The scriptural and contextual reading of Lydia's heart

[Silverhair]

It does support it, it plainly says those who hear the preachers of the word, spiritual hearing is intended, knows God, if they dont hear Gods preachers, they are not of God. 1 Jn 4:6

6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

BF did you actually read the verses in context, I doubt it as your comments do not align with the text.

1Jn 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1Jn 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God;
1Jn 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.
1Jn 4:4 You are from God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is He who is in you than he who is in the world.
1Jn 4:5 They are from the world; therefore they speak as from the world, and the world listens to them.
1Jn 4:6 We are from God; he who knows God listens to us; he who is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

John is writing to saved people. You only miss that because it does not fit your theology.

 

[Silverhair]

I dont know what you talking about. Lydia was able to hear the word of God, faith comes by hearing, She was given the ability to hear. Jn 8:43,47

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

You are just following your Calvinist theology not the bible. You have your priorities wrong. Scripture is the authority not Calvin or those that follow him.

 

[Van]

I dont need one that says that, Im able to match scripture with scripture and see the Truth.

Nothing to see here.

 

[Van]

I dont know what you talking about. Lydia was able to hear the word of God, faith comes by hearing, She was given the ability to hear. Jn 8:43,47

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

To point to one deaf person, and say that means all people are deaf is beyond absurd.

 

[Van]

Man needs a spiritual heart to receive Spiritual things. God gives one that heart in regeneration, then one is spiritually prepared to receive the word and understand it Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

No verse says a person needs a spiritual heart to receive all spiritual things. You simply rewrite scripture to add your man-made doctrine to the text.
Does Matthew 13:23 say the good ground was regenerated ground, or did your man-made doctrine manufacture that fiction?

 

[Brightfame52]

BF did you actually read the verses in context, I doubt it as your comments do not align with the text.

1Jn 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1Jn 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God;
1Jn 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.
1Jn 4:4 You are from God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is He who is in you than he who is in the world.
1Jn 4:5 They are from the world; therefore they speak as from the world, and the world listens to them.
1Jn 4:6 We are from God; he who knows God listens to us; he who is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

John is writing to saved people. You only miss that because it does not fit your theology.

I know the context, how do you think I found the scripture reference ?.You have to be of God to hear Gods words , thats imperative. Jesus said the same thing John 8:43,47

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Now according to Jesus, who is it that hears Gods words ?

 

[Brightfame52]

You are just following your Calvinist theology not the bible. You have your priorities wrong. Scripture is the authority not Calvin or those that follow him.

Again Lydia was able to hear Gods word coming from Gods prophet or sent messenger. In order to hear, Jesus said one must be of God Jn 8:43,47

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

No verse says a person needs a spiritual heart to receive all spiritual things. You simply rewrite scripture to add your man-made doctrine to the text.
Does Matthew 13:23 say the good ground was regenerated ground, or did your man-made doctrine manufacture that fiction?

Mans heart by nature is far from spiritual, its hard as stone to spiritual things, its evil and incurably evil, it loves darkness rather than light. Paul says of the natural man, that is the man that is unregenerate and has not the Spirit, that the things of God are foolishness to him, and he CANT KNOW THEM which means Understand them since they must be spiritually discerned. 1 Cor 2:14

Jesus tells us who it is that Hears the words of God John 8:47

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Matthew Poole writes:

He that is of God; to be of God, here, is opposed to a being not of God, and so may be understood to comprehend election, as well as regeneration.

Heareth God’s words; he heareth, acknowledgeth, believeth, and patiently submits to the will of God revealed in his word.

The reason why you, though with your ears ye hear the word of God, yet do not in heart receive, and embrace, and believe it, nor can submit to it, is

because ye are not of God, not chosen of him, not savingly enlightened and regenerated by him. So as this text affords us an excellent note, by which we may know whether we be regenerated, and of God, yea or no. That is, our believing and yielding obedience to the will of God revealed in his word. By this saying of our Saviour, he seemeth to acquiesce in the will of God, concerning these refractory and unbelieving Jews, notwithstanding all the pains he had taken with them to enlighten and bring them to the saving knowledge of the truth. It pleased not his Father to open their eyes that they might see, or their hearts that they might understand. This ought in like manner to satisfy all the true and faithful ministers of the gospel, when they see they have laboured in vain, and spent their strength for nothing and in vain. When they have done all they can, they will find this of our Saviour true, That the work must be God’s, and not theirs; and no more hearts will be changed, than theirs who are of God.

Now Lydia was of God when she was hearing Pauls Preaching the word of God, so God opened up her understanding.

 

[AVL1984]

Mans heart by nature is far from spiritual, its hard as stone to spiritual things, its evil and incurably evil, it loves darkness rather than light. Paul says of the natural man, that is the man that is unregenerate and has not the Spirit, that the things of God are foolishness to him, and he CANT KNOW THEM which means Understand them since they must be spiritually discerned. 1 Cor 2:14

Jesus tells us who it is that Hears the words of God John 8:47

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Matthew Poole writes:



Now Lydia was of God when she was hearing Pauls Preaching the word of God, so God opened up her understanding.

The Preaching of the Word of God spreads a light on people's sinfulness...Does it "regenerate?" I don't think so...Regeneration cannot occur until something is accepted...like the truth of the Word....I think your process is messed up there......As others believe it is also.

 

[Silverhair]

I know the context, how do you think I found the scripture reference ?.You have to be of God to hear Gods words , thats imperative. Jesus said the same thing John 8:43,47

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Now according to Jesus, who is it that hears Gods words ?

Are you saying that everyone that is not of God is deaf?

Look at the context BF, you seem to think that grabbing random verses proves your point but all it does is show that you do not actually want to trust the bible but rather your Calvinist philosophy. That is a sad situation you are in.

Jesus was in a conversation with the Pharisees {Jn 8:12 ff}. The Pharisees could hear what Christ was saying and they could actually understand what He said, look at their responses. They just would not accept what He said.

Just the same as now, people can hear the gospel message and understand the message but not all will accept the message.

If you took the time to read the context you would see why your understanding is false.

Jesus had made a contrast as shown in John 8:42-44. Trust what the world says or trust what God says. The Pharisees have made the choice to follow the world, free will shown here.

Now if we followed your line of thinking then no one could be saved as we are all in the world before we trust in Christ Jesus. But the context shows a back and forth between Jesus and the Pharisees. They claimed to follow God but Jesus is showing them that they really do not for if they did they would know who He is and would trust Him.

 

[Brightfame52]

The Preaching of the Word of God spreads a light on people's sinfulness...Does it "regenerate?" I don't think so...Regeneration cannot occur until something is accepted...like the truth of the Word....I think your process is messed up there......As others believe it is also.

Regeneration is done by the Spirit, and its needed before the preaching can be believed. 2 Thess 2:13-14

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The Sanctifying Work of the Spirit or Regeneration, came before the Call of the Gospel, and was prepatory to it. Belief of the Truth results from the sanctifying work of the Spirit, thats the Mechanics.

 

[Silverhair]

Regeneration is done by the Spirit, and its needed before the preaching can be believed. 2 Thess 2:13-14

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The Sanctifying Work of the Spirit or Regeneration, came before the Call of the Gospel, and was prepatory to it. Belief of the Truth results from the sanctifying work of the Spirit, thats the Mechanics.

In a theological sense, regeneration is called the new birth Webster

Only found in Mat_19:28 and Tit_3:5. This word literally means a “new birth.” The Greek word so rendered (palingenesia G3824) is used by classical writers with reference to the changes produced by the return of spring. In Mat_19:28 the word is equivalent to the “restitution of all things” (Act_3:21). In Tit_3:5 it denotes that change of heart elsewhere spoken of as a passing from death to life (1Jn_3:14); becoming a new creature in Christ Jesus (2Co_5:17); being born again (Joh_3:5); a renewal of the mind (Rom_12:2); a resurrection from the dead (Eph_2:6); a being quickened (Eph_2:1, Eph_2:5). Easton

The new birth and "regeneration" do not represent successive stages in spiritual experience, they refer to the same event but view it in different aspects. The new birth stresses the communication of spiritual life in contrast to antecedent spiritual death; "regeneration" stresses the inception of a new state of things in contrast with the old;... Vine NT

So BF you have people saved before they even hear and believe the gospel message, but that is not what the bible says.
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

As the bible tells us
Rom 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

That is why we are told to preach the gospel
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.

And this is the promise of God
Joh 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:

So as you can see from scripture a man must trust in Christ Jesus before they are regenerated/born again/saved.
Rom_3:24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

 

[Brightfame52]

In a theological sense, regeneration is called the new birth Webster

Only found in Mat_19:28 and Tit_3:5. This word literally means a “new birth.” The Greek word so rendered (palingenesia G3824) is used by classical writers with reference to the changes produced by the return of spring. In Mat_19:28 the word is equivalent to the “restitution of all things” (Act_3:21). In Tit_3:5 it denotes that change of heart elsewhere spoken of as a passing from death to life (1Jn_3:14); becoming a new creature in Christ Jesus (2Co_5:17); being born again (Joh_3:5); a renewal of the mind (Rom_12:2); a resurrection from the dead (Eph_2:6); a being quickened (Eph_2:1, Eph_2:5). Easton

The new birth and "regeneration" do not represent successive stages in spiritual experience, they refer to the same event but view it in different aspects. The new birth stresses the communication of spiritual life in contrast to antecedent spiritual death; "regeneration" stresses the inception of a new state of things in contrast with the old;... Vine NT

So BF you have people saved before they even hear and believe the gospel message, but that is not what the bible says.
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

As the bible tells us
Rom 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

That is why we are told to preach the gospel
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.

And this is the promise of God
Joh 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:

So as you can see from scripture a man must trust in Christ Jesus before they are regenerated/born again/saved.
Rom_3:24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

First regeneration or new birth, then after that, belief of the Truth 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Peter says the same but he uses the word obedience 1 Pet 1:2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Obedience to the Gospel follows sanctification of the Spirit.

Thats what occurred with Lydia, she had been sanctified by the Spirit, then she believed, obeyed the Gospel

 

[Silverhair]

First regeneration or new birth, then after that, belief of the Truth 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Peter says the same but he uses the word obedience 1 Pet 1:2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Obedience to the Gospel follows sanctification of the Spirit.

Thats what occurred with Lydia, she had been sanctified by the Spirit, then she believed, obeyed the Gospel

BF you can deny scripture all you want but it does not change the truth. You would rather follow an errant theology than the bible. That is your lose.

 

[Brightfame52]

BF you can deny scripture all you want but it does not change the truth. You would rather follow an errant theology than the bible. That is your lose.

Tis you who deny scripture, you havent a clue

 

[Silverhair]

Tis you who deny scripture, you havent a clue

BF you are just sounding frustrated that I do not fall into line with your errant view. I have given you scripture that shows that your view is error but you do not want to accept what the Holy Spirit says so you trust what some man has said. That is the error of your thinking. You follow the wrong teacher.

 

[kyredneck]

Tis you who deny scripture, you havent a clue

Oh, he knows what he's doing, he's on board to get his Calvinist-bashing fix.

(beware of becoming a Calvinist-basher basher, it can become addictive for certain types...)

edit:

(beware of becoming a Calvinist-basher basher, it can become just as addictive as Calvinist-bashing)

 

[Silverhair]

Oh, he knows what he's doing, he's on board to get his Calvinist-bashing fix.

(beware of becoming a Calvinist-basher basher, it can become addictive for certain types...)

edit:

(beware of becoming a Calvinist-basher basher, it can become just as addictive as Calvinist-bashing)

KY you know you are just tells fibs. You just do not like someone pointing out your errors in logic and theology. It really has nothing to do with you being a Calvinist or not. It is just the lack of a biblical connection in your posts.

I do note that it seems to be the Calvinist's on this board that are prone to use negative pejoratives and condescending comments. Unfortunately some of them do not seem able to have a civil exchange of views. I have had to put some of the worst offenders on ignore and it looks like I may have to add more to that list.

 

[AVL1984]

Regeneration is done by the Spirit, and its needed before the preaching can be believed. 2 Thess 2:13-14

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The Sanctifying Work of the Spirit or Regeneration, came before the Call of the Gospel, and was prepatory to it. Belief of the Truth results from the sanctifying work of the Spirit, thats the Mechanics.

Sanctification isn't regeneration....Sorry, but, that position just doesn't fly here.

 

[Brightfame52]

BF you are just sounding frustrated that I do not fall into line with your errant view. I have given you scripture that shows that your view is error but you do not want to accept what the Holy Spirit says so you trust what some man has said. That is the error of your thinking. You follow the wrong teacher.

You are frustrated, and dont have a clue.