The Catholic Church Is Not Entirely False And Does Worship The Biblical And Historical Jesus As God

[Darrell C]

The council of trent, and that is OFFICIALLY the stance of the RCC regarding salvation, states that if ANY preach the message that we are saved by faith alone grace alone, that is a damnable heresy!
really, either they are right and we must come back to the real Mother church, or they are Apsoste, no middle ground!

And playing devil's advocate I could argue that in view is a response to greasy grace. There are quite a few groups that teach that works are a part of the believer's life. We know that is true, because James makes it clear. So post the statement from the Council of Trent and let's look at it, Yeshua, because that is the only way we can determine if you are properly charging Catholicism or not.

Post the official doctrinal statement.


God bless.

 

[Darrell C]

paul did state that if ANYONE preaches other than the true Gospel, let them be damned, so think he would be very against the RCC!

I would request at this time that a Catholic do what my friend Yeshua has not done, and present a Catholic presentation of the Gospel.

I see two presentations that are possible, (1) the official Catholic version, and (2) the version as it is translated by the Catholic.

Thanks in advance.


God bless.

 

[MennoSota]

I have asked you several times to present a Catholic presentation of the Gospel, then critique the error you find in it. You haven't done that, yet a Catholic on here has presented a statement of faith that I could see nothing that differed from Protestant declarations. Nothing in there that I would view as cultish, or containing error that would stand above errors in Protestant/Reformed/Evangelical doctrinal positions.


God bless.

Salvation via infant baptism and eating the bread and wine in communion. None of these works save you nor do they continue to keep you saved.
If you were made alive in Christ, you could never take communion and never be baptized, yet God would welcome you to heaven as his adopted child. Case in point...the thief on the cross.

 

[Adonia]

Salvation via infant baptism and eating the bread and wine in communion. None of these works save you nor do they continue to keep you saved.
If you were made alive in Christ, you could never take communion and never be baptized, yet God would welcome you to heaven as his adopted child. Case in point...the thief on the cross.

The thief on the Cross is not a good example of the sacraments being nothing. Consider that he was hanging right next to the Creator come to earth. When Jesus personally speaks to him and says he will see paradise, that's it - he's in.

You know, if none of all those other things like water baptism and Holy Communion are irrelevant, why are they even brought up in the Scriptures in the first place? There would have been no need of the Apostles or even a church in the first place. That kind of thinking makes no sense at all. Jesus would have just been born, crucified and resurrected and he would have written a book about it all and the only thing needed would have been a belief. I mean really, even John the Baptist could have been dispensed with.

 

[Adonia]

History repeats itself when we fail to know what happened before.

No one is arguing against this statement. You are deflecting.

Your view is incorrect. Indulgences teach that you can buy someone out of an imaginary place called purgatory. It's not like tithing at all. Poor comparison on your part.

Your perception is it's an attack. My perception is that I am questioning your reasoning and your unquestioning nature in regard to the church at Rome. I merely ask you and others to question what you are being taught. Secondly, we don't win anyone over to God. God either makes us alive in Christ or he doesn't. Our task is to speak the truth of reconciliation to rebels as an ambassador of Christ's Kingdom.

We don't lead men to Christ. We do, however, share the good news as expressed in 1 Corinthians 15:1-3.

Indeed, nothing is accomplished. You can ignore the conversation if you wish.

I agree. Let us leave emotions on the side. This is an issue of sound, biblical doctrine.

A cult is defined as having one leader that demands complete obedience to the dogma s/he espouses. The Roman church can legitimately be defined as a cult.

It is not for any of us to condemn a person to hell. It is right to share scripture, which tells us that we are all hell bound unless God pardons our sins via Yeshua's atonement and grants spiritual life to our dead in sins spirit.
Has God made you alive in Christ apart from anything you have done?

A cult. Gee, it sounds like that idea fits Jesus Christ to a tee. One leader that demands obedience to the dogma He espouses. Looks like I am in that cult, as I perceive you are.

 

[MennoSota]

The thief on the Cross is not a good example of the sacraments being nothing. Consider that he was hanging right next to the Creator come to earth. When Jesus personally speaks to him and says he will see paradise, that's it - he's in.

You know, if none of all those other things like water baptism and Holy Communion are irrelevant, why are they even brought up in the Scriptures in the first place? There would have been no need of the Apostles or even a churc That kind of thinking makes no sense at all.

Baptism and communion are a means in which we tangibly remember what God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit has done on our behalf. The thief on the cross had his spirit made alive next to Jesus. He was redeemed and pardoned at the cross. The other thief did not have his spirit made alive. He died in his trespasses and sins.

Our redemption is entirely a work of God apart from anything we do. It is a shame that the church at Rome has added works to salvation. It is anathema to God's holy word.

 

[MennoSota]

A cult. Gee, it sounds like that idea fits Jesus Christ to a tee. One leader that demands obedience to the dogma He espouses. Looks like I am in the cult, as are you.

Is Jesus God?

Is the Pope God?

Which one can demand absolute allegiance to his word?

Do you see the difference?

 

[Adonia]

Is the Pope God?

Which one can demand absolute allegiance to his word?

Do you see the difference?[/QUOTE]

Is Jesus God? Absolutely!

Is the Pope God? No Catholic in their right mind could believe that. He is our head Bishop, the person alive on this earth as the authority in religious matters. Even within the church, the Pope does not act by himself. He consults with the other bishops from around the world to decide the most important matters concerning the faith.

Obviously I see the difference, I am not an idiot.

What is a cult? It is an organization like the one's that were led by Jim Jones, David Koresch, and the Hare Krishna's. They demand absolute loyalty to themselves to the point of signing over all worldly goods and having them direct the individual in every daily activity. They see themselves as the Lord and Savior, quite unlike our Pope, the Bishop who sees himself as a servant like Christ.

 

[Adonia]

Baptism and communion are a means in which we tangibly remember what God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit has done on our behalf. The thief on the cross had his spirit made alive next to Jesus. He was redeemed and pardoned at the cross. The other thief did not have his spirit made alive. He died in his trespasses and sins.

Our redemption is entirely a work of God apart from anything we do. It is a shame that the church at Rome has added works to salvation. It is anathema to God's holy word.

What's the matter, can't you remember God the Father without any works? Can't you be consistent? You say they are not needed, but then you say they are. Good grief!

 

[MennoSota]

="Adonia, post: 2312086, member: 12797"

Is Jesus God? Absolutely!

Is the Pope God? No Catholic in their right mind could believe that. He is our head Bishop, the person alive on this earth as the authority in religious matters. Even within the church, the Pope does not act by himself. He consults with the other bishops from around the world to decide the most important matters concerning the faith.

Obviously I see the difference, I am not an idiot.

What is a cult? It is an organization like the one's that were led by Jim Jones, David Koresch, and the Hare Krishna's. They demand absolute loyalty to themselves to the point of signing over all worldly goods and having them direct the individual in every daily activity. They see themselves as the Lord and Savior, quite unlike our Pope, the Bishop who sees himself as a servant like Christ.

So...the pope doesn't speak for Christ? He's not the vicar of Christ anymore than I am or you are the vicar of Christ? He's just a man who shares fallible comments with fallible humans? Is that accurate?

 

[MennoSota]

What's the matter, can't you remember God the Father without any works? Can't you be consistent? You say they are not needed, but then you say they are. Good grief!

I do not know what you are talking about. Perhaps you misread and thus misspoke.

 

[utilyan]

If you choose to believe the Catholic false gospel, then that's up to you.

Look here John [edited] Telling folks I believe salvation by works.

[edited]

And the only challenge I say THERE IS NO SINNING IN HEAVEN. And you can't man up to that.


That there is no sinning in heaven is False teaching?

 

[Yeshua1]

And playing devil's advocate I could argue that in view is a response to greasy grace. There are quite a few groups that teach that works are a part of the believer's life. We know that is true, because James makes it clear. So post the statement from the Council of Trent and let's look at it, Yeshua, because that is the only way we can determine if you are properly charging Catholicism or not.

Post the official doctrinal statement.


God bless.

9 Things You Should Know About the Council of Trent

 

[utilyan]

This is the knock out punch people.


All we got to keep asking is CAN WE SIN IN HEAVEN?

Everyone squirms around the question because to say NO implies a purification "purgatory" to happen.


You guys are dying going to heaven comming back to judgement day for round 2 to see if you go to heaven.

If at judgement all that is evil is thrown in hell, think about whats left, and then this goes to heaven.

 

[Yeshua1]

The ONLY people in heaven will be sinners who were saved by the Grace of God, and not due to them ceasing to sin!

 

[utilyan]

The ONLY people in heaven will be sinners who were saved by the Grace of God, and not due to them ceasing to sin!

Again SQUIRMING AROUND THE QUESTION.


CAN WE SIN IN HEAVEN? YES OR NO!?

 

[Adonia]

So...the pope doesn't speak for Christ? He's not the vicar of Christ anymore than I am or you are the vicar of Christ? He's just a man who shares fallible comments with fallible humans? Is that accurate?

As I said before, it's the whole Church. The Holy Father is infallible in faith and morals and he speaks in concert with the other Bishops. But to allay your fears, yes he is still known as the "Vicar of Christ".

 

[MennoSota]

As I said before, it's the whole Church. The Holy Father is infallible in faith and morals and he speaks in concert with the other Bishops. But to allay your fears, yes he is still known as the "Vicar of Christ".

Adonia, there is nothing in the Bible to back up what you have said. It is equal to me claiming that I am infallible in faith and morals as I speak in concert with my church softball team. Would you take my word for it if my softball team had been around for a millenium?

Do you see how silly it is for you to believe such an unsubstantiated claim by the pope and his pals? There is no biblical support to the claim. It is that claim that places the church of Rome as a cult along the lines of Jehovah's Witness or Mormons. No person is infallible or speaks infallibly other than God. The pope is just like me and nothing more.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

Look here John first YOU LIED. Telling folks I believe salvation by works.

That makes you a LIAR.

You've been very consistent in defending Catholic works-righteousness and stating that faith alone is not enough to save, that one must, among other things, be baptized.

For you to call me a liar for pointing those things out at this point is just silly.

And the only challenge I say THERE IS NO SINNING IN HEAVEN. And you can't man up to that.

You've asked me this question a dozen times and each time, I've told you that I agree there is no sinning in Heaven. You then post Revelation 21 and state that nothing unclean can enter Heaven and, again, I say I agree with you.

How is that "not manning up"?

 

[JohnDeereFan]

All we got to keep asking is CAN WE SIN IN HEAVEN?

Everyone squirms around the question because to say NO implies a purification "purgatory" to happen.

Actually, not only have I answered this question every time you answered it, I also explained to you each time why not sinning in Heaven will not be indicative of the existence of Purgatory.