Those who choose eternal life have it already.
When someone is given CPR and their hearts restart and they start breathing again, they are alive. When God gives them Spiritual CPR, they come to life. They have chosen life because God chose them.
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Review of Martin Luther and Free Will
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When someone is given CPR and their hearts restart and they start breathing again, they are alive. When God gives them Spiritual CPR, they come to life. They have chosen life because God chose them.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
This is interesting. I believe those who "choose" salvation already believe or they wouldn't "choose". And Jesus says whosoever believes has eternal life. So what they are doing is inserting "decisions" or "choosing" into the sequence of repentance believers undertake normally occupied by baptism. Of course baptism follows but not in NT order.
Let me put is simple terms. WIND is not the subject that blows or moves unseen where it wants THE SPIRIT is. Wind should not have been used in the English. The verse says Spirit
Your knowledge is admirable but not very inflexible . It is not a question of Greek but English compared to the Greek.
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Fools answer boldly when they are wrong. It is not a Greek problem at all . It is English, Wind is not the subject that moves unseen. The Spirit is . If you could read verses before you type you might seen the difference
Physical life is up to God, The choice of eternal life or eternal death is given to us.
High view of God because He grants us freedom. To me, a low view of God would be that He did not give us free will.
Do you know what the word "metaphor" means?
The verse says "πνευμα" and "wind" is correct when speaking of the wind blowing.
"Not very inflexible?" Is English a second language for you?
It is a question of what πνευμα means in the context of the metaphore. Anybody who can actually read Greek knows that. Which explains why you don't understand it.
The original did not speak of the wind as the subject, but the Spirit. It is not a metaphor.
The Greek did not mean wind. pnuema here is Spirit, ἄνεμος anemos is physical wind ,
The pnuema here is not the physical wind but the Spirit that , . moves as He wills and moves unseen
the Spirit where he willeth doth blow, and his voice thou dost hear, but thou hast not known whence he cometh, and whither he goeth; thus is every one who hath been born of the Spirit.'
no, not inflexible, more very confident in your education. even when you are wrong
Rockson
Active Member
Aren't Calvinists always quick to say men don't want God? If language means anything that means what they want or don't want. So if he changes their will from having them not wanting him then what other word can be used except FORCE? Isn't it absolutely stunning how some of you dear people seek to smooth this over?
Dead men don't sin either. Dead men don't think, reason or form an opinion . Spiritually dead men can and can make choices.
Rockson
Active Member
And herer's another thing. Paul said he was shown mercy for he did it in unbelief. 1 Tim 1:13 He had a heart that wanted to serve God and was diligent in doing so. But Calvinists would say he would have to have been born again to even want to serve God.
The fact that men don't want God is well established by Scripture (e.g. Isaiah 30:9-11; John 3:19; 1 Corinthians 2:14).Aren't Calvinists always quick to say men don't want God? If language means anything that means what they want or don't want. So if he changes their will from having them not wanting him then what other word can be used except FORCE? Isn't it absolutely stunning how some of you dear people seek to smooth this over?
The fact that God brings men to Himself is also well established (e.g. Acts 13:48; 16:48; Ephesians 1:4-6; Titus 3:3-6). I can think of no one who is described in Scripture as having saved himself. Now if it pleases you, you may describe this as divine mind-rape. I prefer to call it sovereign grace.
They do when they are dead 'in trespasses and sins' (Ephesians 2:1)
Spiritually dead people are unable to form an opinion to come to Christ (John 6:44, 65).
They are slaves to sin (John 8:34-36) Note from those verses that they cannot free themselves; the Son must make them free.
Rockson
Active Member
Yes and you notice Jesus didn't give him any instructions until he first made certain acknowledgements? Paul in vs 5 asks, "Who are you Lord?" He didn't even know it was Jesus but knew it had to be God. Jesus answered, "I am Jesus who you persecute!"
He added on that it's hard for him to kick against the pricks, in other words if you're going to continue to persecute my people things for you won't go too well. I mean the man WAS NOW BLIND! Scary stuff! God came on the scene to bring judgment and if one thinks not then just ask...did God have to blind him?
If he was just there to save him why not just a visual appearance of himself like Stephen had. This man was scared out of his wits! Now watch this==> And he trembling and astonished said, "Lord what would you have me do?" He called him Lord again. That was it for Paul. Enough of this resisting God.
He had no knowledge that he wouldn't have stayed blind for ever. Is there any indication however that he couldn't have STILL resisted and been obstinate? Because he changed does not mean he couldn't have stayed rebellious. There some people in similar difficulties that harden their hearts even further and curse God and die, like one of the thieves at Calvary. Paul made a decision by an act of his will to become obedient quickly from Jesus not being his Lord to his becoming just that.
Rockson
Active Member
But that's not what we're talking about here. We're talking about your statement prior which says, God does not 'force His will' on anyone;
I didn't deny that you believe in absolute total depravity in the way that you do. I told you if God locks in a total change against one not wanting him to...because they despise him as you believe....that therefore is FORCE. So why not stop trying to deny it. It would be what it is...FORCE. As I said you're trying to smooth it over.
Aren't Calvinists always quick to say men don't want God? If language means anything that means what they want or don't want. So if he changes their will from having them not wanting him then what other word can be used except FORCE? Isn't it absolutely stunning how some of you dear people seek to smooth this over?
Dead men don't sin either. Dead men don't think, reason or form an opinion . Spiritually dead men can and can make choices.
I have been in the church for over 50 years and during that time I've collected what I call preacherism... Unusual comments made by preachers from the pulpit and I would like to share one now... Do you know why the Lord created Adam on the sixth day?... He could have created him on the third, he had earth, why didn't he?... Because if he did that then all the creation that followed Adam, Adam could say Lord look what you and I did?... In the recreation men are doing the same thing Lord look what you and I did?... The God in my Bible does his will and not mine... He saved me I didn't save myself, it wasn't a tandem operation... He tread the wine press alone!... That brethren is not free will by any means, that is the Sovereign Grace of Almighty God... God alone saves his own!
Btw... I know I'm going to get flack on this as some brethren will agree and others will not... Being on here as long as I have I have learned two things, have thick skin and a short memory, and I do... Brother Glen
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God enables the lost sinner to really be able and willing to have Jesus as their Lord and Savior...
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Man lost that freedom in the fall. Man is a slave to sin now. You’ve been shown this NUMEROUS times in here. Yet, you lower your head and keep plowing along, tearing verses from their context, with a bull in a china shop mentality.
If you defended God 1/100th as hard as you do this mythical free will, boy, you’d be something.
Reabby?
And how many years have you taught Greek, again?
How many classes have you taken in seminary?
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