The Bible Teaches that Repentance and Faith are Gifts from God.

[Charlie24]

" For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. " ( Romans 1:16 ).

My friend, I'm not ashamed of the Gospel that Paul preached, nor am I ashamed of the very same Gospel that Peter, James and John preached...
The same Gospel that was given to them by their Saviour, Jesus Christ.

But if I were you, I would go back to the Scriptures and be sure of every word, sir...
For it is in those words that you will find the answers to the things it seems you rail against.
It is in those words where I find those same answers.

May God bless you.

You will be ashamed when you find that Christ offered Himself to the whole world and for all time as a sacrifice for their sins.

1 John 2:2

"And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."

God help you, Dave G.

 

[Brightfame52]

All of us were spiritually dead before we heard the Gospel and chose to believe God.

TULIP is an evil in this world teaching man that God doesn't love everyone, and saves whom He chooses.

Many will give up and say I've done to much wrong in my life for God to accept me, I'm one that He doesn't love.

God help us!

The Gospel of Jesus Christ is "Good News" Jesus loves you and wants to save you from your sin, and He will if you will only believe and trust Him!

Established religion is the worst enemy of the Cross of Christ.

You should be ashamed of yourselves for teaching such heresy!

The spiritually dead dont qualify for Rom 10:17, only the regenerated who have ears for hearing, and not physical ears lol

 

[Dave G]

<--- Here the Lord Jesus tells us who does and who does not "hear" ( or understand ) His words...those who are not "of" God.

God's elect.

Clarification:
Those that do "hear" God's word are His elect, while those that do not, are not.

Again, "he that has ears to hear" are the ones who "listen" and understand His words, responding in faith to what was told them by God.
The rest of mankind hate Him and will not "listen", neither will they believe His words.
The Scriptures, in the details of every word that is written, are very specific about this.

To the OP:

Yes, I agree that the Bible tells us that repentance and faith are gifts from God, and they are gifts given to those He has chosen in Christ from the foundation of the world.
Some of them made up the local church at Ephesus...

To whom Paul witnessed these things ( and many others ) to when he wrote to them under the inspiration of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

You will be ashamed when you find that Christ offered Himself to the whole world and for all time as a sacrifice for their sins.

1 John 2:2

"And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."

God help you, Dave G.

Thats just the saved, justified whole world.

 

[Charlie24]

The spiritually dead dont qualify for Rom 10:17, only the regenerated who have ears for hearing, and not physical ears lol

In Rom. 11 just after Paul says "for with the heart man believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation," He says, Rom. 11:17, "so then faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God."

Man heard the Gospel in the Word of God, believed it and confessed his belief in it and was saved.

 

[Charlie24]

Thats just the saved, justified whole world.

Shame, shame on you BF, for limiting the will of God to save the lost in this world that Christ gave His life for.

 

[Charlie24]

Shame, shame on you BF, for limiting the will of God to save the lost in this world that Christ gave His life for.

No matter who you are, what you've done in this life, Christ has the power to deliver you from your sins.

Christ said this some 2000 years ago and is still saying it today to anyone who desires peace of heart and soul.

Matt. 11:28-29

"Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls."

 

[Dave G]

He says, Rom. 11:17, "so then faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God."

Again, Scripture tells us how faith comes to someone...
By "hearing", doesn't it?
It also tells us who "hears" and who does not.

I'm sorry if this isn't evident to you when you read the Bible for yourself, but it is to me and has only become more clearer to me over the years since I stopped listening to what was being preached from pulpits and started availing myself of His command to study His word for myself and to ignore the teachings of men.

Shame, shame on you BF, for limiting the will of God to save the lost in this world that Christ gave His life for.

Please study the Scriptures deeply, Charlie, and hopefully you will find that it is He who has "set the limits" upon Himself;
By choosing to save a remnant of mankind for an eternal relationship with Him, and choosing to judge the rest of us for our sins through His Son on that terrible day.

The Lord coming to earth, being made flesh and living, dying and rising again, was to make salvation a surety for those He had been given to save, by God the Father.
This has been pointed out to you many times, yet it seems that you are blind to the Scriptures which show this.
I'm sorry, Charlie, but I would that you could see it.
Until then, I'll keep encouraging you... even though you may call me a heretic.

My best advice, should you decide to take it?
Pay no attention to the institutions of men, and simply read every word carefully, and for yourself.


That said, I'll take my leave of this thread and bid you a good afternoon.

 

[Charlie24]

Again, Scripture tells us how faith comes to someone...
By "hearing", doesn't it?
It also tells us who "hears" and who does not.

I'm sorry if this isn't evident to you when you read the Bible for yourself, but it is to me and has only become more clearer to me over the years since I stopped listening to what was being preached from pulpits and started availing myself of His command to study His word for myself and to ignore the teachings of men.

Please study the Scriptures deeply, Charlie, and hopefully you will find that it is He who has "set the limits" upon Himself;
By choosing to save a remnant of mankind for an eternal relationship with Him, and choosing to judge the rest of us for our sins through His Son on that terrible day.

The Lord coming to earth, being made flesh and living, dying and rising again, was to make salvation a surety for those He had been given to save, by God the Father.
This has been pointed out to you many times, yet it seems that you are blind to the Scriptures which show this.
I'm sorry, Charlie, but I would that you could see it.
Until then, I'll keep encouraging you... even though you may call me a heretic.

My best advice, should you decide to take it?
Pay no attention to the institutions of men, and simply read every word carefully, and for yourself.


That said, I'll take my leave of this thread and bid you a good afternoon.

My Bible says that "all" men will be drawn to Christ. There's that word "all" again.

John 12:32

"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

All men are drawn to Christ by the Holy Spirit, Dave G, but only those who believe the Gospel will be saved.

 

[Silverhair]

If you dont have understanding of the word, you dont have faith The word understandeth in Matt 13:23 is the same word here

Rom 3:11

There is none that understandeth, G4920 there is none that seeketh after God.

So the joy receiver doesnt really understand God, that's not Faith, sorry

You do realize that Paul was writing to the Jews and pointing out that although they had the scriptures they have not understood them as they have rejected their long awaited Messiah.

They have chosen not to hear or see the truth right in front of them because their hearts have become calloused/hardened.
Jesus said if they would open their eyes and unstop their ears and believe in Him then He would heal them.

Of course you will reject what I have said as it does not fit your religion.

 

[Silverhair]

@Charlie24



Thats for the regenerated who already have the seed of Faith planted in them. The unregenerate dont qualify for this because they spiritually dead and dont have spiritual hearing.

BF I did a search of all the bibles I have and could not find that "spiritual hearing" that you say people need to have.

Since it is not in the bible where did that idea come from BF? And if it is not biblical why do you hold to it?

 

[Silverhair]

Also the hearing of Faith can only apply to the already Justified/righteous. All whom Jesus made righteous/just shall be made to hear Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous or just. Same word in the original.

So the promise to the just is this Rom 1:17

For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Thats why the Gospel to them is the power of God Vs 16

So only the justified/saved can hear with faith but if that were true then your saying that a person is justified/saved before they even believe.

Where do you find the in scripture BF?

Paul was quite clear in a number of verses that we have to believe the gospel first not after we are saved.

Do not believe the word of God BF?

Rom 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.

Rom 10:13 for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Rom 10:9 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Rom 10:14 How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?

Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

Eph 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

Now I know you will not believe what I say but are you going to ignore what God has said?

 

[Silverhair]

My Bible says that "all" men will be drawn to Christ. There's that word "all" again.

John 12:32

"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

All men are drawn to Christ by the Holy Spirit, Dave G, but only those who believe the Gospel will be saved.

I have found over time that @Dave G does not like to engage with those that do not hold the same views as he does. It is unfortunate that he has chosen to do this as he looses out on the opportunity to find correction and to grow.

 

[Charlie24]

I have found over time that @Dave G does not like to engage with those that do not hold the same views as he does. It is unfortunate that he has chosen to do this as he looses out on the opportunity to find correction and to grow.

I don't care who doesn't like it, TULIP is an evil force that pulls in its prey and won't let go.

 

[Silverhair]

I don't care who doesn't like it, TULIP is an evil force that pulls in its prey and won't let go.

When you find a view that requires you to twist words and verses to make them fit that view then you need to be suspect of the validity of that view.

What L. Flowers said regarding Calvinism points out the problem with that view.

If C/R is an error:

The reason most Christians reject it is because they have good discernment.

If C/R is true:

The ultimate reason most resist it is because God sovereignly and unchangeably decreed their resistance for His own glory


If C/R is true, then God has predestined most of His children to resist His truth so as to glorify Himself.

The idea that God unchangeably predestines His own children to reject His own truth for His own glory is so intuitively false that we don’t need to refute it. We just need to make sure that everyone understands that’s what C/R entails so they know to reject it.



If Calvinism is true I can't think of a better excuse for an atheist than the one that Calvinism ultimately gives him. They can honestly say, if Calvinism is true I was born a God hater without the ability to believe in my own God unless He unilaterally picked me before I was even born for reasons that He never reveals and gives me this miracle of faith causing me to believe.

I can't think of a better excuse in the world than I was born unable to believe without a miracle and God withheld that miracle from me.

 

[Charlie24]

When you find a view that requires you to twist words and verses to make them fit that view then you need to be suspect of the validity of that view.

What L. Flowers said regarding Calvinism points out the problem with that view.

If C/R is an error:

The reason most Christians reject it is because they have good discernment.

If C/R is true:

The ultimate reason most resist it is because God sovereignly and unchangeably decreed their resistance for His own glory


If C/R is true, then God has predestined most of His children to resist His truth so as to glorify Himself.

The idea that God unchangeably predestines His own children to reject His own truth for His own glory is so intuitively false that we don’t need to refute it. We just need to make sure that everyone understands that’s what C/R entails so they know to reject it.



If Calvinism is true I can't think of a better excuse for an atheist than the one that Calvinism ultimately gives him. They can honestly say, if Calvinism is true I was born a God hater without the ability to believe in my own God unless He unilaterally picked me before I was even born for reasons that He never reveals and gives me this miracle of faith causing me to believe.

I can't think of a better excuse in the world than I was born unable to believe without a miracle and God withheld that miracle from me.

Well said!

The bottom line for me is what must God think of this?

Do they even care what God thinks of it?

 

[Brightfame52]

In Rom. 11 just after Paul says "for with the heart man believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation," He says, Rom. 11:17, "so then faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God."

Man heard the Gospel in the Word of God, believed it and confessed his belief in it and was saved.

The spiritually dead dont qualify for Rom 10:17, only the regenerated who have ears for hearing, and not physical ears lol

 

[Brightfame52]

Shame, shame on you BF, for limiting the will of God to save the lost in this world that Christ gave His life for.

Its the Truth

 

[Brightfame52]

BF I did a search of all the bibles I have and could not find that "spiritual hearing" that you say people need to have.

Since it is not in the bible where did that idea come from BF? And if it is not biblical why do you hold to it?

Lol, it doesnt matter what you cant find

 

[Brightfame52]

So only the justified/saved can hear with faith but if that were true then your saying that a person is justified/saved before they even believe.

Where do you find the in scripture BF?

Paul was quite clear in a number of verses that we have to believe the gospel first not after we are saved.

Do not believe the word of God BF?

Rom 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.

Rom 10:13 for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Rom 10:9 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Rom 10:14 How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?

Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

Eph 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

Now I know you will not believe what I say but are you going to ignore what God has said?

Also the hearing of Faith can only apply to the already Justified/righteous. All whom Jesus made righteous/just shall be made to hear Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous or just. Same word in the original.

So the promise to the just is this Rom 1:17

For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.