Monergistic ETERNAL Salvation

[atpollard]

[2 Timothy 1:8-11 NASB95]

Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord or of me His prisoner, but join with me in suffering for the gospel according to the power of God, who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was granted us in Christ Jesus from all eternity, but now has been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel, for which I was appointed a preacher and an apostle and a teacher.​

How many times, in how many ways, must God tell us it is 100% Him and 0% us before we believe it?

 

[SavedByGrace]

No. One cannot work out a salvation one has not yet received. The purpose of the salvation is to have the works, Ephesians 2:10.

This working out of salvation is after the sinner is saved. Not for salvation

 

[Dr. Bob]

If God needs us in order to for us to get saved, then we need to keep ourselves saved too.

Makes perfect "false doctrine sense". I taught college and university logic classes and if/then is not hard to understand.

But don't confuse the lad. He has already demonstrated a loose grip at understanding the meaning of words like "work".

 

[Dr. Bob]

[2 Timothy 1:8-11 NASB95]How many times, in how many ways, must God tell us it is 100% Him and 0% us before we believe it?

Anyone dependent on his OWN work added to God's work for salvation can NEVER accept that, brother. Beating head against a wall, sadly. I keep trying to answer so that a weak Christian stopping here will not be duped into the works-salvation of synergism (man AND God) false teaching.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Makes perfect "false doctrine sense". I taught college and university logic classes and if/then is not hard to understand.

But don't confuse the lad. He has already demonstrated a loose grip at understanding the meaning of words like "work".

This Word of God, which is of much more Greater Value than what you say, is very clear, "Then God saw their WORKS, that they turned from their evil way (REPENTED); and God relented from the disaster that He had said He would bring upon them, and He did not do it." Jonah 3:10

מַעֲשֶׂה, is "deeds works that are done"

LXX, "ἔργον", deeds, actions, work

What you FAIL to grasp, is that this WORK is not MERIT as in EARNING, but "TURNING FROM THEIR EVIL WAYS", in direct response to Gods Demands through the Prophet Jonah

When those who were CONVICTED (cut to the heart) by the Holy Spirit, in Acts chapter 2, after hearing Peter preach, they responded, "what must we DO?" (37). Peter did not say, "DO nothing"; but REPENT.

In Acts 16:30-31 we read

"And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I DO to be saved?” So they said, “BELIEVE on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

So what you taught your students was a FALSE gospel!

 

[SavedByGrace]

Anyone dependent on his OWN work added to God's work for salvation can NEVER accept that, brother. Beating head against a wall, sadly. I keep trying to answer so that a weak Christian stopping here will not be duped into the works-salvation of synergism (man AND God) false teaching.

more rubbish from someone who is supposed to be a teacher of the Bible!

I have NEVER said that a sinner can EARN or MERIT their salvation, REPENTING and FAITH is what Jesus Christ COMMANDED from anyone who wants to go to heaven. This has been made into a "WORK", by those DELUDED by their theology, and their rejection of what the Bible Teaches!

 

[agedman]

John 5:25

Most certainly I tell you, the hour comes, and now is, when the dead will hear the Son of God’s voice; and those who hear will live

this is talking about the spiritual dead, and not physical! Those who are spiritually dead, and who hear the gospel, and repent and believe, will live!

No, In the Scripture dead, death all mean physical ceasing to be viable.

The ONLY exception is that in Revelation in which the lake of fire is called the second death.

If you remember, upon the cross, Christ mentioned paradise. The keeping place of those already dead in which He would spend three days and night preaching to and showing the proof of Him being the Messiah in which they had looked for in their own life on earth.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Makes perfect "false doctrine sense". I taught college and university logic classes and if/then is not hard to understand.

But don't confuse the lad. He has already demonstrated a loose grip at understanding the meaning of words like "work".

so you claim to know more than the God of the Bible, who says, WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION? Just in case you cannot grasp this Great Truth, it does not say "work FOR your salvation"!

can you grasp this?

 

[SavedByGrace]

No, In the Scripture dead, death all mean physical ceasing to be viable.

The ONLY exception is that in Revelation in which the lake of fire is called the second death.

If you remember, upon the cross, Christ mentioned paradise. The keeping place of those already dead in which He would spend three days and night preaching to and showing the proof of Him being the Messiah in which they had looked for in their own life on earth.

this verse in John 5 is SPITITUAL DEATH.

 

[SavedByGrace]

You say "Believing" isn't a "work"?? "Accepting" isn't a "work"?

It is OBEYING what God has COMMANDED!

Can you not understand this very SIMPLE Truth?

 

[SavedByGrace]

So, in the false doctrine of synergistic (cooperative) salvation, if man "cooperates" with the Spirit

lets try to simplify this for you

God the Holy Spirit CONVICTS the sinner who hears the Gospel Message preached, as in Acts chapter 2, when they were CUT TO THE HEART. Now, they can RESIST this CONVICTION, as we read in Acts 7:51, "“You stiff-necked people! Your hearts and ears are still uncircumcised. You are just like your ancestors: You always RESIST the Holy Spirit!". Or, like those in Acts 2, ask, "what do we need to DO"? (37). Which is ACCEPTING the Gospel.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Perhaps understanding simple English will help: Webster #1 definition of "work" = "activity involving mental or physical effort done in order to achieve a purpose or result."

the Bible was written in Hebrew and Greek, NOT English! I have given the Hebrew and Greek for Jonah 3:10, where the KJV and others use WORK, which is exactly what it means. You can argue against the Bible is you like!

 

[agedman]

this verse in John 5 is SPITITUAL DEATH.

No, it is not. At the last judgement God raises the dead unbelieving to face the second death.

Btw, be very careful of how you post about others on the BB.

Don't dare bring some accusation against some member such as, "more rubbish from someone who is supposed to be a teacher of the Bible!"

Many of the posters (especially the moderators and administrators) have long served the Lord, and have been faithful to Him in the study and disciplining of discipleship of others. These shall have your utmost respect.

I'm not posting that if someone is biting you cannot chew back, nor am I suggesting that at times we all do not wander into the realms of inappropriate.

However, we need to be active in helping to self moderate the BB, to keep folks aware that there are many readers who never join and never contribute, some who do not have much of a background in the things of the Scriptures.

We are supposed to reflect the fruit of the Spirit on the BB. Sometimes. that is very difficult when we become exasperated or misunderstood.

Let our posts be that which is stirring up edification.

 

[SavedByGrace]

No, it is not. At the last judgement God raises the dead unbelieving to face the second death.

Btw, be very careful of how you post about others on the BB.

Don't dare bring some accusation against some member such as, "more rubbish from someone who is supposed to be a teacher of the Bible!"

Many of the posters (especially the moderators and administrators) have long served the Lord, and have been faithful to Him in the study and disciplining of discipleship of others. These shall have your utmost respect.

I'm not posting that if someone is biting you cannot chew back, nor am I suggesting that at times we all do not wander into the realms of inappropriate.

However, we need to be active in helping to self moderate the BB, to keep folks aware that there are many readers who never join and never contribute, some who do not have much of a background in the things of the Scriptures.

We are supposed to reflect the fruit of the Spirit on the BB. Sometimes. that is very difficult when we become exasperated or misunderstood.

Let our posts be that which is stirring up edification.

Before you post nonsense, why don't you read what DR Bob has written about what I have said? Just because he cannot understand what the Bible says on this, does not mean that he can say silly things, and I not respond. So, yeah, I do dare!

 

[SavedByGrace]

No, it is not. At the last judgement God raises the dead unbelieving to face the second death

if you say so, that is your opinion.

 

[agedman]

the Bible was written in Hebrew and Greek, NOT English! I have given the Hebrew and Greek for Jonah 3:10, where the KJV and others use WORK, which is exactly what it means. You can argue against the Bible is you like!

I suppose one could also use Jonah 3:10 to show that God doesn't really know all things, nor does He perceive the end from the beginning because He "changed His mind."

Be careful to not attempt to build doctrine upon single verse statements taken out of context. But you know this.

Nineveh, really isn't much of an example of how work must be done to delay the wrath of God. For God did actually destroy Nineveh for their repentance was not long lasting. None is without the direct working of the Holy Spirit.

 

[SavedByGrace]

I suppose one could also use Jonah 3:10 to show that God doesn't really know all things, nor does He perceive the end from the beginning because He "changed His mind."

Be careful to not attempt to build doctrine upon single verse statements taken out of context. But you know this.

Nineveh, really isn't much of an example of how work must be done to delay the wrath of God. For God did actually destroy Nineveh for their repentance was not long lasting. None is without the direct working of the Holy Spirit.

God did not "change His Mind". He never does

He told Jonah to preach the Gospel to these wicked people, because He desired that they would get saved. Jonah at first refused and ran away. God did not let this go, as He had a Work to be taken care of. Jonah did go back and warn the people of Nineveh, that God was about to destroy them. The BELIEVED God as it says, and then REPENTED in sackcloth and ashes. When God saw what they DID, in that they turned from the wicked ways in repentance, He did not destroy them, but saved them.

This Book of Jonah is a wonderful account of the Great Love and Mercy that God has for ALL SINNERS, that these people were not Jews and therefore no "elect". Clear evidence that God desires the entire human race to be saved.

 

[AustinC]

God did not "change His Mind". He never does

He told Jonah to preach the Gospel to these wicked people, because He desired that they would get saved. Jonah at first refused and ran away. God did not let this go, as He had a Work to be taken care of. Jonah did go back and warn the people of Nineveh, that God was about to destroy them. The BELIEVED God as it says, and then REPENTED in sackcloth and ashes. When God saw what they DID, in that they turned from the wicked ways in repentance, He did not destroy them, but saved them.

This Book of Jonah is a wonderful account of the Great Love and Mercy that God has for ALL SINNERS, that these people were not Jews and therefore no "elect". Clear evidence that God desires the entire human race to be saved.

Were all these Ninevites redeemed by faith in the coming Promised One?

No, they were not. But, they were spared being killed by decree of God at that moment. There is a difference between eternal salvation and temporal salvation from God's immediate wrath.

 

[Van]

5 pages of Calvinist denial of the monergism of scripture. But the drum beats on...

 

[atpollard]

5 pages of Calvinist denial of the monergism of scripture. But the drum beats on...