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The Murder of Jesus
- Thread starter Marooncat79
- Start date
Are you able to get the gist of Matthew 5:21-22; Matthew 5:27-28?
If you are capable of 'getting it', then you should be able to grasp why the Holy Spirit has soundly convicted 'that generation' of the murder of Christ. Murder was their very intent.
37818
Well-Known Member
Agreed.
Isaiah 53:6, All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
A case can be made we as sinners effectively caused Jesus death too.
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37818
Well-Known Member
Not about what I said.
But the Holy Spirit said, in 1 John 3:8, He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
So, in Isaiah 53:6, All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
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Why stop there? Move on to the next line:
9 Whosoever is begotten of God doeth no sin, because his seed abideth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is begotten of God. Jn 3
Are you trying to convince me that I was in alliance with the Serpent that bruised our Saviour?
37818
Well-Known Member
Again you accuse.
There is a before and after salvation.
Ephesians 2:2-3, Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
2 Corinthians 5:17, Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
Isaiah 53:6, All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
Romans 5:8, But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
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37818
Well-Known Member
Who is accusing here?
It is IMPOSSIBLE that any believer was ever a child of the Devil. Why? Because of the simple fact that they believe.
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word.
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.
45 But because I say the truth, ye believe me not.
46 Which of you convicteth me of sin? If I say truth, why do ye not believe me?
47 He that is of God heareth the words of God: for this cause ye hear them not, because ye are not of God. Jn 8
37818
Well-Known Member
Ephesians 2:2-3, Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
37818
Well-Known Member
What of us before we believe?
37818
Well-Known Member
Romans 8:9, But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Romans 8:16, The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . .
1 John 5:12, He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
Romans 8:16, The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . .
1 John 5:12, He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
Yea, all the Gentiles, as idol worshippers, walked according to the powers of the air at one time. That does not mean they were ever the seed of the Serpent. God had more people among the Gentiles than He ever had among "the married wife":
1 Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith Jehovah. Isa 54
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; Break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: For more are the children of the desolate than of her that hath the husband. Gal 4
16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice: and they shall become one flock, one shepherd. Jn 10
Lost sheep, not goats, but sheep.
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep.
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: Jn 10
As a believer, that should be good news to you.
37818
Well-Known Member
Whether sheep or goats are an end result. Matthew 25:32, . . . And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
. . .
Anytime I see an attempt to blame Jews or Romans (ungodly people) for the murder of Jesus, a red flag appears in my mind. Is this misguided view really based on anti-semitism?
Clearly God utilized the Jews and Romans to carry out His predetermined plan, but beware of any effort to stigmatize groups of people, rather than the common sinful nature we all had as children of wrath.
Clearly God utilized the Jews and Romans to carry out His predetermined plan, but beware of any effort to stigmatize groups of people, rather than the common sinful nature we all had as children of wrath.
...and then takes severe vengeance on them for doing it.
You're no different than the Calvinists you hate.
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You cite the judgement of Mt 25, which is all about works. So, you believe it's our works that's going to determine whether we're goats or sheep? Whether we go to heaven or to hell? Is that what you believe?
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
35 for I was hungry, and ye gave me to eat; I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink; I was a stranger, and ye took me in;
36 naked, and ye clothed me; I was sick, and ye visited me; I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Mt 25
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 for I was hungry, and ye did not give me to eat; I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink;
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in; naked, and ye clothed me not; sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Mt 25
No, you've got it backwards. Its's whether we're goats or sheep that determines our works. Matthew 7:17-19