Soteriology 101

[Van]

Wait does it say by reason? Hmm.... No. It does not.

This post seems not to have know the meaning of "dia" when used to present instrumentality. OTOH, Liberals redefine the very meaning of words...

 

[Van]

@Van you constantly accuse Calvinists of adding to Scripture but in this thread alone you have added to at least two passages of Scripture.

Charging others with Calvinist malfeasance is the stock and trade of false teachers attempting to defend the indefensible.

 

[Van]

Interesting how you add "by reason of" yet no translator states it that way.
SNIP
Van, do you think God is impressed with your faith. Is he so amazed with the faith you exhibit that he is obliged to save you?

ASV
But solid food is for full grown men, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern good and evil.

BRG
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

JUB
But strong food belongs to those that are perfect, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

KJV
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

NKJV
But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

WEB
But solid food is for those who are full grown, who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern good and evil.

A Calvinist might claim "no translator states 'it' that way" but if 'it' is the translation of "dia" then the statement is just another blatant falsehood to support false doctrine.

 

[Yeshua1]

Charging others with Calvinist malfeasance is the stock and trade of false teachers attempting to defend the indefensible.

Scriptures plainly state that no lost sinner in and by themselves shall seek after God, so you are adding conditions right there in how to understand it!

 

[Yeshua1]

ASV
But solid food is for full grown men, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern good and evil.

BRG
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

JUB
But strong food belongs to those that are perfect, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

KJV
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

NKJV
But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

WEB
But solid food is for those who are full grown, who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern good and evil.

A Calvinist might claim "no translator states 'it' that way" but if 'it' is the translation of "dia" then the statement is just another blatant falsehood to support false doctrine.

Babes in Christ receives milk of the word, mature the steak, and the lost get zilch!

 

[Van]

Scriptures plainly state that no lost sinner in and by themselves shall seek after God, so you are adding conditions right there in how to understand it!

Pay no attention to false claims by false teachers. Scripture plainly states that the lost sometimes seek God as in Matthew 23:13.

 

[Van]

Babes in Christ receives milk of the word, mature the steak, and the lost get zilch!

Off topic obfuscation post. The fact is dia is translated "by reason of" by numerous translators.

 

[Yeshua1]

Pay no attention to false claims by false teachers. Scripture plainly states that the lost sometimes seek God as in Matthew 23:13.

You keep using that passage, but it clearly refutes your take on it!

 

[Yeshua1]

Off topic obfuscation post. The fact is dia is translated "by reason of" by numerous translators.

Such as?

 

[Van]

Returning to topic,

Here are some of the key points of Biblical Salvation.

1) “For by grace you have been saved through faith," (Ephesians 2:8) teaches our salvation is through or by reason of faith. Any faith? Nope, only the individuals faith in Christ Jesus, if credited as righteousness by God. Thus some, in their unregenerate state seek God some of the time when they put their trust in Christ.

2) The lost cannot do anything to merit or earn salvation, as our faith is a filthy rag to God. When a person puts their trust in Christ, that does not earn or merit or in any way contribute to God's gracious salvation. Salvation depends of God alone. (Romans 9:16)

3) Our faith is based on God's revelatory grace, but God crediting our faith as righteousness is a pure gift of grace. (Romans 4:23-24)

4) The work of the Holy Spirit is to convict humanity of sin, righteousness, and judgement. Thus the gospel of Christ convicts the lost of the sin of unbelief, such as John 3:18, convicts humanity of God's righteousness, even though Christ has returned to the Father, and His birth, sinless life, death, resurrection and coming judgment convicts humanity because of testimony of the New Testament. (John 16:8)

5) Faith alone refers to faithful faith, the faith from which faithfulness flows, or using James illustration, live faith not dead faith. Thus actual faith, of the kind God might choose to credit as righteousness, includes a commitment to stop going our own way and to strive to follow Christ upon the paths of righteousness. (1 Peter 2:21)

6) The call to repent and believe is simultaneous, not sequential. Two sides of the same coin. You don't believe if you don't repent, and you don't repent if you don't believe. (Mark 1:15)

7) Yes, eternal life begins when we are made "alive" together with Christ. And our spiritual eternal life is a prelude to our bodily redemption and physical eternal life. (Ephesians 2:5) (Romans 8:23)

 

[Yeshua1]

Returning to topic,

Here are some of the key points of Biblical Salvation.

1) “For by grace you have been saved through faith," (Ephesians 2:8) teaches our salvation is through or by reason of faith. Any faith? Nope, only the individuals faith in Christ Jesus, if credited as righteousness by God. Thus some, in their unregenerate state seek God some of the time when they put their trust in Christ.

2) The lost cannot do anything to merit or earn salvation, as our faith is a filthy rag to God. When a person puts their trust in Christ, that does not earn or merit or in any way contribute to God's gracious salvation. Salvation depends of God alone. (Romans 9:16)

3) Our faith is based on God's revelatory grace, but God crediting our faith as righteousness is a pure gift of grace. (Romans 4:23-24)

4) The work of the Holy Spirit is to convict humanity of sin, righteousness, and judgement. Thus the gospel of Christ convicts the lost of the sin of unbelief, such as John 3:18, convicts humanity of God's righteousness, even though Christ has returned to the Father, and His birth, sinless life, death, resurrection and coming judgment convicts humanity because of testimony of the New Testament. (John 16:8)

5) Faith alone refers to faithful faith, the faith from which faithfulness flows, or using James illustration, live faith not dead faith. Thus actual faith, of the kind God might choose to credit as righteousness, includes a commitment to stop going our own way and to strive to follow Christ upon the paths of righteousness. (1 Peter 2:21)

6) The call to repent and believe is simultaneous, not sequential. Two sides of the same coin. You don't believe if you don't repent, and you don't repent if you don't believe. (Mark 1:15)

7) Yes, eternal life begins when we are made "alive" together with Christ. And our spiritual eternal life is a prelude to our bodily redemption and physical eternal life. (Ephesians 2:5) (Romans 8:23)

saving faith is the gift of God towards His own elect in Christ, and God will not credit a lost sinner for any part of the salvation he has wrought!

 

[Van]

One poster observed "God's revelatory grace" sounds like "Prevenient Grace" as espoused by Arminius and Wesley. However the "enabling grace" is claimed to alter supernaturally the inability of the lost such that they then can seek God and trust in Christ.
Revelatory grace simply refers to hearing (by preaching or reading or seeing) about God and His Christ. Paul teaches (1 Corinthians 3:1) that "men of flesh" can grasp "spiritual milk." Only a liberal Calvinist would claim Paul would speak to "men of flesh" in a way he knew was a waste of time.

 

[Van]

saving faith is the gift of God towards His own elect in Christ, and God will not credit a lost sinner for any part of the salvation he has wrought!

False claim after false claim with no biblical reference. This is all Calvinist liberals have...

 

[Van]

Here are some of the verses that liberals rewrite via interpretation:
Romans 3:25
Galatians 3:14
Galatians 3:26
Ephesians 2:8
Ephesians 3:12
Colossians 2:12
2 Timothy 3:15
Calvinist liberals change "through faith" to mean "not through faith."
At some point you would think the penny would drop...

 

[Reformed1689]

@

Charging others with Calvinist malfeasance is the stock and trade of false teachers attempting to defend the indefensible.

@Van you are trying to redirect again but everyone can see in this thread you have added to Scripture. You can't hide from it this time it is in black and white.

 

[Reformed1689]

This post seems not to have know the meaning of "dia" when used to present instrumentality. OTOH, Liberals redefine the very meaning of words...

So Van why has nobody translated it that way?

 

[Van]

@

@Van you are trying to redirect again but everyone can see in this thread you have added to Scripture. You can't hide from it this time it is in black and white.

Liberal Calvinist translation of Ephesians 2:8:

Eph 2:8 (NIV as interpreted using the Calvinist doctrine of total spiritual inability)
For it is by grace you have been saved, not through faith—and because faith is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—

 

[Van]

So Van why has nobody translated it that way?

Falsehood after falsehood. Has nobody translated dia as "through" meaning "by reason of?" Of course as per the lexicons many translators have translated "dia" as through to show the instrumentality of "by reason of." As I said, liberal Calvinists redefine "dia" to mean "not by reason of" in verse after verse.

 

[Van]

Why do liberal Calvinist deny that "through" or by reason of faith means an action is taken by reason of faith. Why do they rewrite verse after verse and claim "through faith" means "not through faith?" Any why do they claim "dia" when used to show instrumentality does not mean "by reason of? What do the lexicons say as to the meaning of the Greek preposition "dia" whose instrumentality meaning is "by means of" or "by reason of" or "because of."

Dia Meaning in Bible - New Testament Greek Lexicon - New American Standard

 

[Reformed1689]

Liberal Calvinist translation of Ephesians 2:8:

Eph 2:8 (NIV as interpreted using the Calvinist doctrine of total spiritual inability)
For it is by grace you have been saved, not through faith—and because faith is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—

I don't know any Calvinist that adds the word not there. Don't tell us we do something when we do not.