Soteriology 101

[Reformed1689]

Falsehood after falsehood. Has nobody translated dia as "through" meaning "by reason of?" Of course as per the lexicons many translators have translated "dia" as through to show the instrumentality of "by reason of." As I said, liberal Calvinists redefine "dia" to mean "not by reason of" in verse after verse.

Through does not mean by reason of.

 

[Van]

I don't know any Calvinist that adds the word not there. Don't tell us we do something when we do not.

Folks, here is the defense of Calvinism by denying the doctrine of total spiritual inability. The actual doctrine of Calvinism is that individuals are saved not through faith, but unconditionally, then given faith.

 

[Van]

Through does not mean by reason of.

The liberal Calvinist chorus of "taint so" sounds like clanking.

Why do liberal Calvinist deny that "through" or by reason of faith means an action is taken by reason of faith. Why do they rewrite verse after verse and claim "through faith" means "not through faith?" Any why do they claim "dia" when used to show instrumentality does not mean "by reason of? What do the lexicons say as to the meaning of the Greek preposition "dia" whose instrumentality meaning is "by means of" or "by reason of" or "because of."

Dia Meaning in Bible - New Testament Greek Lexicon - New American Standard

 

[AustinC]

Folks, here is the defense of Calvinism by denying the doctrine of total spiritual inability. The actual doctrine of Calvinism is that individuals are saved not through faith, but unconditionally, then given faith.

Van, you must have a different concept of salvation. It seems that you think humans are significant assistants to God in their own salvation. It's as if you think God cannot save without human assistance.
Here's the text. No additions or changes:
Ephesians 2:4-9
But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Look at all that God does. Even the faith comes from God by which he confirms our salvation to us.
Don't ignore the entire passage in an attempt to change what "through" is addressing. Let the whole define the use of the word, through.

Back to the first question. Do you assist God in your salvation.?

Finally, you need to speak to me directly. If you cannot do this, you will be disingenuous and failing to converse with me. Talk to me directly. Can you do this?

 

[Yeshua1]

The liberal Calvinist chorus of "taint so" sounds like clanking.

Paul in Romans 8 pretty much demolishes all of your precious salvation theology Van, and cannot "taint so", him, not unless you have better revelation then he received from Jesus directly!

 

[Van]

It seems that you think humans are significant assistants to God in their own salvation. It's as if you think God cannot save without human assistance. SNIP

Even the faith comes from God by which he confirms our salvation to us. SNIP

Notice the implied false doctrine attributed to me. This is all they have.
Liberal Calvinists pretend not to rewrite "through faith" to mean "not through faith" but that is exactly their doctrine.

 

[Van]

Paul in Romans 8 pretty much demolishes all of your precious salvation theology Van, and cannot "taint so", him, not unless you have better revelation then he received from Jesus directly!

Scripture "pretty much demolishes" Calvinism.
Calvinism claims "through faith" actually means the opposite, as in "not through faith." Who would believe such a falsehood?

Galatians 3:26 (NIV)
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,

Liberal Calvinist interpretation of Galatians 3:26
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God not through faith, but through unconditional election.

So what adds to scripture? Calvinism
Who denies the obvious? Calvinists
I kid you not...

 

[AustinC]

Notice the implied false doctrine attributed to me. This is all they have.
Liberal Calvinists pretend not to rewrite "through faith" to mean "not through faith" but that is exactly their doctrine.

Van, I asked you to directly talk to me when I directly addressed your post and provided scripture to discuss. You failed to do that. You are being disingenuous. I cannot respect what you say when you will not address me directly. You may go back, reply to my earlier post and speak directly to my point. Otherwise you have lost any respect from people who might engage you.
Please speak to me regarding post #84.

 

[Van]

Calvinism claims "through faith" actually means the opposite, as in "not through faith." Who would believe such a falsehood?

Galatians 3:26 (NIV)
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,

Liberal Calvinist interpretation of Galatians 3:26
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God not through faith, but through unconditional election.

So what adds to scripture? Calvinism
Who denies the obvious? Calvinists
I kid you not...

 

[AustinC]

Calvinism claims "through faith" actually means the opposite, as in "not through faith." Who would believe such a falsehood?

Galatians 3:26 (NIV)
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,

Liberal Calvinist interpretation of Galatians 3:26
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God not through faith, but through unconditional election.

So what adds to scripture? Calvinism
Who denies the obvious? Calvinists
I kid you not...

Van, you cannot talk directly to people. You should be aware that you have lost any voice with readers as you are incapable of having direct dialogue with others.
If you ever want to talk, address me directly.

 

[Reformed1689]

Folks, here is the defense of Calvinism by denying the doctrine of total spiritual inability. The actual doctrine of Calvinism is that individuals are saved not through faith, but unconditionally, then given faith.

I never denied total depravity. Don't put words in my mouth.

 

[Reformed1689]

The liberal Calvinist chorus of "taint so" sounds like clanking.

Show me any dictionary where through means by reason of.....

 

[AustinC]

Galatians 3:18-29
For if the inheritance comes by the law, it no longer comes by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by a promise. Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, until the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made, and it was put in place through angels by an intermediary. Now an intermediary implies more than one, but God is one. Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.

Hebrews 12:2 tells us Jesus is the author and finisher of faith. The text quoted from Galatians 3 tells us that Jesus and faith are one. Jesus is the author of faith. Without Jesus one does not have faith. Faith is therefore given to the children of the promise. In this passage we understand that we are justified by Christ Jesus who is our faith.

 

[Van]

I never denied total depravity. Don't put words in my mouth.

Calvinism denies we are saved though or by reason of faith. Don't change the subject...

 

[Van]

Show me any dictionary where through means by reason of.....

Once again the liberal Calvinist defense of claiming "through faith" means "not through faith" is a change the subject effort.

 

[Van]

Galatians 3:18-29
SNIP The text quoted from Galatians 3 tells us that Jesus and faith are one. Jesus is the author of faith. Without Jesus one does not have faith. Faith is therefore given to the children of the promise. In this passage we understand that we are justified by Christ Jesus who is our faith.

Some times the word "Faith" is used as a name of Jesus, but not all the time. Thus our belief in God and His Christ is the "faith" under discussion. Efforts to change the subject or obfuscate are telling us the Calvinist view is bogus. "Through faith" does not mean "not through faith" the false claim of Calvinism.

 

[Reformed1689]

Once again the liberal Calvinist defense of claiming "through faith" means "not through faith" is a change the subject effort.

Van this is not true. Stop bearing false witness. Do it again and it will just be flat out lying.

 

[Reformed1689]

Calvinism denies we are saved though or by reason of faith. Don't change the subject...

I do not deny we are saved through faith, Scripture states this clearly. But we are not saved by reason of faith. That is not in Scripture. That is you, once again, adding something to Scripture that is not there. We are saved by reason of the grace of God.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Calvinism denies we are saved though or by reason of faith. Don't change the subject...

this is so TOTALLY unbiblical! where do you get your "theology" from, as it is certainly NOT from the 66 Books of the Holy Bible! Lets have the chapter and verse for this, "we are saved though or by reason of faith"

 

[Reformed1689]

this is so TOTALLY unbiblical! where do you get your "theology" from, as it is certainly NOT from the 66 Books of the Holy Bible! Lets have the chapter and verse for this, "we are saved though or by reason of faith"

See @Van even non-Calvinists say this is bogus.