Ok so I'm Reformed in my beliefs now.

[timothy27]

Here you go Brother Bob, examples of children at church being preached to....

Ephesians 6
1Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. 2"Honor your father and mother" (this is the first commandment with a promise), 3"that it may go well with you and that you may live long in the land."

Colossians 3:20 (English Standard Version)
20Children, obey your parents in everything, for this pleases the Lord.

So my point proven there were obviously children at the churches. Since they were there they are under the same expectations.

I am looking forward to how you are going to spin this one.

 

[Brother Bob]

tim;
Why do you have to preach to adults then? My argument don't hold up, it is yours that don't hold up. Cut it anyway you want and you are implying that children, aborted some are in Hell!!! I don't believe one word of that and never will for Adam's sin brought the natural death and second death on himself if he didn't repent. Our sins bring the second death and where there is no law there is no sin and don't tell me you walk up to an aborted child, a small child and start preaching to it you must be born again and it will have any idea what you are trying to say. In your believe then because it couldn't understand it goes to Hell. You still didn't answer the question where in the Bible does it teach preaching to children and where in the Bible does it teach children repenting? Aborted in garbage cans and then have to go to Hell too, man I would not have that in no circumstances. God help us,

Neither one of those Scriptures talked about repenting of sin, how desperate can you get. Also say to not spare the rod and I am sure when the rod is being used they make some sounds too, does that count as repenting in your belief.

Could you honestly look at a small child and believe it was hell bound or and aborted child you find in a dump?

BTW, we all are children of someone.

I choose 1

 

[timothy27]

I already answered, Ephesians 6:1 and Colossians 3:20. As always you are not listening and are jumping to conclusions. I never said children ARE in hell I said they SHOULD be in hell, two very different meanings in those words Bob. Why should they? Because they are sinful from birth, why aren't they because of God's character.

 

[Brother Bob]

tim;
According to God's Law they should not be in hell for He did not impute sin where there was no law unless you teach the aborted, little children not to commit adultery and they have any idea what you talking about. I place that in the garbage can where the aborted child is and carry it to the arms of Jesus.

 

[Brother Bob]

Man, I think God I have never looked a small child in the face and had thoughts that it was a sinner and going to hell. No thanks anyway,

 

[timothy27]

Sorry your "thoughts" keep you from accepting the truth. David in Pslams says he was sinful from birth. Explain that one. That would mean he was sinful about things that he did not understand. You are also misinformed about what the child is sinful about. The child is not punished because the mother committed adultery the child is sinful because Adam sinned. There are things the child knows about God.


"looked a small child in the face and had thoughts that it was a sinner and going to hell."
Above by Bob

Once again I did not say ARE I said SHOULD.

 

[timothy27]

Those scriptures give commandments that are to be followed, the churches did teach repentance and once again the children being at the church would have heard about repentance. If you want to argue that those children are infants and can't understand go ahead, God can give them special understanding, if need be. You still have to prove an age of accountability that will prove they do not have to "choose" salvation at infancy. For if you believe as you do, infants would still have to make a choice about something they do not inderstand.

 

[Jarthur001]

Originally posted by MRCoon:
Ok so if I understand this right then aborted babies are in heaven because they are predestined for it? Then why are we so offended by abortion? What is so wrong with abortion if it is sending souls to heaven? Or are these souls going to hell? Then we should see many more protesting this practice. Or does it matter since Abortion is of the Will of God and we need to convince Christians to stop protesting it??

I wrote a long reply to your post, but I deleted it for I want you to see something greater.

1) Let me start by saying..you read other things INTO my post. This is what I said...Salvation is in Gods hands.

2) Now, I may be wrong , but by going by your post you seem to think that aborted babies go to hell, so this is the reason why we must STOP abortion. Is this true?

If so...why?

In Christ..James

 

[npetreley]

Originally posted by Brother Bob:
Man, I think God I have never looked a small child in the face and had thoughts that it was a sinner and going to hell. No thanks anyway,

I thank God that He doesn't care what you or I think when it comes to making such decisions. As I said, I personally THINK God will have mercy on babies and the unborn. But I KNOW that whatever decision God makes is the right one. And I'm not so foolish as to think that my opinion of what God should do makes any difference.

 

[Jarthur001]

Originally posted by Brother Bob:

Could you honestly look at a small child and believe it was hell bound or and aborted child you find in a dump?

BTW, we all are children of someone.

I choose 1 [/QB]

Hello Bob,

Can you honestly look at a small child and tell them they do not need Christ? Can you honestly tell them that they were saved in the womb? Drop your feelings and tell me what the Bible says.

 

[timothy27]

Drop your feelings and tell me what the Bible says.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jarthur, I have been trying to tell him the same thing for the last 5 posts!!!

 

[Brother Bob]

Matthew, chapter 19

"13": Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.

"14": But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

"15": And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence.

Luke, chapter 18
15": And they brought unto him also infants, that he would touch them: but when his disciples saw it, they rebuked them.

"16": But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Already are children of God if you don't take it away James and Tim.


Mark, chapter 10


13": And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them.

"14": But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Already are the Kingdom of God

Romans, chapter 9

"11": (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth

Abortion and yes I can look them in the eye and tell them when they are old enough to understand they will know they are sinners. What about the Aborted, how you going to look them in the eye. nept; that is three times you have said you don't believe little children go to hell if they are sinners I wonder why? James; NO!! I will not drop my feelings for that is how you communicate with the Spirit.

 

[npetreley]

nept; that is three times you have said you don't believe little children go to hell if they are sinners I wonder why?

I didn't say little children. I said babies and the unborn. Not that it makes that much of a difference, since you don't specify ages, but please don't put words in my mouth.

I can keep saying it if you like. But I also keep saying that my belief is personal, not Biblical. Your quotes do not prove children go to heaven. They only prove that "such as these" go to heaven. "Such as these" describes the simplicity with which children tend to trust and believe, vs. how we grow colder and more stubborn with age.

I have also stated repeatedly that if I find out I'm wrong, then so be it. God knows what He is doing. If God has foreordained that only the elect among children, babies, and unborn go to heaven, and the rest all go to hell, then let God be true and every man (and every man's "feelings") be a liar. If that is what God has ordained, who are you, and who am I to disagree? Feelings be damned. God is true, no matter what He decides to do.

By the way, my name is Nicholas Petreley, and my handle is npetreley. The short version would be npet, not nept.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Originally posted by npetreley:

By the way, my name is Nicholas Petreley, and my handle is npetreley. The short version would be npet, not nept.

Yeah, Nicholas, that is an unfortunate transposition of letters. Looks like you were being called "inept".

 

[Jarthur001]

Originally posted by Brother Bob:


... yes I can look them in the eye and tell them when they are old enough to understand they will know they are sinners. What about the Aborted, how you going to look them in the eye. nept; that is three times you have said you don't believe little children go to hell if they are sinners I wonder why? James; NO!! I will not drop my feelings for that is how you communicate with the Spirit. [/QB]

Hello Bob..

You said...
that is three times you have said you don't believe little children go to hell if they are sinners I wonder why? James

Well...i disagree with this statement and I will show you why shortly..but nonetheless..

You are lossing me. State your case very clear.

Is the child in the womb a sinner that needs to be saved...or is he saved already?

 

[timothy27]

Already addressed those verse in a previous post. You are taking them out of context. He does not rebuke the disciples because children are innocent he rebukes them because only Christ has the right to command who he wants to come to Him. It has nothing to do with the nature of the children.


Then you want to use Romans 9 that in context is refering to whom shall the promise(salvation) go to. It went to Jacob and not Esau, and when was the choice made? Before they were born. Using that verse does not strengthen your argument.

 

[Jarthur001]

Originally posted by Brother Bob:

Already are children of God if you don't take it away James and Tim.

I'm sorry I overlooked this line by you Bob. Before I go forward let me make sure I understand you right. Are you saying that all Children are saved?

In Christ..James

 

[Brother Bob]

npet;
Sorry about the name, I caught it once before myself but made a mistake, pray you will forgive me.
Now, your personally belief is that if babies die they go to Heaven if I understood you right. I know you go on and say if its different its ok with you but "your personally belief is that babies go to Heaven". If so, are they all the "elect".

James;
My belief, is the child in the womb saved, is yes. I know you will come up with some cases but I will give you one.

Romans, chapter 9

"11": (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth

Now I ask you, are the aborted children saved or lost? Also, I said that to npet; "had said that three times," not you. I don't remember for sure if you said it or not but think you or tim; one said it.

Also, yes I am saying all children are saved with the exception of some you are going to quote now in the womb but that was the exception for a reason. Jesus said; "such is the Kingdom", who am I to argue with the Lord?

 

[npetreley]

Originally posted by Brother Bob:
npet;
Now, your personally belief is that if children die they go to Heaven if I understood you right. I know you go on and say if its different its ok with you but "your personally belief is that babies go to Heaven". If so, are they all the "elect".

IF, in fact, all the unborn and people who die as babies go to heaven, then yes, they are elect. Are they elect because they died unborn or as babies? No. They were among the elect from before the beginning of time, and for reasons only known to God, God foreordained that they would die unborn or as babies.

But we're getting into so much speculation here that it seems rather silly to me. Neither you nor I really know the fate of the unborn or babies who die as babies. We have our opinions, and our opinions happen to agree, at least in part. But they're only opinions. We'll find out someday what the truth is, and we'll be satisfied with that truth, whatever it is, because it comes from God.

 

[Brother Bob]

So, the little babies that have died by being drowned by their mother, aborted by their mother and doctors and every baby that has died from the beginning of time were all "elect". What a cruel thing for God to bring upon the elect.

The reason I get into it is because it puts your belief in a light that don't shine to bright.