Rick Warren's Wacky environmental agenda

[TaterTot]

so?

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Well it’s official; you my friend have officially crossed the line. I hope and pray that no unsaved person reads the garbage you just posted.

1. Rick Warren lives in the same house he has for years (including before the success of his book). Does Gates? No.
2. He Tithes 90%. Does Gates? No.
3. Many have been saved and Saddleback does support missions. That my friend is the heart of the Gospel.
4. Many believe that you can be saved outside of having a literal Bible in your hands. They believe this for the same reasons that we believe babies don’t go to hell and mentally challenged folks don’t go to hell. Do you still preach the Gospel to these folks? Yes. This does not counteract missions because we have no capability to understand to what level of belief is necessary in order for one to be saved. We don’t know exactly how far Gods grace extends in terms of babies, mentally challenged, or third world citizens. All we can do is fulfill our responsibility to preach the Gospel. There are cases in which a culture is so far down a road they will never look up to search for our God. This is why missions are necessary, this does not negate the fact that someone who doesn’t have a translated Bible or a Church in their village cannot come to the knowledge of Christ. Hence the Holy Spirit. John 14:6 refers to Jesus’ position in the kingdom. Though his sacrificial atonement we can be saved, hence Him being the only way. We cannot enter Heaven without Christ, but that doesn’t mean his sacrifice is limited to those who can read a translated Bible. This grace can be sufficient for those who search and find, but may not have the capacity to understand to the extent you or I do.

Matthew 7:21-23 tells us that many who thought they were saved will find out on that day they were not. They claimed to do many wonderful works, many miracles, and to have cast out many devils... all in the name of Jesus. But they were never saved. Sad.

If Rick is teaching another way to heaven other than through coming to the Son, Jesus Christ, he is deceived and deceiving many.

It is not enough to believe in a cross. Romans 10:8-10 plainly show that we must confess, not the cross, but Jesus, and believe that God raised Him from the dead. Romans 10:13 also shows that one must call upon the NAME of the LORD. Jesus must be preached above the cross.

Jesus said in John 10 that He is the Door. If any man try to enter in by any other way, that man is a thief and a robber. Oh, there are many ways to make it to heaven, but if one does not come in through the Door, one will be a sinner falling into the hands of a living God.

 

[All about Grace]

Just for the record: simple stupidity should not be mistaken for "taking a stand" or "guarding the truth".

Every verse quoted above can be applied on both sides of the fence. A tree is known by its fruit and Jesus said his followers would be known by how they treat other believers. You do the math.

I am the first to admit that sometimes it is hard to love those Cousin Eddies in the family.

Some are afraid of evangelicalism moving in the direction of Rick Warren. I am afraid of it moving in the direction of Cousin Eddie.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Jesus said you will know a tree by it's fruit, yes.

But, Jesus also said there are many wolves out there in sheeps clothing.

Treating a person good is done on both sides of the fence. Jesus told us thie as well.

Jesus also said 'Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh' For someone who proclaims to be saved to say that a person does not need to know Christ to be saved tells me that that one may not be saved at all.

It is not enough to believe there is a God. The devils believe there is a God and tremble. Yet, they can never be saved.

One must know the name of the Lord. 'Thou shalt call His name Jesus' Luke 1

[ February 19, 2006, 11:31 AM: Message edited by: standingfirminChrist ]

 

[saturneptune]

So far in the short time I have seen this board, lets see, Billy Graham is apostate, Hal Lindsey is a false prophet, John Hagee is not really of God, Pat Robertson has several financial flaws, now Rick Warren preaches salvation other than Jesus risen.

My question would be to all of those who spend hours analyzing these various personalities, who would meet your criteria as a man of God? And maybe a better question would be, how many people have been lead to Christ by God using you?

It seems to me if we spent as much time preaching to the lost as we do analyzing people and misquoting people, a lot more souls might have come to salvation.

Another thing I am amazed about is debating Calvanism vs Armenianism. Yes, human beings debating the mind of God amazes me.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Misquoting? When it comes directly from their mouths?

As to how many have been saved by God using me, only God knows that number. But I do know through the many altar calls after a message I have preached, I have seen several hundred come to the altar in the last 14 years.

Reaching the lost? Who says we are'nt reaching some right here on the BB?

As far as finding the faults with others, Paul named Demetrius and Alexander, did he not? We are to reveal to the unlearned when false doctrines are being preached.

 

[saturneptune]

standingfirm,
I was not singling you out. And no, I could never hope to approach the effect you have had for the Gospel. And to tell you the truth, I never heard of this Rick Warren. Guess I need to get out more. The point is that I have seen a pattern of many evangilists raked over the coals here, some of which I am familiar with. A lot of the quotes that are made on this board after later been found to be out of context. By the way, where is Cleveland? I grew up in Gulfport, my Dad still lives there.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Cleveland is in the NW area of Mississippi. About a 2 hour drive from Memphis

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Many evangelists are raked over the coals here, yes... and on many other forms of media. Evangelists and Pastors are to be above reproach. Does this mean they are perfect? By no means. We are only perfected in Christ.

But 1 Timothy gives us guidlines concerning Bishops and Deacons (Bishops being the equal of Pastors and Elders). When there is something being stated by a preacher, whether a slip of the tongue, or otherwise, many will jump on that statement and pick it apart.

 

[saturneptune]

The Delta, rich in Indian history and folklore. Actually not that far from you, two to three hours north of Memphis. Our church was called off today because of snow and ice. Hope you guys had better luck.

 

[Brice]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Well it’s official; you my friend have officially crossed the line. I hope and pray that no unsaved person reads the garbage you just posted.

1. Rick Warren lives in the same house he has for years (including before the success of his book). Does Gates? No.
2. He Tithes 90%. Does Gates? No.
3. Many have been saved and Saddleback does support missions. That my friend is the heart of the Gospel.
4. Many believe that you can be saved outside of having a literal Bible in your hands. They believe this for the same reasons that we believe babies don’t go to hell and mentally challenged folks don’t go to hell. Do you still preach the Gospel to these folks? Yes. This does not counteract missions because we have no capability to understand to what level of belief is necessary in order for one to be saved. We don’t know exactly how far Gods grace extends in terms of babies, mentally challenged, or third world citizens. All we can do is fulfill our responsibility to preach the Gospel. There are cases in which a culture is so far down a road they will never look up to search for our God. This is why missions are necessary, this does not negate the fact that someone who doesn’t have a translated Bible or a Church in their village cannot come to the knowledge of Christ. Hence the Holy Spirit. John 14:6 refers to Jesus’ position in the kingdom. Though his sacrificial atonement we can be saved, hence Him being the only way. We cannot enter Heaven without Christ, but that doesn’t mean his sacrifice is limited to those who can read a translated Bible. This grace can be sufficient for those who search and find, but may not have the capacity to understand to the extent you or I do.

Matthew 7:21-23 tells us that many who thought they were saved will find out on that day they were not. They claimed to do many wonderful works, many miracles, and to have cast out many devils... all in the name of Jesus. But they were never saved. Sad.

If Rick is teaching another way to heaven other than through coming to the Son, Jesus Christ, he is deceived and deceiving many.

It is not enough to believe in a cross. Romans 10:8-10 plainly show that we must confess, not the cross, but Jesus, and believe that God raised Him from the dead. Romans 10:13 also shows that one must call upon the NAME of the LORD. Jesus must be preached above the cross.

Jesus said in John 10 that He is the Door. If any man try to enter in by any other way, that man is a thief and a robber. Oh, there are many ways to make it to heaven, but if one does not come in through the Door, one will be a sinner falling into the hands of a living God. </font>[/QUOTE]SFIC,

I thank you for your response, but that didn't refute nor explain my post. Please read post #4 again and see that we agree. God bless.

 

[Brice]

Originally posted by R.D.:
Mr. Warren tithes 90% of the salary that he receives from his church(reverse tithing). There was no mention that he tithes any of the money he receives from the sale of his books or any other income.

You are wrong. He doesn't take a salary from the church. Actually, he tried to pay back all the salary they paid him as pastor from the past 20 or so years.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

The Word of God commands the Gospel to be preached to every creature. I take that literally. I believe before the Lord returns, Missionaries will go forth and preach the Word. All will hear. Those who hear and call upon the name of the Lord will be saved. Many will reject Him and be lost for all eternity.

But one thing is for sure. Not one soul will enter heaven without knowing Christ, nor without calling upon His precious name.

Rick Warren says Abraham made it by faith alone, that he did not need to know the name Jesus. Is that correct? Jesus said in John 5:39 that the scriptures testified of Him. We see Christ all throughout the Old Testament before His virgin birth.

The Prophets, Kings and Priests certainly spoke of Him many times. So I sincerely believe they knew Him. The king recognized the Son of God was in the flames with the Hebrew Children.

I believe if a people in a foreign land have not heard of Christ, the Holy Spirit will lead someone to witness Christ to that people before it is too late.

 

[eloidalmanutha]

posted by standingfirminChrist:
Rick Warren says Abraham made it by faith alone, that he did not need to know the name Jesus. Is that correct? Jesus said in John 5:39 that the scriptures testified of Him. We see Christ all throughout the Old Testament before His virgin birth.

Abraham knew God as "I AM" = Jesus = "I AM"

Gen 17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I AM the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.

Mat 22:32 I AM the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

I just love D'var Elohiym

 

[standingfirminChrist]

So that proves that Abraham did indeed know Jesus Christ

Amen, eloidalmanutha

 

[whatever]

Um - wasn't Abram saved in Genesis 15? And didn't Genesis 15 come before Genesis 17?

Oh, yeah - what does this have to do with the environment anyway?

 

[rsr]

 

[standingfirminChrist]

taken from Rick Warren's Saddleback Church website:

#32 What does the bible say about drinking alcohol?
Question: What does the Bible say about drinking alcohol?

Answer: l Here are three things to remember:
The Bible does not say that it is wrong to drink
• The Bible does say that it is wrong to get drunk
• The Bible commands us to remember the influence we have on an unbeliever

In Bible times everyone drank a watered down wine. Without refrigeration, there was no way to keep fruit juice without it fermenting. There is nothing biblically wrong with drinking wine with a meal, as long as it's not as a means of escape or your don't struggle with becoming drunk.

In spite of this, all of our staff at Saddleback has agreed that we will not drink at all. This is because we are very mindful and concerned about our impact on others. We live in a society where alcohol is the chosen drug of escape" for many people. We are in a church where many have seen Jesus free them from their alcohol addiction through the Celebrate Recovery program. We are gladly willing to give up our freedom to drink alcohol and wine, knowing that it might save someone who struggles with alcohol from seeing us drink and thinking, If it's OK for them, I should be able to handle it also." Paul talks of his willingness to give up his freedom because of his love for the people for whom Jesus died.

"But be careful that your freedom does not cause those who are weak in the faith to fall" Corinthians 8:9

Never mind about pleasing God, let's make sure we look good to man.

Celebrate Recovery Program?? When Jesus did a work in people, He did not take them through a program. He did not tell the man with a legion of devils, 'Well, this will take many sessions. I sure hope you can afford it.' Celebrate Recovery Program sounds like another name for Alcoholics Anonymous.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Rick Warren is right in his exegesis and in the spirit of his policy. It is not about looking good to man, it is about being obedient to God when he tells us not to offend the weaker brother or become a stumbling block.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Taken from Saddleback Web Site

Will Saddleback Church baptize a person who lives unmarried with another person?
Question: Will Saddleback Church baptize a person who lives unmarried with another person?

Answer: The short answer is yes. However, the logic behind that decision is that at Saddleback Church baptism does not confer membership to a person. Baptism is just one of the requirements for membership. We follow the New Testament example of Acts 2:41 (among others): "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized:" and baptize any who confess that they have accepted Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord and desire to follow Him in believer's baptism.

People can be baptize while living in willful sin?

Membership is only conferred after someone has accepted Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord, been baptized by immersion, attended Saddleback's Membership Class and signed our Membership Covenant agreeing with Saddleback's Statement of Faith and agreeing to:

* Protect the Unity of our Church;
* Share in the Responsibility of the Church
* Serve in the Ministry of the Church
* Support the Testimony of the Church

They don't have to live Christlike lives? just agree to Protect, Share Responsibility, Serve in Ministry, and Support the Testimony of Saddleback? God's Word says 'Ye cannot serve Christ and Belial. Light has no fellowship with darkness.

While we will baptize unmarried persons living together without benefit of marriage, we will not accept them into membership because their living arrangement would not support the Testimony of the Church and violates not only God's commandment prohibiting adultery, but also the more general lifestyle guidance of Philippians 1:27 "Whatever happens, conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ."

What I am seeing here is 'We will recognize them as members of the body of Christ (even though they are living in sin), but they cannot join our church.

We would however welcome them to attend our church and be fed by our teaching and ministries and to grow in their understanding of their new Christian walk. As long as they continued in their unbiblical living arrangement they would not be able to be a leader in a ministry because leadership requires church membership.

This last paragraph shows what James warned about... 'A double-minded man is unstable in all his ways.