moderates

[Benjamin]

But there are other ways of looking at things. The point is to not to look at the political spectrum like this.

Leftist - - - liberal - - - conservative - - - rightist

But instead like this,

Leftists _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Conservatives
Rightists - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Liberals

This should settle it:

I often also wondered why it is that Conservatives are called
the "right" and Liberals are called the "left."
By chance I stumbled upon this verse in the Bible:
"The heart of the wise inclines to the right,
but the heart of the fool to the left." Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV).
Thus sayeth the Lord. Amen.
Can't get any simpler than that.

 

[evenifigoalone]

I highly doubt Ecclesiastes 10 is referring to today's politics. The left right political scale wasn't invented until the 1700's, it didn't exist in Solomon's time

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[evenifigoalone]

I highly doubt Ecclesiastes 10 is referring to today's politics. The left right political scale wasn't invented until the 1700's, it didn't exist in Solomon's time

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Asked around, and pparently there was a thing in ancient times where right hands were considered a symbol of justice, while left hands were evil. You did dirty work with your left hand.
That's what the verse refers to. It's probably also why Jesus is referred to as being at the Father's right hand.

It has zilch to do with politics

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[Revmitchell]

Asked around, and pparently there was a thing in ancient times where right hands were considered a symbol of justice, while left hands were evil. You did dirty work with your left hand.
That's what the verse refers to. It's probably also why Jesus is referred to as being at the Father's right hand.

It has zilch to do with politics

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Ummm..the use of that verse was a joke. No one intended it to be taken seriously.

 

[Revmitchell]

Asked around, and pparently there was a thing in ancient times where right hands were considered a symbol of justice, while left hands were evil. You did dirty work with your left hand.
That's what the verse refers to. It's probably also why Jesus is referred to as being at the Father's right hand.

It has zilch to do with politics

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Ummm..the use of that verse was a joke. No one intended it to be taken seriously.

 

[just-want-peace]

I highly doubt Ecclesiastes 10 is referring to today's politics. The left right political scale wasn't invented until the 1700's, it didn't exist in Solomon's time

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Future prophecy??? (Just a thought ---)

 

[Yeshua1]

So there's a large attitude on this forum that anyone slightly left of them is basically a liberal. Which is the exact same attitude the far left has to anyone slightly right of them.

I'm a moderate/centrist, have been for a long time. I used to be a right wing libertarian, until recently (see below picture). While I have for most of my life been right wing, apparently I've drifted into center left. There is a LOT of leftist stuff I either cannot get behind, or that I can only partially get behind, so I don't really consider myself as allied with them. But my fiscal views have drifted away from right wing of late--my social views are more or less where they have been for 6 years (being libertarian in that time, and all).

I have no high expectations of anyone on this board, but before you call us moderates "liberal lite", consider that the left strongly considers us "conservative lite", if not outright using the "Nazi" label to describe us. (I'm dead serious, the amount of times I've seen leftists describe centrists as being "Nazi sympathizers" is too dang many to count.)

Anyway, have your hayday. I'll continue to be here regardless, your hate will not stop me.

Would you agree with the morality in the scriptures outlined to us from God?

 

[Yeshua1]

Just adding my voice and diversity of thought here, as well as calling out stinkin' thinkin' that I've come across in my time here. Can't let the right wingers have all the fun.
Anyways. I'm gonna go to bed. I let myself stay up late because I don't have work until tomorrow afternoon, but I shouldn't stay up all night.

Right wingers are those of use who uphold biblical morality, as in no to abortion and gay weddings, and who do see the cardinal doctrines of Christianity as truths that must be held, correct?

 

[evenifigoalone]

Right wingers are those of use who uphold biblical morality, as in no to abortion and gay weddings, and who do see the cardinal doctrines of Christianity as truths that must be held, correct?

Not necessarily
Especially that last bit--there you're confusing theological conservatism with political conservatism. They're not the same.

I considered myself right wing right up until my fiscal views changed. That's the catalyst that shifted me from right of center to apparently left of center. But if you're at all familiar with right wing libertarians, then you know that they tend to support gay marriage and other things that conservative Christians do not. You can lean right and still support those things from the perspective of the government rule. What makes them right wing is their fiscal views--such as free market and laissez-faire capitalism.

Left wing libertarianisn also exists--except they tend to be outright socialist and believe in abolishing private property

There's multiple philosophies and facets of the right wing, and I assume the same is true of the left wing as well. (The left wing is still unfamiliar territory to me.)

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[evenifigoalone]

Future prophecy??? (Just a thought ---)

Doubtful, considering left and right already had a context back then

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[Yeshua1]

Not necessarily
Especially that last bit--there you're confusing theological conservatism with political conservatism. They're not the same.

I considered myself right wing right up until my fiscal views changed. That's the catalyst that shifted me from right of center to apparently left of center. But if you're at all familiar with right wing libertarians, then you know that they tend to support gay marriage and other things that conservative Christians do not. You can lean right and still support those things from the perspective of the government rule. What makes them right wing is their fiscal views--such as free market and laissez-faire capitalism.

Left wing libertarianisn also exists--except they tend to be outright socialist and believe in abolishing private property

There's multiple philosophies and facets of the right wing, and I assume the same is true of the left wing as well. (The left wing is still unfamiliar territory to me.)

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So you would vale your personal decisions in morals over those God gave to us to uphold? Abortion and gay marriage wrong for me, but not wrong for all?

 

[evenifigoalone]

So you would vale your personal decisions in morals over those God gave to us to uphold? Abortion and gay marriage wrong for me, but not wrong for all?

If we value religious freedom, then we should also value not being forced to follow religions we are not a part of. Gay marriage being morally wrong is a purely religious view.
((Edit: I'm prolife))

When/if a Muslim living in this country decides they want to implement shariah law into the government, you are indignant. And yet you wish to do the same, but it's okay because it's Christian.

I start work in 15 minutes, so it may be hours before you hear from me again.

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[Yeshua1]

If we value religious freedom, then we should also value not being forced to follow religions we are not a part of. Gay marriage being morally wrong is a purely religious view.
((Edit: I'm prolife))

When/if a Muslim living in this country decides they want to implement shariah law into the government, you are indignant. And yet you wish to do the same, but it's okay because it's Christian.

I start work in 15 minutes, so it may be hours before you hear from me again.

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So it is ok for us to uphold laws that God already stated are sinful?

 

[evenifigoalone]

So it is ok for us to uphold laws that God already stated are sinful?

Absolutely, the government isn't God. It isn't my mother or father either.

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[Yeshua1]

Absolutely, the government isn't God. It isn't my mother or father either.

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is it wise and right to disobey God?

 

[evenifigoalone]

is it wise and right to disobey God?

Clocking into work, will get back to you later.

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[FollowTheWay]

White Nationalists are leftists.

Nazis are leftists.

Both of these groups want government control over the economy. Both want speech regulated. Both want massive social programs. Both want to define people based on race.

This is not a generalization, this is a category. I don't consider all liberals to be leftists but at the moment the leftists are trying to take over the liberal institutions. These institutions are now banning speech. Something a liberal institution would never do. Your thinking that liberal = left is part of the problem.

White Nationalists and Nazi's are far RIGHT. Your are simply parroting the Trump approach of saying your enemies are responsible for what you do.
Were the Nazis Socialists?

Although the terms “left” and “right” as used in American politics can be somewhat less than perspicuous, they are helpful in delineating the basic ideological divide between liberalism/progressivism (as embodied mainly by the Democratic Party) on one side (“the left”), and conservatism/traditionalism (as embodied mainly by the Republican Party) on the other (“the right”). Seen as a spectrum or continuum of ideologies, socialism/communism traditionally falls on the far left end of this scale, nationalism/fascism on the far right.

The plain truth, writes Historian Richard J. Evans in The Coming of the Third Reich, was that Hitler and his party saw socialism, communism, and leftism generally as inimical to everything they hoped to achieve:

 

[Yeshua1]

White Nationalists and Nazi's are far RIGHT. Your are simply parroting the Trump approach of saying your enemies are responsible for what you do.
Were the Nazis Socialists?

Although the terms “left” and “right” as used in American politics can be somewhat less than perspicuous, they are helpful in delineating the basic ideological divide between liberalism/progressivism (as embodied mainly by the Democratic Party) on one side (“the left”), and conservatism/traditionalism (as embodied mainly by the Republican Party) on the other (“the right”). Seen as a spectrum or continuum of ideologies, socialism/communism traditionally falls on the far left end of this scale, nationalism/fascism on the far right.

The plain truth, writes Historian Richard J. Evans in The Coming of the Third Reich, was that Hitler and his party saw socialism, communism, and leftism generally as inimical to everything they hoped to achieve:

the liberalism of say a John Kennedy from back then would be far right now in the dem party, as even president Obama suspect to them for being a liberal!

 

[StefanM]

So it is ok for us to uphold laws that God already stated are sinful?

I don't think it's that straightforward. I think abortion should be illegal because it is the taking of human life, and the government has a responsibility to protect that life.

On matters where the role of government isn't as clear, we really run into difficult questions.

Regardless of what one believes on the other major cultural issues of the day, think about this:

If you support religious freedom, then you support law that protects the right of others to sin. Any religious organization that rejects Christ is inherently sinful. Protecting the right of such organizations to exist is a protection of sinful acts, at least on some level. Furthermore, if tax exemption is a factor, you can even argue that these sinful acts are indirectly subsidized.

I don't say this to argue that government shouldn't "regulate morality." Regulating morality is a fundamental component of law. My point is simply that the issue is much more complicated than it may initially appear.

 

[Yeshua1]

I don't think it's that straightforward. I think abortion should be illegal because it is the taking of human life, and the government has a responsibility to protect that life.

On matters where the role of government isn't as clear, we really run into difficult questions.

Regardless of what one believes on the other major cultural issues of the day, think about this:

If you support religious freedom, then you support law that protects the right of others to sin. Any religious organization that rejects Christ is inherently sinful. Protecting the right of such organizations to exist is a protection of sinful acts, at least on some level. Furthermore, if tax exemption is a factor, you can even argue that these sinful acts are indirectly subsidized.

I don't say this to argue that government shouldn't "regulate morality." Regulating morality is a fundamental component of law. My point is simply that the issue is much more complicated than it may initially appear.

good point, but my main concern is that Christians ourselves cannot be in the position to reject the teaching of God on moral issues! Even if the Supreme Court says abortion and gay weddings legal, we still need to affirm still sin in sight of God!