Then why pray?
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Speaking in Tongues: The Need for Caution
- Thread starter Deadworm
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He could not produce any death certificate though?
There are some who see God having no more gifts operating period today!
In order to be in the will of God for our lives!
Y you completely missed my point. Just because charismatics give the ministry of the Holy Spirit an erroneous (for the sake of the discussion) title doesn't keep Him from exercising His ministry in the church.
One's focus ought to be on the fruit of the Spirit for the members of any church.
A run of unintelligible words through one's mouth can be faked.
These qualities in one's life cannot be faked: love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, self-control.
Some may be temporarily mimicked but cannot be adopted as a way of life without the operation of the Spirit in the crucifixion of the flesh.
Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
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1689Dave
Well-Known Member
The charismatic gifts came only through the hands of a apostle....if you believe scripture and do not add to it. But God heals through the prayer of faith and demons flee in Jesus' name.
I agree with that but where is the scripture you claim is necessary. Here is just one
Timothy 2:1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
the point is well made, but still do not see the signs gifts needing to be still operatring to have the Spirit mature and fruit us up!
God has ordained to use our prayers in order to have His divine qwill and purposes worked out.
Actually, the Holy Spirit still amnifasts and distributes gifts to us today, without need of an Apostle!
Look past the relatively unimportant doctrinal "errors" of your brethren. i have already said I believe the "sign" gifts have had their day.
But not the working of the Holy Spirit in the church.
many of the Charasmatics hold to heretical doctrines though!
So do many of the non-charismatics. What is your point?
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Scripture does not support the distribution of the charismatic gifts other than by an apostle's hands. Or beyond the two outpourings. If you can find scripture saying otherwise, you can honestly make your claim.
There are NT scripture supporting your claim and they should be presented at least once.
Hebrews 2:1 Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.
2 For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;
3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;
4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
What is "the things which we have heard"? "so great salvation".
The confirmation was made (and now journalized in inspired/infallible scripture) in addition that confirmation was made by those who were ear witnesses having heard Him in the days of His flesh.
My point is that we ahould be encoraging those in bad Charasmatic/Sda/Catholic doctrine who pot here to examine trhe scriptures and rightly divide them...
The scriptures state that God grants a spiritual gift to all now saved as the Spirt wills, correct? Romans 12:6, distributred to alla s the Spirit wills, not per any man!
Refers to the sign gifts ceasing with Apsotles, but all other spiritual gifts still operate form and by the Holy Spirit!
No of course not, we are debating about ONE specific doctrine - the "gifts" of the Holy Spirit.
My feeling is that there are different nomenclature for the outworking of the Holy Spirit.
But let me repeat for you Y:
I don't believe that "speaking in tongues" is an authoritative evidential act of being filled with the Holy Spirit (even assuming it is a proper "gift").
A better evidential witness would be the fruit of the Holy Spirit in one's life which can't be manufactured by the flesh.
I agree with you on that!
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