Obama Endorses Mosque Project Near Ground Zero Site

[Earth Wind and Fire]

. I would defend their right to build this with my life if need be.

You would? Now don"t say that. This is being done to aggregative & anyone who doesn't know it is not thinking with their heads.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

You would? Now don"t say that. This is being done to aggregative & anyone who doesn't know it is not thinking with their heads.

If you read my entire post you would see that I do understand.

That however does not mean that I would not die to defend freedom of religion for all Americans. If it is taken from one group no one's right would be safe.

 

[Scarlett O.]

It will not be on the ground where "it happened".

Ken, here is a link from CNN that shows a map of the surrounding areas that were affected by the terrorist act of 9-11.

http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/damage.map.html

As you can see, there was structural damage to buildings far from ground-zero. If you were to ask the people who own these buildings or who were at work in those buildings that day if their building is/was where "it happened", you might not get a whole-hearted "yes", but you aren't going to get a whole-hearted "no" either.

The mosque in question is only two and a half blocks away from ground zero. It's definitely in the circle of surrounding areas that also received damage. And it's absolutely in the circle of surrounding areas that all Amercans perceive as where "it happened".

Okay, so you folks complaining know you can't stop it from being built, and you don't want to stop it from being built because you believe in property rights. Right? If so, then we agree.

Yes, everyone here at the Baptist Board knows that there is nothing that we or anyone can do to stop this from happening. Don't think us to be idiots. We know that there will be a Muslim community center and mosque built exactly where they want it to be built.

You are all about supporting these people's property rights.

Well, do not deny the people here the right to oppose the selection of the site because we feel that it is improper, insensitive, carelessly thought out, and for propaganda's sake only.

To keep silent, wring our hands, and to just gutlessly take it where it hurts because we know that we can't infringe on anyone's "property rights" is absurd.

Making this issue about property rights is like making rape victim's case about the predator's sexual needs. It's like taking the Titanic tragedy and making all about the free speech rights of the young man who neglected to wire for help quickly enough.

For the Muslims in the American and all around the world who supported what happened on 9-11, they will be having victory celebrations and you know it. This is purely for propaganda only.

And I will not step down from my opinion about this merely because those Muslims have "property rights".

Yes, they have property rights. But do you REALLY believe that those property right supercede the bigger picture here?

 

[sag38]

Thank you Scarlet.

 

[rbell]

The point is clear. It is not a matter of whether or not they have a right to do this - they do,and freedom of religion is sacrosanct. I would defend their right to build this with my life if need be.

The placement and the timing are the issue

It is bad form, as some one said.
It is cold.
It is insensitive
It is hurtful
It is knowingly offensive
It is 'in your face'

This is hardly what we hear about how wonderful American Islam is. This shows the true face of a religious group who pretend to be part of mainstream America.

Shameful. Let them go ahead and build, but don't cry when Americans don't fall in line to support them.

Home run.

And I'll keep complaining...even though it makes me appear less "enlightened." I can't use the force of the state to stop it (and wouldn't if I could)...but I can point out that these goons aren't the least bit interested in "dialogue" or "tolerance" or whatever the feel-good buzzword of the day is. Those who believe them are gullible--and that's being very kind.

 

[HankD]

If you were a relative, how far would it have to be?

Saudi Arabia.

HankD

 

[HankD]

You dont need a PhD in meteorology to know that a storm of violence is brewing over this and that is exactly the desired outcome.

HankD

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

If you read my entire post you would see that I do understand.

That however does not mean that I would not die to defend freedom of religion for all Americans. If it is taken from one group no one's right would be safe.

I would invite you down to the City since you are in NY State to see the unavailing of this abomination. You would be there to stop me from being the 1st to urinate on the side of the building. Im sure there will be lines out to Jersey & LI for that act of civil disobedience.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

I would invite you down to the City since you are in NY State to see the unavailing of this abomination. You would be there to stop me from being the 1st to urinate on the side of the building. Im sure there will be lines out to Jersey & LI for that act of civil disobedience.

Google Eire to see where I am.

These people have every right in the world to build this. Freedom of religion means freedom. While I think this is a shameful act, I would hate to see America start robbing religious freedom because the majority doesn't like it. Once that precedent is set no one's rights are safe.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

I would invite you down to the City since you are in NY State to see the unavailing of this abomination. You would be there to stop me from being the 1st to urinate on the side of the building. Im sure there will be lines out to Jersey & LI for that act of civil disobedience.

BTW I am sure your Christ honouring response to this building will do much to draw men to the Saviour.

 

[targus]

Google Eire to see where I am.

These people have every right in the world to build this. Freedom of religion means freedom. While I think this is a shameful act, I would hate to see America start robbing religious freedom because the majority doesn't like it. Once that precedent is set no one's rights are safe.

How is expressing one's freedom of speech against this community/prayer center robbing anyone of their religious freedom?

I would hate to see America start robbing someone of their freedom of speech because the minority doesn't like it.

Once that precedent is set no one's rights are safe.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

How is expressing one's freedom of speech against this community/prayer center robbing anyone of their religious freedom?

I would hate to see America start robbing someone of their freedom of speech because the minority doesn't like it.

Once that precedent is set no one's rights are safe.

We must be on two different planets. If you read my posts you will see that I have clearly expressed my disapproval.

I would hate to see them legally prevented or restricted from doing so.

 

[targus]

We must be on two different planets. If you read my posts you will see that I have clearly expressed my disapproval.

I would hate to see them legally prevented or restricted from doing so.

If they were prevented by legal means - what would be the problem?

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

If they were prevented by legal means - what would be the problem?

Okay. Poorly worded on my part. Pardon my ignorance.

I would never support seeing their constitutional freedom of religion restricted, even by any means no matter how I feel personally about the matter.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Remember, whatever means used here to stop this may one day be used against your church.

 

[targus]

Remember, whatever means used here to stop this may one day be used against your church.

There are already restrictions on churches.

Many communities restrict the building of churches to areas other than residential areas.

Many communities require a certain number of handicap parking spaces for a church of a particular size.

Many communities have height restrictions on buildings.

Are you proposing that there be no restrictions on churches such as the above just because they are churches.

How about door to door evangelizing at 3 in the morning?

Would you be against restrictions limiting that?

If those sort of restrictions would apply to this mosque - shouldn't the local community have the right to see that the mosque is not built in violation of their existing regulations.

Do they have to just roll over because in this case it is a muslim building?

 

[FR7 Baptist]

If they were prevented by legal means - what would be the problem?

First and Fourteenth Amendments to the Constitution.

 

[targus]

First and Fourteenth Amendments to the Constitution.

If they violate the Consititution - then they would not be legal would they?

Is every single activity protected by the 1st and 14th amendments?

How about child sacrifice?

That would be a restriction on someone's religion no doubt.

Does the 1st and 14th amendment protect that too under the name of religious freedom?

Some issues require thought and not just some reflexive response.

 

[Dragoon68]

Why do the Muslims what to build a mosque at this particular location?

Do they own the land on which it would be built?

Are there any deed restrictions or zoning ordinances prohibiting it?

Why should the President of the United States actively endorse it?

 

[Dragoon68]

... Some issues require thought and no just some reflexive response.

Agreed! We are too quick to hang an argument on one article of the Constitution just as we are to hang it on one verse of scripture.