Where is <<a seventh day Sabbath>>, <<in this Messanic Feast of unleavened bread>>?
I'm not speaking of the one you place there.
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
The Sabbath was not Changed
- Thread starter BobRyan
- Start date
- Status
Where is <<a seventh day Sabbath>>, <<in this Messanic Feast of unleavened bread>>?
I'm not speaking of the one you place there.
6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.
7 In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.
8 But ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD seven days: in the seventh day is an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.
Do you have a problem reading the scriptures? What occurs "on the fifteen day of the same month"??? How many days do they eat "unleavened bread"? What occurs on the first of those seven days? Can't get it any plainer! Where are your glasses?
Le 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.
This verse sets forth the definition of a "holy convcation" to be a "sabbath of rest" meaning "ye shall do no work therein". Hence, afterwards it is always called a "holy convocation" wherein no work is done and intermittantly identified as defined in verse 3 as a "sabbath of rest."
Last edited by a moderator:
Yes the Seventh Month was begun by a first day OF THE FIRST MONTH, 'sabbath'. That, is TRUTH.
<<the first month in their new year ... was begun by a first day [OF THE WEEK-] Sabbath>>, IS A LIE ---YOUR, LIE!
LOL! Well sure it is truth. It is truth that the emphasis of DATES do not follow the seventh day of the week pattern (7,14,21,28) in these messanic feasts but rather follow the first day of the week patterns (1, 8,15,22).
I, read it, there is NO 'Seventh Day' or 'seventh day' 'sabbath' or 'Sabbath' in the unleavened bread feast.
I do not read it; you think you get away with your fabrication ANY, 'sabbath' is in any text of the feast of unleavened bread its seventh day of feast included, its first day excepted.
I can read. You can read as well; therefore who of us is the PRETENDER?
YOU are the pretender because verse 3 plainly identifes the "Sabbath of rest" to be EQUAL to a "holy convocation" wherein there is no work and verse 8 plainly identifies "the seventh day" as such a "holy convocation" wherein there is no such work just as it does the "first day" of a total of seven days.
Not at all!
<This verse> does NOT, <<set forth the definition of a "holy convcation" to be a "sabbath of rest" meaning "ye shall do no work therein">>
You deliberately suppress the TRUTH in this text, that this text sets forth the definition of, QUOTE: “THE SEVENTH DAY”—“the day The Seventh Day” which, QUOTE:
“IS THE SABBATH—Sabbath-DAY-OF-REST—Day-of-Rest holy convocation”;
“THE SEVENTH DAY Sabbath-Day-of-Rest holy convocation ye shall do no work in:—THE SEVENTH DAY The Sabbath-Day-of-Rest OF THE LORD:—THE SEVENTH DAY The Sabbath-Day-of-Rest OF THE LORD in all your dwellings.”
—The Seventh Day The Sabbath-Day-of-Rest of the LORD IN ALL YOUR DWELLINGS”:—in "holy convocation" and when NOT in "holy convocation"!
You unintermittently commit FRAUD; nothing less.
Last edited by a moderator:
You simply do not know what you are talking about nor are you dealing fairly with that text in the overall context.
1. What law in the Bible forbids work on a day? The Sabbath Law
2. Nowhere else in the whole book of Leviticus but in Leviticus 23 is the expression "holy convocation" ever used and it is always accompanied by prohibition to work on that day.
3. Any day prohibited from working is a "sabbath OF REST" from work
I know your theory doesn't fit but that is because your theory is wrong!
Ah! Again!
<This verse> does NOT, <<set forth the definition of a "holy convcation" to be a "sabbath of rest" meaning "ye shall do no work therein">>
You deliberately suppress the TRUTH in this text, that this text sets forth the definition—<<in the overall context>>—, of, QUOTE: “THE SEVENTH DAY”—“the day The Seventh Day” which, QUOTE:
“IS THE SABBATH—Sabbath-DAY-OF-REST—Day-of-Rest holy convocation”;
“THE SEVENTH DAY Sabbath-Day-of-Rest holy convocation ye shall do no work in:—THE SEVENTH DAY The Sabbath-Day-of-Rest OF THE LORD:—THE SEVENTH DAY The Sabbath-Day-of-Rest OF THE LORD in all your dwellings.”
—The Seventh Day The Sabbath-Day-of-Rest of the LORD IN ALL YOUR DWELLINGS”:—in "holy convocation" and when NOT in "holy convocation"!
You uninterrupted DO commit FRAUD, again and again!
Last edited by a moderator:
What difference does it make if <<Nowhere else in the whole book of Leviticus but in Leviticus 23 ... the expression "holy convocation" (is) ever used and it is always accompanied by prohibition to work on that day.>> It makes it a rest day, not "the day The Seventh Day Sabbath-Rest-Day OF THE LORD GOD" who NEVER needs a rest day like humans do.
So yes, <<Any day prohibited from working is a "sabbath OF REST" from work>>. It does not make it "The Seventh Day Sabbath of the LORD GOD".
So, <<What law in the Bible forbids work on a day?>>
Definitely not <<The Sabbath Law>> ONLY!
What have you been saying after all?
Sweet blow nothing!
You have guts to so directly contradict and shoot down what stands written: <<the words "besides" means in addition to>>!
I prefer to believe it's black and not white when it is written it is black.
What is <<the regular weekly "sabbath">> than the regular weekly recurring SABBATHS -- Plural? Or is it the past Sabbath turning up again every week? Are we going back to the future here? Is time standing still?
Therefore absolutely, <<the phrase "beside your sabbaths" does not refer to the regular weekly "sabbath" SINGULAR but to all the PLURAL "Sabbaths" just spelled out in all the feasts.>>
You do know the ART to turn truth into error! Good English expression is it something is 'artful'!
How artful you TWIST God’s Word that says – reads – “besides the Sabbaths OF THE LORD”!
Man, I think it’s scandalous!
Last edited by a moderator:
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
In most of the annual Sabbaths there is no 7 day cycle at all for work.
In none of the annual Sabbaths do we find a way to substitute the annual Sabbath for the 4th commandment.
In ALL of the annual Sabbaths - the day is selected by God - not man.
Incredibly obvious points I know - but I thought we would all enjoy reading them.
in Christ,
Bob
In Genesis 2:3 there is no command to keep the Sabbath.
In Exodus 20:7 and in chapter 31 the command to remember the Sabbath and keep it, is given explicitly to Israel, and never to Gentiles. It was the sign of a covenant between Jehovah and Israel and for her generations forever. Gentiles are never commanded to keep the Sabbath.
In Mark Jesus says that he is "Lord of the Sabbath;" not that the Sabbath is his Lord." We are not slaves to the Sabbath, as the SDA practice. But rather as Genesis 2 teaches we should take one day out of seven to rest. It is a principle not a command. Jesus is Lord.
The early church met on the Sabbath. Yes, but they met on every other day as well. They met on the Muslim holy day--Friday. They met on Sunday--the day Christ arose from the dead. They met every day, no one day was excluded. All days were the same to them.
You are like some of the early judgmental Christians, whose attitude Paul condemned:
Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Many honored every day alike, and no day was set as more holy than any other day. Paul condemned those that judged them that had this conviction--that the Sabbath or even Sunday was of greater importance than any other day. It wasn't. Every day had equal value in God's sight. Man could choose to worship on any day he wanted and it was wrong to judge him.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
1. In Is 66:23 "From Sabbath to Sabbath" shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to Worship -- not saying that ONLY JEWS are members of "mankind".
2. Mark 2:27 "The Sabbath was made for MANKIND"
On these two verses alone the Baptist Confession of Faith would be justified in THEIR inclusion of Gen 2:3 as specifying the 4th commandment.
But they have added support in the very text of Gen 2:3 because in Ex 20:11 God says that the Gen 2:3 act ALONE makes the Sabbath binding on mankind.
Until you read Isaiah 66:23 and Isaiah 56 and Mark 2:27, and Hebrews 4 and 1Cor 7:19 and Rev 14:7 and ....
in Christ,
Bob
When the Millennial Kingdom comes, then we shall concern ourselves with fulfilled prophecy, not now. We live in the present not the future. I recall that you didn't want to talk of the mark of the beast; hardly didn't want to speak of it at all as it regards the Sabbath, because "it was still future." Now don't be hypocritical in your hermeneutics.
Yes it was made FOR mankind. We are not slaves to the sabbath.
If my father got a computer FOR me, then who owns it? Does the computer own me, or do I own the computer.
Am I a servant to the computer, or is the computer a servant to me?
The sabbath (one day out of seven) becomes a servant to me. I decide how I want to use it, when, where, and how to rest.
Moody rested on Saturday while the rest of the congregation rested on Sunday. That was his instructions.
There is no command in Genesis 2:3.
The command in Exodus 20 is given to Israel, and expounded on in Exodus 31. It is very convenient for you to continually skip over the 31st chapter of Exodus. Why? Don't you believe all the Scripture?
You dream. Why don't you add your support to Exodus 31?
There is no command in Genesis 2:3. Show me a command there.
The command in Genesis 20 is to Israel alone.
Until you admit that you and EGW have labeled me and all other Baptists and Protestants as those having the mark of the beast, I have no need to discuss these passages with you. You are inconsistent.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
On the contrary - D.L. Moody is a Baptist source - not an Adventist one.
And we both know it.
[FONT="]DWIGHT L. MOODY[/FONT]
[FONT="]The Ten Commandments:[/FONT][FONT="]
Exodus 20:2-17 [/FONT]
Exodus 20:2-17 [/FONT]
.
The Fourth Commandment
Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.
The Fourth Commandment
Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.
I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was.I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.
"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)
It isjust as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.
The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins withthe word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stoneat Sinai.How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away [FONT="]with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?
I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes; if you give up the church the home goes; and if the home goes the nation goes. That is the direction in which we are traveling.
[/FONT]
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by DHK
In Genesis 2:3 there is no command to keep the Sabbath.
In Exodus 20:7 and in chapter 31 the command to remember the Sabbath and keep it, is given explicitly to Israel, and never to Gentiles.
1. In Is 66:23 "From Sabbath to Sabbath" shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to Worship -- not saying that ONLY JEWS are members of "mankind".
2. Mark 2:27 "The Sabbath was made for MANKIND"
3. (And of course Isaiah 56 is a specific promise to Gentiles in the OT for keeping the Sabbath)
On these two verses alone the Baptist Confession of Faith would be justified in THEIR inclusion of Gen 2:3 as specifying the 4th commandment.
But they have added support in the very text of Gen 2:3 because in Ex 20:11 God says that the Gen 2:3 act ALONE makes the Sabbath binding on mankind.
I am pointing to the OT statements on the scope of the Sabbath being applicable to all mankind.
I am pointing to the OT statements about Sabbath and Gentiles in Isaiah 56 even before the cross.
I am pointing to the pre-cross statements of Christ in Mark 2:27 that the Sabbath was "MADE for mankind" not "MADE for Just Jews".
DHK said:
I simply pointed out that it is hard to test prophecy as true or false when it is a prediction about an event that is still future to us.
And if you are saying that you do not yet know if Isaiah is true prophet and you need to wait for Isaiah 66 - future - the New Earth to evaluate Isaiah - as a true or false prophet -- I am willing to grant you that.
Is that the extreme to which you want to take this? Really??
Even the Baptist Confession of Faith admitting to the fact that Gen 2:3 is the actual 4th commandment of the TEN Commandments - given to mankind as the moral law - does not add 'we are slaves to the Sabbath".
And that is not a quote from me either.
Ellen White specifically stated that no one has the Mark of the Beast today - prior to still-future events to take place. Far be it from me to claim that she is wrong in that regard and to insist that people have it.
in Christ,
Bob
Why do you continue to be dishonest and only quote a portion of his sermon? You take this portion out of the context of the whole. In reality he is not a sabbath keeper at all and would despise the position you take. You won't bother to read the rest of the sermon because it condemns your position.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
I have repeatedly stated that the Baptist Confession of Faith, D.L. Moody, R.C.Sproul, C.H. Spurgeon et al - are in agreement that -
1. The Sabbath of the 4th commandment - Saturday - was given to mankind in Gen 2:3 in Eden.
2. The Ten Commandments with the Sabbath in them - are the Moral Law of God from Eden to this very day.
3. The Ten Commandments are binding on all saints today - including the Sabbath.
4. The Sabbath commandment was "changed" at the cross to point to week-day-1 Sunday and no longer to the Seventh day as God gave it.
What part of this did you miss?
What part of this do you think get's contradicted in the "rest" of Moody's sermons?
Anything at all???
crickets...crickets...??
You know I am right about these points. I have made them often.
in Christ,
Bob
1. The Sabbath of the 4th commandment - Saturday - was given to mankind in Gen 2:3 in Eden.
2. The Ten Commandments with the Sabbath in them - are the Moral Law of God from Eden to this very day.
3. The Ten Commandments are binding on all saints today - including the Sabbath.
4. The Sabbath commandment was "changed" at the cross to point to week-day-1 Sunday and no longer to the Seventh day as God gave it.
What part of this did you miss?
What part of this do you think get's contradicted in the "rest" of Moody's sermons?
Anything at all???
crickets...crickets...??
You know I am right about these points. I have made them often.
in Christ,
Bob
"What part of this did you miss?"I have repeatedly stated that the Baptist Confession of Faith, D.L. Moody, R.C.Sproul, C.H. Spurgeon et al - are in agreement that -
1. The Sabbath of the 4th commandment - Saturday - was given to mankind in Gen 2:3 in Eden.
2. The Ten Commandments with the Sabbath in them - are the Moral Law of God from Eden to this very day.
3. The Ten Commandments are binding on all saints today - including the Sabbath.
4. The Sabbath commandment was "changed" at the cross to point to week-day-1 Sunday and no longer to the Seventh day as God gave it.
What part of this did you miss?
What part of this do you think get's contradicted in the "rest" of Moody's sermons?
Anything at all???
crickets...crickets...??
You know I am right about these points. I have made them often.
in Christ,
Bob
Moody believes in a "Christian Sabbath," that is Sunday.
Moody believes that this Sabbath should be kept in principle, not as law.
Moody is not legalistic. He believes this is a principle in life; not a law to be kept. He demonstrates that in his own life as he does not keep the Sunday Sabbath. It is his day of work, as he testifies. He works on the Christian Sabbath, and rests on another day.
The principle is to rest one day out of seven.
This is what you miss.
- Status