ten-reasons-to-not-ask-jesus-into-your-heart-0

[Martin Marprelate]

There are, I think, two things which we need to understand in these matters.
First of all, God would be perfectly just in sending the whole human race to hell.

Psalm 130:3. 'If you, O LORD, should mark iniquities, O Lord, who could stand?'

The second thing is that when the same Psalm concludes, 'And He shall redeem Israel from all his iniquities,' we are not supposed to ask, "But what about Moab?" 'I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy.' The wonder is not that God only saves some; the wonder is that God saves any.

 

[SovereignGrace]

There are, I think, two things which we need to understand in these matters.
First of all, God would be perfectly just in sending the whole human race to hell.

Psalm 130:3. 'If you, O LORD, should mark iniquities, O Lord, who could stand?'

The second thing is that when the same Psalm concludes, 'And He shall redeem Israel from all his iniquities,' we are not supposed to ask, "But what about Moab?" 'I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy.' The wonder is not that God only saves some; the wonder is that God saves any.

Such a breath of fresh air posting. Kudos.

 

[DHK]

Salvation involves the redemption of the whole man, and is offered freely to all who accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, who by His own blood obtained eternal redemption of the believer. In its broadest sense salvation includes regeneration, sanctification, and glorification.

Quoted from the SBC Baptist Faith and Message.
I would think that if your own Statement of Faith (or Confession) uses those exact words "accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior," then it is not wrong to use the expression.
The same "Confession" continues:

Faith is the acceptance of Jesus Christ and commitment of the entire personality to Him as Lord and Savior.

As far as the heart is concerned:
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

 

[JonC]

The above is hilarious and outright false. You know what all Calvinists believe I being one, and have stated that their (our/mine) teachings are flawed.

You've told us all what we believe many times, even when we deny your straw man caricatures.

So, contrary to your above fabrications, you do make assumptions. False assumptions.

Again you are working off of a poor understanding of my post. When I said that all theologies are flawed as they incorporate human understanding (I insisted that they were not akin to Scripture) I clearly included my own understanding. If anyone is wondering, this was an entirely different thread.

I pretty much agree with conclusions that “all Calvinists" believe. Sometimes I disagree on how they get there, but I affirm the five points of Calvinism (not that you'll find that meaningful). But that does not mean that I know what you believe. All Calvinists do not believe the same thing.

IT, trolling is against the rules of the BB. I do not see how your comments here could be anything but trolling.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Salvation involves the redemption of the whole man, and is offered freely to all who accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, who by His own blood obtained eternal redemption of the believer. In its broadest sense salvation includes regeneration, sanctification, and glorification.

I agree with this.

I would think that if your own Statement of Faith (or Confession) uses those exact words "accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior," then it is not wrong to use the expression.
The same "Confession" continues:

Faith is the acceptance of Jesus Christ and commitment of the entire personality to Him as Lord and Savior.

As far as the heart is concerned:
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

But the crux of the matter is the condition of the unregenerate's heart. The heart is really the inner man, the spirit of man. It is what and who he really is. As an unregenerate, it is an enemy of God. It hates Him. It wants nothing to do with Him. That is why an unregenerate can not ask Him to come into their heart.

No american would open their front door to an member of ISIS and ask them to come in. No american would seek a member of ISIS to speak to them, to seek fellowship with them. I am speaking about unregenerate americans here. Enemies will never seek fellowship.

ETA:Have you found that post of mine where I said Christ was hating Himself yet? I won't let you go on this one. Post it or apoligize to me.

 

[Benjamin]

Quoted from the SBC Baptist Faith and Message.
I would think that if your own Statement of Faith (or Confession) uses those exact words "accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior," then it is not wrong to use the expression.
The same "Confession" continues:

Faith is the acceptance of Jesus Christ and commitment of the entire personality to Him as Lord and Savior.

As far as the heart is concerned:
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

...and can't resist to add my old

tho this concerning the acceptance from one's own heart:

(Rom 10:9) If you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Note: You is used 4 times in this verse. You'll be surprised by how much "you" there is in a book that supposedly says that we do nothing.

 

[Benjamin]

If that is trolling ban me.

Why bother P4T, it didn't work the first time.

 

[Iconoclast]

...and can't resist to add my old

tho this concerning the acceptance from one's own heart:

(Rom 10:9) If you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Note: You is used 4 times in this verse. You'll be surprised by how much "you" there is in a book that supposedly says that we do nothing.

yes...Ben.....false teaching always brings the best out of you...lol....how have you been?

 

[JonC]

It is and should be noted that NOT ONE TIME in this link did you state your own understanding as being flawed. Do you just bank on others not actually reading the link?

Please show us where in this link you did this.

Other's take note that he does not do this in his provided link.

Hey...er...all you "others" out there! Can you see me.....oh...is this thing on... Pleased to meet you. If you are friends of Sherlock here, keep reading that link:

… as my point here is the flaw inherent in our theologies. …I see weaknesses in both (in my own views as well). Unfortunately, it seems to me that there are some people who cannot discern where Scripture itself ends and their understanding begins.

 

[JonC]

I don't hesitate. Yet you didn't hesitate to provide a link that doesn't affirm your statements nor prove your stance.

Show us all where you claimed your own flawed theology in the link you provided.

That's right, you didn't make that claim in that link.

If you wear reading glasses, maybe you should have had them on. Irrrrregardless....and ....hey...you "others"...just to clarify, not only do I believe that my understanding is by nature flawed, but I even know where some of those flaws are (some I can correct, but some are simply part of the human condition).

 

[Benjamin]

As I am not a Determinist I cannot speak for them.

Perhaps a Compatibilist or possibly a Soft Determinist view then, well, I can have some respect that because at least it shows some understanding of the need to avoid theological fatalism by completely abandoning free will for strict determinism which all 5 point of the TULIP must logical hinge to so I understand how you need this a back door to sneak back in.

Guess that's another thread, which if I get started started on will bring much wrath here on the BB and I don't have time for this, but maybe I will retire in few years and get board enough to pick this back up again in the future.

In the meantime my signature pretty much gives my view of Calvinists wavering on Determinism.

 

[Internet Theologian]

If you wear reading glasses, maybe you should have had them on. Irrrrregardless....and ....hey...you "others"...just to clarify, not only do I believe that my understanding is by nature flawed, but I even know where some of those flaws are (some I can correct, but some are simply part of the human condition).

I'm still waiting for you to reveal your flaws as readily as you pretend falsely to know all others beliefs as flawed.

 

[JonC]

I'm still waiting for you to reveal your flaws as readily as you pretend falsely to know all others beliefs as flawed.

Sorry, Bro. Just took a little while. I don't think anyone in their right mind would deny your posts here as trolling Laugh...but I'm game.

My eschatology is horrible. I’ve never really settled down and worked out a coherent belief here. If you were to ask me, I’d freely say “I don’t know.”

You know what....to save time, let’s just look at what I do know.

I know that I was born opposed to God with a will turned towards my own desires. I know that God chose to save me because if the decision was mine alone I would never have been saved. I know that Jesus died on the Cross and bore my sins, and that he purchased me with a price – with his own precious blood. I know that God worked out his will so that I was saved. And I know that God will keep me eternally in his arms.

 

[Benjamin]

yes...Ben.....false teaching always brings the best out of you...lol....how have you been?

Hello, I've been busy with work, a new business, the ranch and life in general but doing well. Yes, it was hard to resist your Op title and decided to drop in and shed a little light on the lack of hope The Doctrines of Pre-selected Grace brings about. ...hope you're doing well.

 

[Iconoclast]

Hello, I've been busy with work, a new business, the ranch and life in general but doing well. Yes, it was hard to resist your Op title and decided to drop in and shed a little light on the lack of hope The Doctrines of Pre-selected Grace brings about. ...hope you're doing well.

yes....you are such a ray of hope,,,,lolI like your emoticons and your site...but I never saw anyone there.....must have been too much light....well glad you are getting along and busy...maybe God will allow you to gain some understanding on these things...
remember;
4 He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

All of God's eternal purpose is perfect, just and right is He in that He has ordained whatsoever comes to pass.

 

[TCassidy]

I can have some respect that because at least it shows some understanding of the need to avoid theological fatalism by completely abandoning free will for strict determinism which all 5 point of the TULIP must logical hinge to so I understand how you need this a back door to sneak back in.

I am not sneaking anywhere. I am open and honest about what I believe. "Free will" is a myth. A fallacy at worst, a misnomer at best.

The will of man is never free. The lost man's will is in bondage to the law of sin and death. The saved man's will is in bondage to the law of new life in Christ. Note Paul repeatedly called himself a "bond slave" or "servant" (δυλοσ = bond slave) of Christ.

Man's will is only able to make volitional choices within the context of his spiritual condition. The lost man, whose will is in bondage to the law of sin and death, can only sin (Isaiah 64:6 For we have all become like one who is unclean, and all our righteousness is like a polluted garment. We all fade like a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, take us away, and Proverbs 21:4 An high look, and a proud heart, and the plowing of the wicked, is sin). All choices end in sin. That is not only what he does, it is what he is.

The regenerate man, on the other hand, has had his will set free from the bondage of the will to the law of sin and death and is not volitionally able to make decisions compatible with the law of new life in Christ.

Your signature line exposes the problem. You mistake "free will" for "volition." They are not the same. All people make volitional decisions every day. Every person consciously chooses, make choices, every day. The ability to make volitional choices has nothing at all to do with free will. I suggest reading Luther's "Bondage of the Will." It is an excellent exposition on the will of man and his fallen condition.

 

[Iconoclast]

Salvation involves the redemption of the whole man, and is offered freely to all who accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, who by His own blood obtained eternal redemption of the believer. In its broadest sense salvation includes regeneration, sanctification, and glorification.

Quoted from the SBC Baptist Faith and Message.
I would think that if your own Statement of Faith (or Confession) uses those exact words "accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior," then it is not wrong to use the expression.
The same "Confession" continues:

Faith is the acceptance of Jesus Christ and commitment of the entire personality to Him as Lord and Savior.

As far as the heart is concerned:
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

The baptist faith and message is a weak compromise doctrinal statement for those who cannot come to grips with the real thing. That it uses this language helps show it as scripture does not.

 

[JonC]

The baptist faith and message is a weak compromise doctrinal statement for those who cannot come to grips with the real thing. That it uses this language helps show it as scripture does not.

I think maybe that's because the Baptist Faith and Message is not a doctrinal statement for a church but a statement for a collective of independent churches.

 

[TCassidy]

I think maybe that's because the Baptist Faith and Message is not a doctrinal statement for a church but a statement for a collective of independent churches.

Yes, but many (even 1 is too many in my opinion) have no doctrinal statement specific to their local church be simply refer people to the BF&M. I think that is a cop out, but I seem to be in the minority.

 

[JonC]

Yes, but many (even 1 is too many in my opinion) have no doctrinal statement specific to their local church be simply refer people to the BF&M. I think that is a cop out, but I seem to be in the minority.

I agree. And that's the least of my concern with the SBC (and I am a SBC member). Frown

What is more distressing is that if they did try to have a doctrinal statement specific to their local church, I'm not sure that many would have enough doctrine to put in the statement. It'd be a 3x5 card.

(that is...btw...exaggeration....most could fill a 3x5 card Laugh)