1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Soteriology 101

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Van, Oct 24, 2021.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Messages:
    5,536
    Likes Received:
    1,026
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Taint so!
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No matter, if your interpretation is not "no one ever seeks God" then why object to no one seeks God while sinning? And note the reference to other passages, undefined. This is all they have, absurdity followed by falsehood.

    Our faith is based on God's revelatory grace, but God crediting our faith as righteousness is a pure gift of grace. (Romans 4:23-24)

    Rom 4:23-24
    Now not for his [Abraham's] sake only was it written [God's revelation] that it was credited to him, but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, to us who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead,

    Think about this folks, how did we benefit by having our faith credited as righteousness if we are unable to seek God and trust Christ? Every time you see "through faith" in scripture, think "therefore Calvinism is wrong."
     
  3. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    And you still have no intention of answering the question I see. I do not put in no one seeks God while sinning because THAT IS NOT WHAT IT SAYS.
     
  4. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Actua
    Actually I did not hurl an insult, I asked a legitimate question as to why you add the words "while sinning" to Scripture and you refuse to answer.
     
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Isaiah and Paul both stated NONE seek after God on their own, so trust them before you on thnis issue!
     
  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I do not put in no one ever seeks God because THAT IS NOT WHAT IT SAYS.
     
  7. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The added words interpret the open ended ambiguous phrase, just as Calvinism interprets the phrase by adding the qualification ever or at any time. For you to continue to pretend your interpretation is the only one possible demonstrates the use of absurdity in defense of falsehood, but I suspect you already knew that...
     
  8. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    10,911
    Likes Received:
    1,458
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Since, outside of Christ, we are slaves to sin, can there ever be a time when the unregenerate are not sinning or in sin?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Neither Isaiah nor Paul state none seek God at any time. But it is clear none seek God at all times, thus we are all under sin.

    In order to sustain the fiction that no one ever seeks God, several verses must be rewritten.

    Psalm 24:6
    Such is the generation of those who seek him,
    who seek the face of the God of Jacob. Selah

    Isaiah 65:1
    “I permitted Myself to be sought by those who did not ask for Me;
    I permitted Myself to be found by those who did not seek Me.
    I said, ‘Here am I, here am I,’
    To a nation which did not call on My name.
     
  10. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Nice touch, in sin! Of course all in Adam were made sinners and therefore are in a sinful state, separated from God. But we are by grace saved through or by reason of faith. Calvinism claims we were not saved through faith but saved then given faith. So Calvinists must redefine as liberals every place scripture indicated we were saved through or by reason of faith. Go figure
     
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Faith alone refers to faithful faith, the faith from which faithfulness flows, or using James illustration, live faith not dead faith. Thus actual faith, of the kind God might choose to credit as righteousness, includes a commitment to stop going our own way and to strive to follow Christ upon the paths of righteousness. (1 Peter 2:21)

    1 Peter 2:21
    For you have been called for this purpose [suffer for doing right] because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, so that you would follow in His steps,

    We were called (placed into Christ spiritually) for the purpose of faithful service. Thus both repentance and belief in God and His Christ are components of the faith God credits as righteousness. Easy Believism is false doctrine. If our faith lacks the commitment to strive to follow Christ, then God might not credit it as righteousness, because our dead faith would not meet the purpose of God's chosen people.
     
    #31 Van, Oct 25, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
  12. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No, I'm not adding anything, I'm simply taking it at face value.
     
  13. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Correct, it says no one seeks God. Without qualification. THe only one of us adding something and not taking at face value is you by adding when sinning which is nowhere to be found in the passage.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    10,911
    Likes Received:
    1,458
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Well...twice Paul says we are saved by grace. It's pretty simple. Paul doesn't say we are saved by our faith. He says saved by grace. In the second statement he adds "through faith, not of yourself lest anyone should boast." Through faith does not mean "because of faith."
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  15. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The reason Van has to add "when sinning" into the passage is because, without it, his viewpoint completely crumbles.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Note the denial of truth, no one seeks God is said to have a face value of no one ever seeks God, when verse after verse says people seek God some of the time.
     
  17. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Utter falsehood, Calvinism claims Total Spiritual Inability results in no unregenerate ever seeking God. Calvinists defend Calvinism by denying its bogus views...
     
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The ones who preferred to stay in darkness when the light of Christ came disagree!
     
  19. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,742
    Likes Received:
    1,136
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Utter nonsense, through or by reason of faith does mean by reason of faith. Liberals redefine the very meaning of words...
     
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So we Calvinists teach a false Gospel and are liberals?
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...