Should baptists be part of the free masonry?

[Frogman]

A Cloud of Prejudice: A Study in Anti-Masonry

Brethren:

For any interested in reading for truth's sake here is a good read. It is available in part at the following link and if this link doesn't work you can type in the Title of this post on www.books.google.com and find it there.

Here is the link:

http://books.google.com/books?id=CGCGRKT-1DUC&lpg=PP1&dq=A%20Cloud%20of%20Prejudice%3A%20%20A%20Study%20in%20Anti-Masonry&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q=A%20Cloud%20of%20Prejudice:%20%20A%20Study%20in%20Anti-Masonry&f=false

The book is 132 pages with 92 or 94 in this preview. It can be searched for purchase or borrowing from a library however so there is nothing hidden that is not revealed.

I checked the link prior to posting so it works.

bro. Dallas

 

[Baptist4life]

Some reading for you as well:

http://cnview.com/on_line_resources/should_a_christian_become_a_mason.htm

http://iamamason2.wordpress.com/

http://www.ephesians5-11.org/opnltr.htm

CONCLUSION

We have shown conclusively in this study that Masonry is not merely a harmless opinion. In Part I we examined ten things which establish that Masonry is indeed a religion, a false religion with a Christ-less universal philosophy. In Part II we showed that Masonry is harmful to the Christian, that there are many things which make him go against his convictions, and that conflict with his obligations to God. Furthermore, we examined the arguments that the Christian Mason raise (if there are any others, they likewise could easily be answered), and have shown that there is no legitimate argument, no sound reasoning, that would allow the Christian to be a member of Masonry. Thus, we plead with you, the Christian Mason, in behalf of your soul, leave the Lodge and be a Christian and nothing more; follow Jesus Christ and none other; be a member of Christ's church and nothing else.

http://oakridgechurch.com/riggs/mason.htm



Something for you to seriously think about.

 

[Frogman]

Thanks Brother, believe it or not, I have read these things already. I find nothing in my masonic experience or reading of its history in opposition to either God, Christ, nor the word of God as received in the Bible.

bro. Dallas

 

[preacher4truth]

Some reading for you as well:

http://cnview.com/on_line_resources/should_a_christian_become_a_mason.htm

http://iamamason2.wordpress.com/

http://www.ephesians5-11.org/opnltr.htm



http://oakridgechurch.com/riggs/mason.htm



Something for you to seriously think about.

Great and Biblical conclusion. I am certain it will be met with objections.

- Peace

 

[Frogman]

Thanks Brother, believe it or not, I have read these things already. I find nothing in my masonic experience or reading of its history in opposition to either God, Christ, nor the word of God as received in the Bible.

bro. Dallas

In reading just the first page of the first link I see there is no Biblical understanding of the truth reported to us by the word of God that God, the creator of the universe by His Son, for God said...and there was, thus, the beginning of light in darkness was the creation (see John ch. 1), and that by the will of the Father, the act of the Son and the operation of the Spirit all that is is understood to be made out of nothing, yet, it is this God, the creator and as such, a true and Great Architect of all that has been built before us that we might see and proclaim his glory, writes his law upon the hearts of his people. This is his covenant not mine.

Whereas Jesus stated himself to be the way, the truth and the life, this is true and neither masonry nor masons reject it, yet that no man cometh to the Father except by Jesus is not a statement that we cannot possess Eternal Life except through personal belief in Christ, but an affirmation of the word of Christ in John 6 which states that it is the will of the Father that Christ redeem all of whom he, the Father has given to him, and that he lose not one and should raise him (universally speaking of every man, woman and child of the redeemed) up at the last day. Further, this is also a statement of affirmation of Paul's teaching that it is by the which will (the will of God the Father which was the delight of Christ to perform) that each of the elect are sanctified through the offering of the body of Christ. This holds true regardless of how much gospel knowledge we possess or do not possess. Paul further confirms this in Ephesians 1 by stating that God has chosen a people in Christ before the foundation of the world and that this people are made accepted in the beloved, there is not one of the redeemed made accepted with God because of a personal faith in Christ Jesus in an eternal point of view.

This is Biblical truth. If this is not truth then when Paul told Timothy to take heed to himself and his doctrine that in so doing he would save himself, then, he, Paul, by inspiration of the Holy Spirit is declaring man to be his own savior.

Yet, we know this is not the case, so what that Paul teaches Timothy is a gospel salvation, conditioned upon hearing and believing and entering into full rest in Christ having ceased from all our labors even as God did in the seventh day cease from all his work.

The Bible tells us to rightly divide its word, not to divide its word asunder.

bro. Dallas

 

[Frogman]

Great and Biblical conclusion. I am certain it will be met with objections.

- Peace

I am aware of the fact that some brethren who are in the Lodge might not like anything being said about Masonry. However, the attitude of the true Christian is that above all he wants to be right so that heaven will be his home in eternity.

This, taken from the link to David Riggs' study is based completely upon works. The Scripture tells us that if our hope of obtaining eternal life is by works, then grace is no more, if by grace, then works is no more.

So, it is received as being right so that heaven will be one's home in eternity is truth?

Or that it is received that 'wanting' to be right so that heaven will be one's home in eternity is truth?

See, the Bible clearly teaches we are children by adoption of the Spirit of God and that we become 'sons' in the legal sense so as to serve God through Christ among his people through faith. IF faith is what makes us to be children then Christ ought to have told Nicodemus that except a man believe he cannot see nor enter into the kingdom of heaven rather than to have compared it to a natural birth, in which by all comparisons even the Spiritual birth of any individual will bear out that life is present prior to experience of life and that the gospel is purposed among us to reveal that life of Christ in us.

bro. Dallas:type:

 

[preacher4truth]

I am aware of the fact that some brethren who are in the Lodge might not like anything being said about Masonry. However, the attitude of the true Christian is that above all he wants to be right so that heaven will be his home in eternity.

This, taken from the link to David Riggs' study is based completely upon works. The Scripture tells us that if our hope of obtaining eternal life is by works, then grace is no more, if by grace, then works is no more.

So, it is received as being right so that heaven will be one's home in eternity is truth?

Or that it is received that 'wanting' to be right so that heaven will be one's home in eternity is truth?

See, the Bible clearly teaches we are children by adoption of the Spirit of God and that we become 'sons' in the legal sense so as to serve God through Christ among his people through faith. IF faith is what makes us to be children then Christ ought to have told Nicodemus that except a man believe he cannot see nor enter into the kingdom of heaven rather than to have compared it to a natural birth, in which by all comparisons even the Spiritual birth of any individual will bear out that life is present prior to experience of life and that the gospel is purposed among us to reveal that life of Christ in us.

Being right doesn't make ANY persons home heaven.

As far as teaching me what makes a person a true child of God, (which is what I am assuming you are attempting?) the teaching you're giving is as clear as mud (being honest here), and you're evangelizing and preaching up the wrong tree. I'm regenerate, a child of God.

I can't say what you've said is clear, and is absolutely not a clear presentation of the Gospel of Christ.

Not much of what you say makes sense. Sorry, too many run on sentences, especially the last. I've read much of what you've said within this thread, and sad to say and in all honesty, very little of it makes sense to me.

BTW, my "great and biblical conclusion" comment was based upon the "conclusion" quote of baptist4life.

 

[Amy.G]

IF faith is what makes us to be children then Christ ought to have told Nicodemus that except a man believe he cannot see nor enter into the kingdom of heaven rather than to have compared it to a natural birth, in which by all comparisons even the Spiritual birth of any individual will bear out that life is present prior to experience of life and that the gospel is purposed among us to reveal that life of Christ in us.

bro. Dallas:type:

You seem to be saying that one is born again before they are physically born, therefore faith does not play a role. But I'm not sure what you're saying really.

What Jesus actually said was that one must be born again spiritually in order to see the Kingdom of God.

 

[Frogman]

Being right doesn't make ANY persons home heaven.

As far as teaching me what makes a person a true child of God, (which is what I am assuming you are attempting?) the teaching you're giving is as clear as mud (being honest here), and you're evangelizing and preaching up the wrong tree. I'm regenerate, a child of God.

I can't say what you've said is clear, and is absolutely not a clear presentation of the Gospel of Christ.

Not much of what you say makes sense. Sorry, too many run on sentences, especially the last. I've read much of what you've said within this thread, and sad to say and in all honesty, very little of it makes sense to me.

BTW, my "great and biblical conclusion" comment was based upon the "conclusion" quote of baptist4life.

Sorry bout that.

if you read the opening statement of what David Riggs quote says above you will see his logic states that a real Christian wants to be right so that his home will be eternal heaven.

Those are not my words, but they are his.

Maybe if your mind wasn't clouded by superstition things written would be much easier for you to understand?

:BangHead:

I can pick out and comprehend what a person is saying whether they provide any punctuation or not, perhaps this is why so many oppose Masonry because they cannot understand what is being said from its members both historic and contemporary?

I hope I have written this in a way in which you are able to make sense of it. If you will go back and re-read what I have posted on this thread you will find that I have posted Biblical truth.

I have had several BB members who have emailed me, not pm's but emails thanking me for the words I have written. Perhaps these are people who are able to read the word of God apart from any man providing to them his own understanding, then when they see truth, they are able to receive it?

I will try to stick to simple sentences in the future.:thumbs:

But, go back, read from David Riggs' statement, what he says is truly that a real Christian wants to be right so that heaven will be his eternal home. This is a statement in opposition to Grace and my nonsensical harangue was given for the purpose of providing scriptural truth that God alone writes his law upon the hearts of his people regardless of whether they believe what I preach to them or not.

Life precedes experience in the natural man and according to Christ's teaching Nicodemus in John 3, Life also precedes experience in the Spiritual creation of the new man.

Experience comes by being begotten, brought to the birth in faith and repentance in the truth, which as is reported, Jesus Christ, but, life Eternal comes by the power of the Spirit of holiness bearing witness with our spirits that we are children of God.

Understand? Did you think to shame me? :wavey:

There are people who read the Bible for themselves and have no difficulty in understanding my writing.

bro. Dallas:1_grouphug:

 

[webdog]

Why is a Mason allowed to be a Baptist forum moderator, I'd like to know.

I was thinking the same thing. I'm sickened by what I'm reading...

 

[Frogman]

I was thinking the same thing. I'm sickened by what I'm reading...

Being a Mason doesn't make me any less a Baptist as it does make me any less who I am.

I was a moderator before I was a Mason. I will subject myself to the determination of the Board Administrators and Owner and my fellow moderators and if they determine I am unworthy to be a moderator because of my Masonic affiliation I will live according to their ruling in subjection to their decision as this is their discussion board and not mine.

I do not understand why you Brethren are so 'sickened' by reading truth?

I have made it known to an Administrator that evidently the majority of the Baptist polity are bothered by my presence as a Moderator and that I will stand under their determination and according to their censure of my said 'privileges' as Moderator. I did this just after the question was raised.

I have no intent to Lord it over any of the Lord's people, neither as a Baptist nor as a Mason.

But I will state that what is truly sickening is that so many who call themselves Baptist have no understanding of the spirit of Grace under which we now stand. For a lesson on the offense of the Cross read Paul's letter to the Galatian church. That offense does not involve bringing men under subjection to the spirit of fear and bondage to death but declares to them the full redemption in Christ once for all.

Now, what do I mean by that extremely long, complicated, run on sentence? Simply stated, that to begin a lesson to present valid points in opposition to Masonry by stating that a 'real Christian wants to be right so that his eternal home will be heaven' is not an Historic Baptist position and is one of pure works for the obtaining of Eternal Life.

That statement alone ought to be a red flag and a sickening sound deep into the stomach of any Baptist, but not so, not where it is believed better to oppose something from superstition rather than any semblance of real, true grounds of demerit.

bro. Dallas:wavey:

 

[preacher4truth]

Sorry bout that
Maybe if your mind wasn't clouded by superstition things written would be much easier for you to understand?

:BangHead:

Actually my mind is quite clear, having cast off the order of DeMolay and Masons in my former conversation.

I've lost all interest in dialogue with you after attempting to understand your runon posts.

This is acceptable language from a moderator that you display?

There's no need for your personal slam. But maybe this is the true you coming out from under all the other.

In all seriousness, (not that I haven't been) you're theology is gravely confused especially in the area of soteriology. This is plainly seen in your postings, as others have also taken note to this as well.

Webdog, I agree with you here.

 

[Frogman]

Previous Post by Frogman has been reported to the Moderators

I have reported my previous post to the Moderators and ask they provide a concerted response to this question.

I have not and will not visit the Moderator's forum in order to influence this question in either way.

As a Christian, a Baptist, and a Mason, I will abide by any determination they return to us.

Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

bro. Dallas

 

[Frogman]

Preacher4Truth,
Prior to 1830's climate among Baptists, this 'soteriology' I present was full main stream Baptist faith, practice and order.

What ever animosity you hold toward me as a Mason, at least you should be able to recognize historic Baptist doctrine when you read it. It is still clinged too, apart from accepting members in Secret Societies among all sound Primitive Baptists and Old Regular Baptists too.

bro. Dallas

 

[Frogman]

Maybe the hatred of you Brethren against what you don't understand is likewise a very revealing truth concerning who you really are?

You Brethren aren't in opposition to me but for any reason except that I am a Mason, yet you pretend to not be able to understand my writing?

Maybe perhaps if you hadn't forsaken the KJV of the Bible you would understand simple clear Biblical doctrine?

bro. Dallas

 

[preacher4truth]

I've shown no animosity toward you as a mason. You have toward me as being against the lodge. I also see none showing hatred toward you. I can however see that your anger towards those who do not agree with being in the lodge is coming through. No one here is blinded or cloudy in thought because they happen to see that to them the lodge is wrong.

I've been there and have dealt with some in the church who had this same attititude, being in the lodge. They believed in works based salvation, having formerly professed the fatih, and accepted other errors they learned which were propagated from within this group.

 

[webdog]

I do not understand why you Brethren are so 'sickened' by
reading truth?

we are not sickened by reading the truth, we are sickened by reading the perversion of it in masonry. How any child of God can have no problem calling any human not named Jesus Christ "worshipful master" is beyond comprehension.

 

[preacher4truth]

we are not sickened by reading the truth, we are sickened by reading the perversion of it in masonry. How any child of God can have no problem calling any human not named Jesus Christ "worshipful master" is beyond comprehension.

Calling any man master is anti-biblical. But this whole lodge concept is based upon for the most part the goodness of man. This is not Biblical whatsoever.

 

[Frogman]

Brother Preacher4Truth,
I pointed out the clear statement of the Riggs' document which was provided as a Biblical statement proving to us the error of Masonry. IN that statement that man makes a clear statement founded upon works, if that does not make good Solid Baptists sick at there stomachs then I fail to see how Masonry (which is reported truthfully to you with sources) to NOT be a religion seeking to undermine Christ nor the church in the intent of providing Eternal Life to men or among men, yet it is thought funny to attack my posts (running on)? As though to make me discredited and shamed upon the way that I write?

I can write much better, you still would not understand because your opposition to Masonry is settled in superstition, misapplied, uncontextual statements rather than truth.

You cannot oppose Masonry from Truth, so you receive documents written by men who's opening statement is designed to both inject fear and passion in his readers by stating that "ANY REAL CHRISTIAN" wants to be right in what is believed so that heaven will be his eternal home.

These are his words of works to earn Eternal Life and you want me to believe he has written a sound work of proof for opposing Masonry. Yet my posts sicken you guys?

bro. Dallas

 

[Iconoclast]

Some reading for you as well:

http://cnview.com/on_line_resources/should_a_christian_become_a_mason.htm

http://iamamason2.wordpress.com/

http://www.ephesians5-11.org/opnltr.htm



http://oakridgechurch.com/riggs/mason.htm



Something for you to seriously think about.

:thumbs::thumbs::wavey::applause: good links, thanks for posting