

1. Barm; the foam, froth or flower of beer or other liquor in fermentation; used for raising dough for bread or cakes, and making it light and puffy.

2. Spume or foam of water. Not in use.
__________________________________

leaven

LEAVEN, n. lev'n. L. levo, Eng. to lift.

1. A mass of sour dough, which, mixed with a larger quantity of dough or paste, produces fermentation in it and renders it light. During the seven days of the passover, no leaven was permitted to be in the houses of the Jews. Ex. 12.

2. Any thing which makes a general change in the mass. It generally means something which corrupts or depraves that with which it is mixed.

Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

Matt. 16.

LEAVEN, v.t. lev'n.

1. To excite fermentation in; to raise and make light, as dough or paste.

A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. 1Cor. 5.

2. to taint; to imbue.

From Websters Dictionary 1828

Yeast is leaven---leaven is a symbol for sin and corruption. DHK is correct.

Unleavened bread (matzo) has NO YEAST. It is used in Passover seders.

 

[gekko]

ok - so the wine was not from pure grapes - cause there's leaven on the grapes - and it wasn't fermented cause fermentation has leaven.

so it was God's wine. big deal.
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Lord, I pray that you will send down some of your wine to straighten this out - maybe some manna too so we dont argue between ritz and stone-wheat. This way we will know we are saved because we drink unfermented - unleavened drinks and unleavened bread.
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God bless

 

[Alcott]

Yeast is leaven---leaven is a symbol for sin and corruption. DHK is correct.

And again He said, "To what shall I compare the kingdom of God? "It is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three pecks of flour until it was all leavened" [Luke 13:20-22].

Ain't it great that Linda and DHK think the Kingdom of God is "sin and corruption?"

 

[gekko]

oh but that's a righteous kind of leaven Alcott...