Repealing Obamacare

[Rolfe]

Until you've lived in poverty, you have no idea what it's like. You have no idea of what it's like to have repeated panic attacks over your husband not being able to get the medications he needs to stay alive.

So...keep your sweet middle class "no worries" lifestyle...

So... much... presumption...

 

[Benjamin]

But how does one determine poor lifestyle choices? For instance, you've focused quite a bit of attention on weight, ...

I don't have all the answers about how to set standards for accountability which would regulate their entitlements through responsibility and begin to put limitations on out of control healthcare costs, but I am saying that is a fact that problem needs to be dealt with. I've made some suggestions above of what would be more fair and given reason for the need to set limits and control "it" (the presumption that one is entitled to to top of the line medical coverage without limits or accountability and responsibilities.)

Naturally I would use examples of the out of control obesity epidemic plaguing our country being it is the hands-down unequaled reason for the high volume and rising cost of healthcare and the fact that this condition is directly proportionate to irresponsible lifestyle choices. I believe there should be some accountability that factors into that a line needs to be drawn somewhere when it comes to one's expectations of entitlement and being in relation to the disregard of responsibility when it comes to providing national healthcare would be the place to start to get costs under control.

I am also very well aware of the taboos in this country against anyone speaking up about the need to address the obesity problem and that the first line of defense for the obese is typically a hyper-sensitive offensive attack towards anyone who dare bring it up. This includes consideration of the pathologies related to the many comorbidities that are directly proportional to the obesity epidemic in one way or another. But that is not point here and I have no intention of trying to address the offense you'd like to go into on this subject with you on a personal basis. I've learned to save my energy for reasonable people who would like my help...

My point is that high costs of healthcare coverage needs to focus on the roots of the reasons for poor health along with the personal responsibility rather than the assumption of unlimited entitlement to whatever is available without any accountability or the high costs will never be able to be brought under control.

 

[Baptist Believer]

I gained about 75lbs despite being careful about my diet. My doctor swore up and down that my only problem was that I ate too much. So, I kept a food diary for about 30 days. Turns out I was taking in a max of about 1500 calories a day...I should have lost about 10 lbs that month alone. She ordered a bunch of blood tests. My thyroid was out of whack. Got put on medications and about 60 of that 75lbs is now gone.

Sure. My wife put on some extra weight and couldn't figure out why. I do all the cooking in our home and I know what she eats and how much she eats, so I figured it wasn't her diet unless she was somehow sneaking an enormous number of calories. I starting finding a lot of her hair around the house and especially in the bathtub drain and I suggested she get her thyroid checked. It was off and she was put on medication to correct it. The weight came off of her without any real effort and she's back to normal.

It happens.

And the Cushing's Disease example is a personal one. I am still recovering from Cushing's Disease. At one time, I weighed well over 400 pounds. The weight is coming off, but it takes a long time.

Until you've lived in poverty, you have no idea what it's like. You have no idea of what it's like to have repeated panic attacks over your husband not being able to get the medications he needs to stay alive.

So...keep your sweet middle class "no worries" lifestyle...I pray you never get hit with cancer or another catastrophic illness that causes you to lose everything you have just to save your life.

Don't presume about other's circumstances just because not everyone here has been gentle with you. There are people who have a different perspective who may be in a very similar situation. You know your own situation. Let false criticism go.

 

[Benjamin]

Why is it always necessary for someone to always go to the extremes? I don't know why you'd think that everyone is such a prolifigate spender of "money that isn't theirs". Due to certain things, we live just above poverty level. We get food stamps, rent and utility assistance for now. I can make that 246.00 in food stamps stretch like you wouldn't believe. Our utility assistance? We're still running credits on both the electric and gas bills. Our rent assistance helps us pay for the extravagance of a 1 bedroom apartment in a not so great neighborhood.

Until you've lived in poverty, you have no idea what it's like. You have no idea of what it's like to have repeated panic attacks over your husband not being able to get the medications he needs to stay alive.

So...keep your sweet middle class "no worries" lifestyle...I pray you never get hit with cancer or another catastrophic illness that causes you to lose everything you have just to save your life.

You still haven't addressed any of my points which I named more than once for you. What you've offered is known as an "Argument from Pity" and although my heart goes out to those in despair and need your argument doesn't address the problems and the solutions I am talking about...

 

[Baptist Believer]

I don't have all the answers about how to set standards for accountability which would regulate their entitlements through responsibility and begin to put limitations on out of control healthcare costs, but I am saying that is a fact that problem needs to be dealt with. I've made some suggestions above of what would be more fair and given reason for the need to set limits and control "it" (the presumption that one is entitled to to top of the line medical coverage without limits or accountability and responsibilities.)

Yes, that's reasonable. I agree.

Naturally I would use examples of the out of control obesity epidemic plaguing our country being it is the hands-down unequaled reason for the high volume and rising cost of healthcare and the fact that this condition is directly proportionate to irresponsible lifestyle choices. I believe there should be some accountability that factors into that a line needs to be drawn somewhere when it comes to one's expectations of entitlement and being in relation to the disregard of responsibility when it comes to providing national healthcare would be the place to start to get costs under control.

The problem is how to do that. It seems to me it has to come through the recommendations of doctors who actually interact with patients instead of simply a guideline.

I am also very well aware of the taboos in this country against anyone speaking up about the need to address the obesity problem and that the first line of defense for the obese is typically a hyper-sensitive offensive attack towards anyone who dare bring it up.

Yes, the obesity issue needs to be dealt with.

This includes consideration of the pathologies related to the many comorbidities that are directly proportional to the obesity epidemic in one way or another. But that is not point here and I have no intention of trying to address the offense you'd like to go into on this subject with you on a personal basis. I've learned to save my energy for reasonable people who would like my help...

Nice personal attack in the middle of a discussion. Seriously? You want to dredge up stuff from more than two years ago?

My point is that high costs of healthcare coverage needs to focus on the roots of the reasons for poor health along with the personal responsibility rather than the assumption of unlimited entitlement to whatever is available without any accountability or the high costs will never be able to be brought under control.

Well obviously. I was hoping for some insight into the issue. I guess I'm looking in the wrong place.

 

[Rolfe]

I thought that this was interesting.

Seems reasonable. Let the market decide.

 

[Benjamin]

Nice personal attack in the middle of a discussion. Seriously? You want to dredge up stuff from more than two years ago?

No I don't ...is why I nipped where you were wanting to take this in the bud from the get-go when I saw it coming...and then made the point I was addressing.

Sorry, if my honesty about how I choose to use my energy offends you, especially in light of I really do enjoy helping people...but it is what it is and like I said I've learn when to back away...

 

[carpro]

No because my family was already paying a price that less than 1% of the US pays...the sacrifice of a military career...or are you opposed to the benefits that military families get?

Strawman.

 

[carpro]

Until you've lived in poverty, you have no idea what it's like. You have no idea of what it's like to have repeated panic attacks over your husband not being able to get the medications he needs to stay alive.

So...keep your sweet middle class "no worries" lifestyle...

Oh, please

You know nothing about anyone here , nor what they have experienced in their lives.

 

[Baptist Believer]

No I don't ...is why I nipped where you were wanting to take this in the bud from the get-go when I saw it coming...and then made the point I was addressing.

Actually, you didn't really provide any insight - which it what I was looking for.

You also reminded me that you were the one who was trying to give me unsolicited advice a couple of years ago that would have literally ended my life if I had followed it.

Sorry, if my honesty..

It wasn't honesty, it was a personal attack.

...about how I choose to use my energy offends you, especially in light of I really do enjoy helping people...

The sad part is that I think you believe it. Personal attacks don't help people.

 

[Benjamin]

Actually, you didn't really provide any insight - which it what I was looking for.

You also reminded me that you were the one who was trying to give me unsolicited advice a couple of years ago that would have literally ended my life if I had followed it.


It wasn't honesty, it was a personal attack.


The sad part is that I think you believe it. Personal attacks don't help people.

It is SO predictable that you wanted to make this (any dare of one discussing obesity in your presence) personal. I guess all I can here is, good luck with that. Told you I'm not interested...

 

[HankD]

As we grow older our metabolism changes - slows down.

We need less calories, less carbohydrate, less processed foods, less animal protein.
More fiber, fresh veggies, fresh fruit.

Since my 40's, 50's (I'm now in my 70's) I have had a major battle controlling my weight.

High Blood Pressure : Many years ago I asked a doctor about a weight losing regimen (because obesity and over weight cause/contribute to hypertension according to the medical profession, at least on paper)- these were his words - "lets get your blood pressure under control before we think of doing that".

HUH!?

Every time I mention weight control I get a token positive answer but less than a half dozen words with no answers to take out the door. Since ObamaCare I have had 6 doctor changes (against my will). Same O.

So I have done my own research.

If the billions/trillions of dollars sunk into heart disease and cancer medications (just those two) were devoted to research and the development of a balanced mineral-vitamin diet and the natural enrichment of the soil which produces our food... Oh, WAIT - PHARMA would go bankrupt! Weeping, wailing, etc...


HankD

 

[Baptist Believer]

We need less calories, less carbohydrate, less processed foods, less animal protein.
More fiber, fresh veggies, fresh fruit.

Yes. That food tends to be more expensive and a bit harder to get at a high level of freshness. That's one of the reasons persons in lower incomes are more susceptible to gaining weight. Everything else being equal, the garbage (sweeteners, excessive salt, etc.) that you get in processed foods undermines one's health.

High Blood Pressure : Many years ago I asked a doctor about a weight losing regimen (because obesity and over weight cause/contribute to hypertension according to the medical profession, at least on paper)- these were his words - "lets get your blood pressure under control before we think of doing that".

Once I got major health issues worked out, I found that the easiest way to maintain a good blood pressure, even though I was still excessively overweight, was through a regular sleep schedule 11pm-6am and light to moderate exercise every day. Nothing fancy, but just move for an hour or so on an exercise bike, walk around the neighborhood, go to a park or shopping mall, etc.

It also helps the weight issues, but you have to watch what you eat after exercising.

 

[HankD]

Yes. That food tends to be more expensive and a bit harder to get at a high level of freshness. That's one of the reasons persons in lower incomes are more susceptible to gaining weight. Everything else being equal, the garbage (sweeteners, excessive salt, etc.) that you get in processed foods undermines one's health.


Once I got major health issues worked out, I found that the easiest way to maintain a good blood pressure, even though I was still excessively overweight, was through a regular sleep schedule 11pm-6am and light to moderate exercise every day. Nothing fancy, but just move for an hour or so on an exercise bike, walk around the neighborhood, go to a park or shopping mall, etc.

It also helps the weight issues, but you have to watch what you eat after exercising.

Thanks BB.

Yes, I am retired but sometimes I take an Information Technology contract for a few months and noticed that when I am under stress and consequently not sleeping well my BP rockets up.

HankD

 

[Baptist Believer]

Yes, I am retired but sometimes I take an Information Technology contract for a few months and noticed that when I am under stress and consequently not sleeping well my BP rockets up.

When I was young, I thought sleep was a waste of time. Now that I am past the half-century mark, I realize that sleep is a blessing from God.

 

[HankD]

When I was young, I thought sleep was a waste of time. Now that I am past the half-century mark, I realize that sleep is a blessing from God.

Amen to that brother.

Ecclesiastes 5:12 The sleep of a labouring man is sweet, whether he eat little or much: but the abundance of the rich will not suffer him to sleep.

HankD

 

[TCassidy]

So people like me and my husband can continue to have medical insurance. We both have pre-existing conditions and if it is repealed we could not afford insurance. In that case, my husband would be dead within a week and I probably wouldn't last out a year.

Now wait a minute. You said he was covered by the VA. Obama-care being repealed will not affect his VA coverage. His co-pay for medications will still be $9/month max, and depending on his disability status it could be $8, $7, or 0 per month.

I am a disabled vet with a service connected disability (compensatable). I don't pay any co-pays at all for anything, and Obama-care has no effect on my benefits.

And coverage via medicaid is dependent on whether or not the state you live in has opted for expanded medicaid coverage. And that too is not affected by Obama-care.

 

[TCassidy]

When the insurance companies and pharma companies are the ones making the big bucks.

And why are insurance companies and big pharma making all that money? Because Obama-care is a wind fall profits scheme for those insurance companies. Obama-care FORCES people to buy insurance from those big companies at inflated prices. Obama-care is the PROBLEM, not the solution.

It is the insurance companies that demand the high profits.

Yes. aided and abetted by Obama-care.

I am so not going to research for you.

If you will not or cannot support your thesis please feel free to withdraw it.

I took the time and effort to research but I'm not going to do it for you.

Then withdraw. You made an assertion. Now support it or withdraw it.

 

[Benjamin]

Since my 40's, 50's (I'm now in my 70's) I have had a major battle controlling my weight.

High Blood Pressure : Many years ago I asked a doctor about a weight losing regimen (because obesity and over weight cause/contribute to hypertension according to the medical profession, at least on paper)- these were his words - "lets get your blood pressure under control before we think of doing that".

HUH!?

Every time I mention weight control I get a token positive answer...

...

If the billions/trillions of dollars sunk into heart disease and cancer medications (just those two) were devoted to research and the development of a balanced mineral-vitamin diet and the natural enrichment of the soil which produces our food... Oh, WAIT - PHARMA would go bankrupt! Weeping, wailing, etc...


HankD

Sadly, that's what upcoming doctors are taught at medical school as their primary objective is to give medicine. There is very little focus on the whole person and natural health. The pharmaceutical companies have representatives waiting at the door of medical schools to make sure their medications are part of the curriculum. Its like the doctors have had blinders put on them and they've left their common sense at the door of that medical school. ...and then there is the side effects from all those drugs...but don't worry they a another pill to help with that... for a cost...but then society probably shares in the blame because what they want is a "quick and easy fix" and just want a pill for everything which has to do with supply and demand...

 

[TCassidy]

Its insane that a vial of insulin costs about 300 dollars.

I pay $44 for 40 units or $79 for 100 units.

Blood glucose test strips run 75 dollars for 50 of them (about a week's supply).

I pay $7.95 for a box of 100 test strips.