Jesus and the death Penalty?

[Yeshua1]

I disagree, and I don't think you can reconcile your belief with the ethical and moral teachings of Jesus.

He did worse than that in the OT, or don't you think that he was doing that ?

 

[Thomas Helwys]

He did worse than that in the OT, or don't you think that he was doing that ?

I know what he said in His direct words and what He did in His direct actions while He walked the earth. And He repudiated the Jewish idea of justice in, for example, the woman caught in adultery. I go by His teachings in the Sermon on the Mount.

 

[Revmitchell]

I know what he said in His direct words and what He did in His direct actions while He walked the earth. And He repudiated the Jewish idea of justice in, for example, the woman caught in adultery. I go by His teachings in the Sermon on the Mount.

So why do you call it the "Jewish" idea of justice? Rather odd since they were only following the commandment of God by direct revelation.

 

[Thomas Helwys]

So why do you call it the "Jewish" idea of justice? Rather odd since they were only following the commandment of God by direct revelation.

Their actions did not meet with Jesus' approval.

So, tell me, do you believe Jesus would throw the lever or administer the injection?

 

[Thomas Helwys]

Are we talking about the same Jesus who fashioned a whip of cords?

And whom did He beat to death? Or support such?

 

[Revmitchell]

Their actions did not meet with Jesus' approval.

The abuse of these specific people does not negate the commands of God in the OT.

So, tell me, do you believe Jesus would throw the lever or administer the injection?

Well I suppose we could look to the cross to find the answer to that question.

 

[Zaac]

IF the person was gulity of first degree murder, yes he would, since he is the same One who instituted that as the punishement for that crime!

I don't see anything that BIBLICALLY allows this to hold water. Everything of Jesus's ministry points away from man being able to righteously make such a decision.

And Jesus simply isn't authoring confusion.

Yet I still don't understand how any Christian would not always opt for mercy knowing that God has been merciful to us.

 

[Zaac]

Are we talking about the same Jesus who fashioned a whip of cords?

Again, that is Jesus, One capable of making a righteous judgment as to who deserves punishment unto death. I don't know of any humans who possess that ability.

 

[Don]

And whom did He beat to death? Or support such?

My point was that this picture of Jesus as being this loving, always forgiving figure has its moments where He made a whip and chased people.

Let us also not forget Matthew 15:3-4 / Mark 7:9-13.

AS for the adulteress woman: let us not forget that Jesus acknowledged that she wasn't without fault: "Go, and sin no more."

 

[Thomas Helwys]

My point was that this picture of Jesus as being this loving, always forgiving figure has its moments where He made a whip and chased people.

Let us also not forget Matthew 15:3-4 / Mark 7:9-13.

AS for the adulteress woman: let us not forget that Jesus acknowledged that she wasn't without fault: "Go, and sin no more."

But He didn't beat anyone to death with that whip.

And He prevented the people from stoning the woman to death.

 

[Don]

But He didn't beat anyone to death with that whip.

And He prevented the people from stoning the woman to death.

Why did He prevent them from stoning her to death?

 

[Thomas Helwys]

Why did He prevent them from stoning her to death?

Why do you think?

 

[Don]

Why do you think?

Asked you first.

 

[Thomas Helwys]

Asked you first.

His action was in line with His ethical teachings that he gave while He walked the earth. He preached to turn the other cheek. When Peter whacked off the servant's ear, Jesus rebuked him and told him to sheath his sword. He stopped the stoning.

 

[Revmitchell]

His action was in line with His ethical teachings that he gave while He walked the earth. He preached to turn the other cheek. When Peter whacked off the servant's ear, Jesus rebuked him and told him to sheath his sword. He stopped the stoning.

This is an inconsistent position with regards to government issuing justice. If you are going to turn the cheek for one punishment then you would need to turn the cheek for every form of punishment.

 

[Thomas Helwys]

This is an inconsistent position with regards to government issuing justice. If you are going to turn the cheek for one punishment then you would need to turn the cheek for every form of punishment.

I'm talking about general principles here. I can see nowhere that Jesus was against punishment. I can see nowhere that he was for punishment unto death.

 

[Don]

His action was in line with His ethical teachings that he gave while He walked the earth. He preached to turn the other cheek. When Peter whacked off the servant's ear, Jesus rebuked him and told him to sheath his sword. He stopped the stoning.

I disagree. What was the law regarding adultery? That both the man and the woman were to be stoned. Verse 6 tells us that situation was a trap so that they might accuse Him. If Jesus had agreed to stoning her, He would have been guilty of not obeying the law--His law. And look further: she had been apprehended by the religious leaders, the ones responsible for ensuring the law was followed; if He had agreed to stoning her, or if He had simply turned the other cheek, He would have been announcing to all of them that He was of the same authority as they--which He had adamantly been telling all who listened wasn't the case. Instead of doing either, He challenged them with the statement "let he who is without sin...." How could they possibly react, knowing that they were twisting the law in order to accuse Him?

And when none of them were left to condemn her, He didn't condemn her either; but told her, "go and sin no more[/]." How must she have felt when she heard those words? "I know you're guilty; don't do it again."

Jesus did talk of turning the other cheek when someone offends you; but where does He say, "ignore all those laws, especially the death penalty ones, that I gave you"?

This isn't blood-thirstiness; I wish we didn't have to have jails or the death penalty; but what are we to do when we have people who allow their sin nature to become a threat to society?

 

[Thomas Helwys]

I disagree. What was the law regarding adultery? That both the man and the woman were to be stoned. Verse 6 tells us that situation was a trap so that they might accuse Him. If Jesus had agreed to stoning her, He would have been guilty of not obeying the law--His law. And look further: she had been apprehended by the religious leaders, the ones responsible for ensuring the law was followed; if He had agreed to stoning her, or if He had simply turned the other cheek, He would have been announcing to all of them that He was of the same authority as they--which He had adamantly been telling all who listened wasn't the case. Instead of doing either, He challenged them with the statement "let he who is without sin...." How could they possibly react, knowing that they were twisting the law in order to accuse Him?

And when none of them were left to condemn her, He didn't condemn her either; but told her, "go and sin no more[/]." How must she have felt when she heard those words? "I know you're guilty; don't do it again."

Jesus did talk of turning the other cheek when someone offends you; but where does He say, "ignore all those laws, especially the death penalty ones, that I gave you"?

This isn't blood-thirstiness; I wish we didn't have to have jails or the death penalty; but what are we to do when we have people who allow their sin nature to become a threat to society?

I am not against physical punishment on this earth. I am against punishment unto death because I believe Jesus was against it.

So, I ask again: Where in the NT is there evidence that Jesus was for punishment unto death? All of His ethical teachings are evidence against it.

 

[saturneptune]

I am not against physical punishment on this earth. I am against punishment unto death because I believe Jesus was against it.

So, I ask again: Where in the NT is there evidence that Jesus was for punishment unto death? All of His ethical teachings are evidence against it.

I can only thing of one incident in the NT that relates to this as an act of God. It is in the book of Acts when Annias and Saphria lied to the Apostles about their tithe. The Holy Spirit stuck them dead. I do not know if this relates or not.

 

[Thomas Helwys]

I can only thing of one incident in the NT that relates to this as an act of God. It is in the book of Acts when Annias and Saphria lied to the Apostles about their tithe. The Holy Spirit stuck them dead. I do not know if this relates or not.

All I can say is that was God judging them and carrying out the sentence. I don't think man has the right to put himself in the place of God.

The human part of me would have liked to see Casey Anthony put to death, for instance, but I believe Jesus teaches otherwise.