Old folks who think they love old things

[Luke2427]

Facts?? AIDS was first clinically observed in 1981.
Most of the other things you mention have direct relation to American history. I am Canadian. It wasn't until 1996 that prayer in the public schools was challenged based on the charter of rights and freedom of religion. That was in B.C. It was in 1988 in Ontario. Every province is different.
I wasn't too concerned about it. I never did favor having unsaved people leading prayers for unsaved individuals. The children of the devil praying for other children of the devil inoculating them against Biblical Christianity especially when using the Lord's Prayer in such hypocrisy.

[FONT=&quot]They could do what they wanted. I vowed never to send my children to a public school. I would either send them to a private Christian school or home-school them.[/FONT]

Then you don't even have a dog in this fight.

I am not talking about Canadian culture. I am talking about American culture.

 

[DHK]

Then you don't even have a dog in this fight.

I am not talking about Canadian culture. I am talking about American culture.

Here are the facts:
You were way off on AIDS. You said, "In the 60's and 70's."
I know where I was and what I was doing during those years. In 1979 (the last year of the 70's) you were four years old! You don't remember those years. Again, let me repeat, the first clinical case of AIDS was reported in 1981. Your "facts" are way off.

As for schools, whether American or Canadian, You ought to be concerned about Christian schools not educational institutions where Humanism is the underlying religion of all the schools, and secularism the main philosophy. The advocacy of prayer by pagans in public schools is not a good idea.

I think you have much of your priorities in the wrong place.
American never has been, and is not a "Christian" nation. It is secular and multi-cultural. If you have five children you need to be concerned about the quality of education they get--hopefully a good Christian education, and not one from the failing public school system. Whether or not they have prayer in the school is totally irrelevant.

 

[Luke2427]

Here are the facts:
You were way off on AIDS. You said, "In the 60's and 70's."
I know where I was and what I was doing during those years. In 1979 (the last year of the 70's) you were four years old! You don't remember those years. Again, let me repeat, the first clinical case of AIDS was reported in 1981. Your "facts" are way off.

I cannot believe you are so unthoughtful that you cannot put two and two together!

So you are saying that because the first time the disease was CALLED AIDS was 1981 that is was not UNTIL 1981 that the disease existed???

ARE YOU SERIOUS?!?!?!

Here DHK: not that you are going to get it...

The virus may have been present in the United States as early as 1966,[191] but the vast majority of infections occurring outside sub-Saharan Africa (including the U.S.) can be traced back to a single unknown individual who became infected with HIV in Haiti and then brought the infection to the United States some time around 1969.[192] The epidemic then rapidly spread among high-risk groups (initially, sexually promiscuous men who have sex with men). By 1978, the prevalence of HIV-1 among gay male residents of New York and San Francisco was estimated at 5%, suggesting that several thousand individuals in the country had been infected.[192]
Society and culture

 

[DHK]

I cannot believe you are so unthoughtful that you cannot put two and two together!

So you are saying that because the first time the disease was CALLED AIDS was 1981 that is was not UNTIL 1981 that the disease existed???

ARE YOU SERIOUS?!?!?!

Here DHK: not that you are going to get it...

I clicked on your link Luke. This is what it says:

AIDS was first clinically observed in 1981 in the United States.[22] The initial cases were a cluster of injecting drug users and homosexual men with no known cause of impaired immunity who showed symptoms of Pneumocystis carinii pneumonia (PCP), a rare opportunistic infection that was known to occur in people with very compromised immune systems.

 

[Luke2427]

I clicked on your link Luke. This is what it says:

Yes, and it also said:

The epidemic then rapidly spread among high-risk groups (initially, sexually promiscuous men who have sex with men). By 1978, the prevalence of HIV-1 among gay male residents of New York and San Francisco was estimated at 5%, suggesting that several thousand individuals in the country had been infected.

It literally says EPIDEMIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like I said, I knew you would not get it.

 

[DHK]

Yes, and it also said:

The epidemic then rapidly spread among high-risk groups (initially, sexually promiscuous men who have sex with men). By 1978, the prevalence of HIV-1 among gay male residents of New York and San Francisco was estimated at 5%, suggesting that several thousand individuals in the country had been infected.

It literally says EPIDEMIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like I said, I knew you would not get it.

Your "facts" are wrong!
Where do you get your goofy information from.
Do you even remember that 2011 was celebrated as "30 years of AIDS"?
Here is a more official site and article to jog your memory:

http://www.aids.gov/news-and-events/thirty-years-of-aids/

It is far more reliable than Wikipedia.

 

[Luke2427]

Your "facts" are wrong!
Where do you get your goofy information from.
Do you even remember that 2011 was celebrated as "30 years of AIDS"?
Here is a more official site and article to jog your memory:

http://www.aids.gov/news-and-events/thirty-years-of-aids/

It is far more reliable than Wikipedia.

Dhk you cannot be this backwards!

The epidemic began in the mid sixties and was so vast by the late seventies that 5percent of the male populations of San Francisco and New York were infected!!!

It was NAMED in 1981. It started in mid sixties and became an "EPIDEMIC" in the seventies.

These are facts.

You seem to have a hard time with those things.

 

[DHK]

Dhk you cannot be this backwards!

The epidemic began in the mid sixties and was so vast by the late seventies that 5percent of the male populations of San Francisco and New York were infected!!!

It was NAMED in 1981. It started in mid sixties and became an "EPIDEMIC" in the seventies.

These are facts.

You seem to have a hard time with those things.

No I don't, Luke, and I have given you the facts and sites to prove you wrong. But you don't like to admit you are wrong. I was in school in the sixties. There was no such thing as AIDS. It was never taught, mentioned or heard of. It was non-existent (unless it existed in the scientific community).
I was in college in the 70's. It was still non-existent. No one knew about it, talked about it, etc.
I have given you enough information to show that you are wrong.
I know that you are wrong.
2011 was celebrated/mourned as 30 years of AIDS.
I don't need to discuss this any further. Besides it is off topic.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

That's excellent.

Where do you get it?

Either a good farm supply or you can order it on line...my wife was getting it from a place in Texas.

 

[Luke2427]

No I don't, Luke, and I have given you the facts and sites to prove you wrong. But you don't like to admit you are wrong. I was in school in the sixties. There was no such thing as AIDS. It was never taught, mentioned or heard of. It was non-existent (unless it existed in the scientific community).
I was in college in the 70's. It was still non-existent. No one knew about it, talked about it, etc.
I have given you enough information to show that you are wrong.
I know that you are wrong.
2011 was celebrated/mourned as 30 years of AIDS.
I don't need to discuss this any further. Besides it is off topic.

It is off topic and you drug it there but the fact remains that the disease that came to be known as aids in 1981 or so was already a full blown epidemic by 1978.

You would argue with a post.

 

[Crabtownboy]

It is off topic and you drug it there but the fact remains that the disease that came to be known as aids in 1981 or so was already a full blown epidemic by 1978.

Luke, you are incorrect in your statement.

History of spread

Main article: Timeline of early AIDS cases
[edit]1959: David Carr
David Carr was an apprentice printer (usually referred to, mistakenly, as a sailor; Carr had served in the Navy between 1955 and 1957) from Manchester, England who died in October 1959 following the failure of his immune system; he succumbed to pneumonia. Doctors, baffled by what he had died from, preserved 50 of his tissue samples for inspection. In 1990, the tissues were found to be HIV-positive. However, in 1992, a second test by AIDS researcher David Ho found that the strain of HIV present in the tissues was similar to those found in 1990 rather than an earlier strain (which would have mutated considerably over the course of 30 years). He concluded that the DNA samples provided actually came from a 1990 AIDS patient. Upon retesting David Carr's tissues, he found no sign of the virus.[42]
[edit]1959: Congolese man
One of the earliest documented HIV-1 infections was discovered in a preserved blood sample taken in 1959 from a man from Leopoldville, Belgian Congo (now Kinshasa, Democratic Republic of the Congo).[43] However, it is unknown whether this anonymous person ever developed AIDS and died of its complications.[43]
[edit]1960: Congolese woman
A second early documented HIV-1 infection was discovered in a preserved lymph node biopsy sample taken in 1960 from a woman from Leopoldville, Belgian Congo.[15]
[edit]1969: Robert Rayford
Main article: Robert Rayford
In May 1969 a 15-year-old African-American male named Robert Rayford died at the St. Louis City Hospital from Kaposi's Sarcoma. In 1987 researchers at Tulane University School of Medicine detected "a virus closely related or identical to"[44] HIV-1 in his preserved blood and tissues. The doctors who worked on his case at the time suspected he was a prostitute, though the patient did not discuss his sexual history with them in detail.[44][45][46][47][48]
[edit]1969: Arvid Noe
Main article: Arvid Noe
In 1976, a Norwegian sailor, with the alias name Arvid Noe, his wife, and his nine-year-old daughter died of AIDS. The sailor had first presented symptoms in 1969, eight years after he first spent time in ports along the West African coastline. A gonorrhea infection during his first African voyage shows he was sexually active at this time. Tissue samples from the sailor and his wife were tested in 1988 and found to contain HIV-1 (Group O).[49][50]
[edit]Spread to the western hemisphere
HIV-1 strains are thought to have arrived in the United States from Haiti in the late 1960s or early 1970s.[51][52] HIV-1 is believed to have arrived in Haiti from central Africa, possibly through professional contacts with the Democratic Republic of the Congo.[53] The current consensus is that HIV was introduced to Haiti by an unknown individual or individuals who contracted it while working in the Democratic Republic of the Congo circa 1966, or from another person who worked there during that time.[52] A mini-epidemic followed, and, circa 1969, yet another unknown individual brought HIV from Haiti to the United States. The vast majority of cases of AIDS outside sub-Saharan Africa can be traced back to that single patient[51] (although numerous unrelated incidents of AIDS among Haitian immigrants to the U.S. were recorded in the early 1980s, and, as evidenced by the case of Robert Rayford, isolated incidents of this infection may have been occurring as early as 1966.) The virus eventually entered male gay communities in large United States cities, where a combination of sexual promiscuity (with individuals reportedly averaging over 11 unprotected sexual partners per year[54]) and relatively high transmission rates associated with anal intercourse[55] allowed it spread explosively enough to finally be noticed.[51]
Because of the long incubation period of HIV (up to a decade or longer) before symptoms of AIDS appear, and because of the initially low incidence, HIV was not noticed at first. By the time the first reported cases of AIDS were found in large United States cities, the prevalence of HIV infection in some communities had passed 5%.[56] Worldwide, HIV infection has spread from urban to rural areas, and has appeared in regions such as China and India.
[edit]Canadian flight attendant theory
Main article: Gaëtan Dugas
A Canadian airline steward named Gaëtan Dugas was referred to as "Patient 0" in an early AIDS study by Dr. William Darrow of the Centers for Disease Control. Because of this, many people had considered Dugas to be responsible for bringing HIV to North America. This is not accurate, however, as HIV had spread long before Dugas began his career. This rumor may have started with Randy Shilts' 1987 book And the Band Played On (and the movie based on it, in which Dugas is referred to as AIDS' Patient Zero), but neither the book nor the movie state that he had been the first to bring the virus to North America. He was called "Patient Zero" because at least 40 of the 248 people known to be infected by HIV in 1983 had had sex with him, or with someone who had sexual intercourse with him.
[edit]1981: From GRID to AIDS
The AIDS epidemic officially began on June 5, 1981, when the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in its Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report newsletter reported unusual clusters of Pneumocystis pneumonia (PCP) caused by a form of Pneumocystis carinii (now recognized as a distinct species Pneumocystis jirovecii) in five homosexual men in Los Angeles.[57]
Over the next 18 months, more PCP clusters were discovered among otherwise healthy men in cities throughout the country, along with other opportunistic diseases (such as Kaposi's sarcoma[58] and persistent, generalized lymphadenopathy[59]), common in immunosuppressed patients.
In June 1982, a report of a group of cases amongst gay men in Southern California suggested that a sexually transmitted infectious agent might be the etiological agent,[60] and the syndrome was initially termed "GRID", or gay-related immune deficiency.[61]
Health authorities soon realized that nearly half of the people identified with the syndrome were not homosexual men. The same opportunistic infections were also reported among hemophiliacs,[62] heterosexual intravenous drug users, and Haitian immigrants—leading some researchers to call it the "4H" disease.[63][64]
By August 1982, the disease was being referred to by its new CDC-coined name: Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome (AIDS).[65]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_HIV/AIDS#History_of_spread

 

[Roberta]

Truth. I left an IFB church last year (left the entire 'movement' actually) and that was a common saying. "I'm not changing from the old ways!" "Stay on the old paths!" I got sick of it. A friend of mine on FB who is still in the church posts just about every week how he's an "old fashioned IFB" apparently he fails to realize IFB has only existed for less than 100 years...

What is IFB?

 

[TCassidy]

I agree, as already stated by another poster, this entire thread, with a few exceptions, is a disgrace to the Name of Christ.

Calling the "old" Christians (whoever they are) "stupid," "dumb," and suggesting they are too intractable and ignorant to know as much as you seem to think you know is far from what the bible teaches regarding our relationships with others.

1 Timothy 5:1 Do not rebuke an older man, but exhort him as a father, younger men as brothers, 2 older women as mothers, younger women as sisters, with all purity.

Let me ask the "young" people here (whoever they may be), would you talk to your father or mother the way you have talked to the "old" people on this forum?

If so, the greater shame is on you and your conduct.

 

[TCassidy]

What is IFB?

Independent - not part of a convention, denomination, or other hierarchial organization.

Fundamental - Adhering to the 5 Fundamentals of the Faith.

Baptist - Believing the Baptist distinctives.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I agree, as already stated by another poster, this entire thread, with a few exceptions, is a disgrace to the Name of Christ.

Calling the "old" Christians (whoever they are) "stupid," "dumb," and suggesting they are too intractable and ignorant to know as much as you seem to think you know is far from what the bible teaches regarding our relationships with others.

1 Timothy 5:1 Do not rebuke an older man, but exhort him as a father, younger men as brothers, 2 older women as mothers, younger women as sisters, with all purity.

Let me ask the "young" people here (whoever they may be), would you talk to your father or mother the way you have talked to the "old" people on this forum?

If so, the greater shame is on you and your conduct.

Perhaps the actual father and mother were not there and/or poor roll models to begin with.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Independent - not part of a convention, denomination, or other hierarchial organization.

Fundamental - Adhering to the 5 Fundamentals of the Faith.

Baptist - Believing the Baptist distinctives.

I don't know what the 5 fundamentals are

 

[Crabtownboy]

I don't know what the 5 fundamentals are

1. The inspiration and inerrancy of Scripture
2. The deity of Jesus Christ
3. The virgin birth of Christ
4. The substitutionary, atoning work of Christ on the cross
5. The physical resurrection and the personal bodily return of Christ to the earth.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

1. The inspiration and inerrancy of Scripture
2. The deity of Jesus Christ
3. The virgin birth of Christ
4. The substitutionary, atoning work of Christ on the cross
5. The physical resurrection and the personal bodily return of Christ to the earth.

I believe in those

 

[Oldtimer]

I agree, as already stated by another poster, this entire thread, with a few exceptions, is a disgrace to the Name of Christ.

Calling the "old" Christians (whoever they are) "stupid," "dumb," and suggesting they are too intractable and ignorant to know as much as you seem to think you know is far from what the bible teaches regarding our relationships with others.

1 Timothy 5:1 Do not rebuke an older man, but exhort him as a father, younger men as brothers, 2 older women as mothers, younger women as sisters, with all purity.

Let me ask the "young" people here (whoever they may be), would you talk to your father or mother the way you have talked to the "old" people on this forum?

If so, the greater shame is on you and your conduct.

Brother, this old dumb, stupid, ignorant Christian, a teenager in the early 60's, gives you a big thank you.

First time I've read this thread. Read it from the beginning through all 100+ posts. In playing his blame game, he seems to have forgotten, in this forum, in this assembly of members of the body of Christ, what every man who stands behind a pulpit should remember. I do pray that he does remember when he stands before his flock on Sunday mornings.

Matthew 5: KJB
And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him:

2 And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying,

3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

4 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.

5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.

7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

13 Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

raying:

 

[RLBosley]

What is IFB?

Independent Fundamental Baptist - A denomination that tries to not be a denomination and often (NOT ALWAYS!) is legalistic. They are frequently KJVO, very dispensational, Pastor rule, and very evangelistic. However their evangelism is often the worst example of the word in that they just get people to praying a prayer and declare them gloriously saved.

I was involved in IFB for a few years but had many problems which I tried to work it out with the pastor at the last church, but he was pretty much unwilling to really discuss anything so my wife and I left last year.