agedman,
What do you mean by a neutral position? Is that your way of saying 'free' or 'undetermined by God?'
Free and undetermined as to any influence from any source. That absolutely no influence, one way or the other, is impressed, rather the person is absolutely free of all natural proclivities and any convincing by the heavenly or that of hell.
This is the sort of thinking, that has been read on the BB as the state a person has when speaking of free and innate volition, is written by some who oppose a view and bolster that humankind have total freedom of choice/will.
Such do not recognize that the lost are held and have no desire for that of the Light, nor that the lost possessing any true comprehension of the Light.
Yet, some continue in pages endorsing such a freedom of will/choice.
As you who are wise in the Scriptures can attest, such thinking of such a freedom is actually irrational and certainly unscriptural.
Being ENABLED to respond doesn't mean being neutral, IMO. Its just simply means able. People who haven't been invited, and who haven't heard the good news, haven't been enabled to come.
This would seem correct, and I tend to agree - however what of the Scripture statements using the "ALL."
For instance, in the opening of John - light is given to "all." Later, "I will draw all", and even, "all (every man) will bow the knee."
Therefore, according to those who want to hold the extreme of "all" then it follows that even the "People who haven't been invited and who haven't heard the good news" are still responsible and enabled to come.
But, you and I would both understand that "all" is not the all inclusive that we would desire, but is rather used as none excluded. That is, the gospel is powerful to save all - despite the station in life, the sin that abounds, or any other human condition. And, that God saves the "all" to the uttermost - He leaves none nor looses any.
But once they have been invited and told of God's gracious provision they have to decide what to do with that information. They can trade that truth in for lies, ignore it and move on, OR they can admit their weakness in humiliation and trust Christ to rescue them....by believing they receive life.
That would seem correct, but as John shows, the darkness does not comprehend nor can it comprehend the light. The darkness withdraws from the light and lurks ready to push out the light when the source of the light is removed. It is not a matter of the person "deciding what to do."
One does not "trade" in the sense of having possession of the truth and giving it away. One cannot trade what they do not hold in ownership. Romans 1:25 (the only place I recall in which such an exchange is mentioned - though I may be wrong) is not speaking as one who posses the truth and exchanges it, but rather one who is content in the darkness, and prefers or embraces the darkness. In doing so, they CHANGE (the more literal rendering) or pervert the truth of God - the same of what Satan did in Eden and during the temptation of Christ.
Remember the parable of seed/sower?
Each of the first three seed preferred the world and changed the truth of the Word into a lie of the darkness.
14 The sower sows the word. 15 These are the ones who are beside the road where the word is sown; and when they hear, immediately Satan comes and takes away the word which has been sown in them. 16 In a similar way these are the ones on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with joy; 17 and they have no firm root in themselves, but are only temporary; then, when affliction or persecution arises because of the word, immediately they fall away. 18 And others are the ones on whom seed was sown among the thorns; these are the ones who have heard the word, 19 but the worries of the world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the desires for other things enter in and choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful.
See the work of Satan in the darkness?
See how he and therefore the lost changed the truth into a lie?
It really isn't a matter of the person having the ability to decide or not what to do with God's provision.
The parable makes no such distinction - look at the cunning of the evil one involved in the first three seeds.
"How can they believe in someone they have not heard about?" They can't. They aren't ABLE. Faith comes by hearing, so if there is no hearing there cannot be any faith. But if they do hear their is nothing preventing them from responding to the CLEAR and POWERFUL truth.
I don't disagree.
You and I both know that historically the Calvinistic thinking folks have been at the work of evangelism and missions and historically have not been particularly slack about it.
There is a problem with the "hearing" that is very important.
There have been those saved when "hearing" occurred when they read the Scriptures. For a long time, I was involved in the dissemination of the Scriptures into the USSR. The results were astounding.
I admit the preaching and preacher is extremely important - the oral dissemination of the Word is to be highly esteemed.
It is the Word that is powerful, and whether the word is given orally or written down, when it is presented it will bear fruit - in a sense leaving a tract where one might pick it up and read is preaching (spreading) the Word.
I know this is a long post, and I hope that I didn't leave out a vital part - was distracted through much of the writing on this Thanksgiving day.
