Featured The two witnesses

Much of what I study is from Matthew Henry, Newell, John Gill. I have looked at some of the Expositors commentaries. Ever seen Henry's work and writing or do you avoid all those old time teachers and go with the more modern ones who started the views you have? I also have read some of M.R. Dehaan's and Ironside, some of theirs I don't agree with but others I do. As with all I don't take everything I read from them as truth. I allow the Holy spirit to be my guide on what I accept and do not accept. Just I cannot see you view as truth, the Spirit convicts me that it is not and if it cannot mesh with unfulfilled Old Testament Promises through that prophecy it cannot be accepted as truth.

 

We see in Genesis these tribes:
a. Rueben
b. Simeon
c. Levi
d. Judah
e. Zebulun
f. Issachar
g. Dan
h. Gad
i. Asher
j. Naphtali
k. of Joseph
1. Ephraim
2. Mannesseh
l. Benjamin

7. The list from Revelation 7 goes like this:
a. Judah
b. Reuben
c. Gad
d. Asher
e. Naphtali
f. Manasseseh
g. Simeon
h. Levi
i. Issachar
j. Zebulon
k. Joseph
l. Benjamin
8. One tribe from Genesis 49 is missing left totally out. That tribe is Dan. Also there is no mention of Ephraim.

Why is Dan omitted you might wonder.

One of Joseph’s sons is added along with Joseph, so Joseph gets the double portion.

Note from the historical record in the book of Judges, that Dan was the first tribe to go into idolatry. thus he is left out. ephraim also went into idolatry and thus is left out of these tribes. But here are the 144,000.

Daniel 7:23-25 Parallel the Beast in Revelation 23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.
25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Daniel 11:29-40 fits in parallel to the beast in revelation. At the time appointed he shall return, and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter.
30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.
31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.
40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.

The key is of course the Beast in Revelation setting his image up in the temple and requiring them to worship his image, thus the abomination which maketh desolate, the temple in Israel in Jerusalem will be made desolate of worshiping God to worship the image of the beast.

Yet the likeness of antichrist will be placed in the temple in Jerusalem. That will be the abomination that maketh desolate spoken of by Daniel. Jesus referred to this in Matthew 24:15. This image is the abomination that maketh desolate set up in the temple in Jerusalem. The image of the first beast out of the sea, the function to which this beast out of the earth devotes himself is religious, not secular.

 

It is interesting and hypocritical that you say I prove your point when earlier you make the disparaging remarks about me:

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I did not make your point. Every passage of Scripture that speaks of the return of Jesus Christ states He will return in the full Glory of The Godhead.



MATTHEW 16:27
27. For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

MATTHEW 19:28
28. And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

MATTHEW 24:30, 31
30. And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

MATTHEW 25:31, 32
31. When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32. And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

MATTHEW 26:64
64. Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven

MARK 8:38
38. Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

2 THESSALONIANS 1:5-10
5. Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:
6. Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;
7. And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8. In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9. Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
10. When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

REVELATION 1:7
7. Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

REVELATION 19:11-16
11. And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
12. His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14. And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
16. And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

The above Scripture clearly teach that when Jesus Christ returns it will be in the full Glory of the Godhead.

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John 5:28, 29
28. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29. And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

 

The truth is that the passage is not to be understood literally! The truth also is that in the Old Testament Ephraim is sometimes used to refer to the Northern tribes.

Hosea 4:16, 17
16 For Israel slideth back as a backsliding heifer: now the LORD will feed them as a lamb in a large place.
17 Ephraim is joined to idols: let him alone.

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There are two truths certain about Scripture:

1} There is only one correct interpretation of Scripture!

2} The Holy Spirit does not teach error!

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The truth is that John nelson Darby is the Father of pre-trib-dispensationalism!

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No problem, any time!

 

Where did I disparage you?

 

All the false remarks below are disparaging and insulting. You say "So you believe:"

1. that in His glory on the day of His resurrection the Disciples couldn't be with Him nor see Him?

2. He didn't physically in His resurrection body come into the upper room

3. so we need to by your teaching to discard that portion of scripture, because as you say no man can look on His glory.

4. Therefore with what you teach His resurrected Human Body in you was just figuratively raised from the dead is that what you are saying?

5. That would mean that you believe His human body is still in a grave somewhere.

6. That refutes the doctrine taught by the apostles.

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But that is the typical pre-trib-dispensational approach.

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I had no intent to treat you like dirt. Honestly, I can't remember what instance you are referring to. I have been through the rodeo more than once and all I was saying it is worthless to continue with it as neither side will give in.

 

So you believe is meant to ask if that is what you believe. So you believe and yo say no I believe this way or that. Didn't mean it as disparaging.

 

The 1260 days is significant as it coincides with 3 1/2 years using the Babylonian calendar of 360 days per year.
The passage of the 3 1/2 years marks the "harpazo" of believing Jews and also marks the beginning of the Wrath of God.
Not to be confused with the "harpazo" of the Body of Christ into heaven, which takes place before the beginning of Daniel's 70th "week" (shabuwa` of years).
I believe that Jeremiah teaches a literal Babylon on the banks of the Euphrates. I agree with that.
I would also add that the two witnesses are (1) Enoch (pre-flood witness, never "died") and (2) Elijah (under the Law, never "died").

 

Well I see it as Moses and Elijah since they met with Christ on the Mount of Transfiguration and the Tribulation in which they will witness is a Jewish period of time.

 

Not that I agree with him any more... but I think the safest assumption for the witnesses from a dispie viewpoint was made by Arnold Fruchtenbaum. He believed that the witnesses are 2 unidentified people, cause really that is the extent of what we can say.

 

I agree that it is a "Jewish period of time", however, the entire world rejoices when the two witnesses martyred.
This is God's "last attempt" to reach the entire world (not just Israel) with the truth of Messiah. After they reject that,
there is nothing God can do, and God's wrath begins to be poured out on an unbelieving world (last 3 1/2 years of Daniels 70th "week").
Almost nothing is known of the pre-flood world, but we know that Enoch was the first prophet, so he warned "that generation" (wherein only Noah & family was saved).
There is a lot implied with this view, which deserves further consideration. Could it be a "Jewish time" when Israel preaches the Gospel of the (coming) Kingdom (to the world)?

 

There is nothing in Scripture that supports the "snatching away by force" of the Church. The Church, churches, will be here until after the 7th trumpet sounds {Revelation 11:15-19} at which time:

1. Jesus Christ returns with the souls of the deceased Saints,

2. The general resurrection of all the dead occurs {John 5:28, 29},

3. The souls of the returning Saints are reunited with their resurrection bodies,

4. Those still living are given resurrection {incorruptible} bodies {1 Corinthians 15:51ff},

5. The Great White Throne judgment takes place, {Revelation 20:11ff}

6. Satan and his are cast into the Lake of Fire, {Revelation 20:10}

7. The Triune God dwells with all the redeemed of all time in the New heavens and New Earth. {Revelation 21:1ff}

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No real mystery here if people will simply let Scripture speak instead of John Nelson Darby and Cyrus Scofield.

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Deut. 34, Hebrews 9:27

Moses has died and was buried. If one of the witnesses is him that means he dies twice, and I don't think that is scriptural.

Elijah rode to heaven on a chariot, so I do see where one of them could be him, but the other could not be Moses.

 

The two witnesses are Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron.

 

They get my vote!

 

Who did the three Disciples see with Jesus on the Mount of Transfiguration? They are identified as Moses and Elijah. Many see the two prophets in the Tribulation as Moses and Elijah due to that fact.