Theistic evolution or non-theistic evolution

[Yeshua1]

I see you did not address points I made, that reveal great differences between HUMAN men and the man called Jesus.

It is not heresy to say Jesus was not Human. It is heresy to deny Jesus came in the Flesh, which is nothing I have said.

You expand the Scripture. Scripture says Jesus was a man. Scripture NEVER says Jesus was a HUMAN man.

There can ONLY be human men! What else are the others, Bigfoots?

 

[Yeshua1]

No.

According to Scripture; The distinction is between;

A MAN (form) who is a created human.
AND
A MAN (form) who is a created spirit.
AND
A MAN (form) who is thee (not created) Spirit of God.

Would you agree;

A MAN (form) who is human;
is a "created" "form" out of Dust of the Earth?
..............Gen 2 [7] And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,

A MAN (form) who is spirit;
is a "created" "form" and from Heaven?
..............Gen.2 [1] Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

A MAN (form) who is God;
...............EX 15 [3] The LORD is a man of war
...............Phil 2 [5] Christ Jesus:
...............Phil 2 [6] Who, being in the form of God,
is Spirit?
..............John 4: [24] God is a Spirit:
"is not a created" "form"?
...............Pss 90 [2] ...from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.
is ALL places?
...............Jer 23: [24] Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the LORD.
Heaven is His "created" Throne?
................Gen 1 [1] In the beginning God created the heaven
................Isa 66 [1] Thus saith the LORD, The heaven is my throne

Scripture is clear;
Mankind (a human) has a FORM, (called man).
God (Spirit) has a FORM, (called Man).
Men of the earth (ie humans) were "created" in the likeness and image of God.
Humans reproduce humans.
God is everlasting and DOES NOT, CAN NOT reproduce gods.

There IS a distinction, and it is not artificial.

You deny that Jesus became a full human in the Incarnation, so that is heresy!

 

[Yeshua1]

I'm sorry but nothing you wrote or the verses you quote show any clarity towards what you are saying. I'm sure it makes sense in your mind but I'm afraid it stops there.

It is great that you are passionate about scripture but I suggest some study in the field of biblical hermeneutics which is the study of how to interpret scripture in a way that is based on the text itself and not our preconceived understandings or wild ideas that have no basis in the words that we are reading. Without the framework of biblical hermeneutics, anyone can make the bible say almost anything they want by doing what you are doing, taking bits and pieces of verses out of their context and making connections between completely unrelated passages and inserting meaning that isn't actually there.

The text book I've used in hermeneutics is Introduction to Biblical Hermeneutics by Klein, Blomberg and Hubbard.

The bible is very clear that Jesus was/is both fully God and fully human, so to deny either aspect woul;d be holding to a heresy!

 

[Happy]

There can ONLY be human men!

Well....hummm. ding, ding, ding.... NON-HUMAN men....

EXOD 15 [3] The LORD is a man...

Perhaps you think the LORD is a created HUMAN MAN, out of the dust of the EARTH (He created)....

Gen.18
[1] And the LORD appeared unto him (Abraham) in the plains of Mamre:

Gen 18
[2] And he (Abraham) lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him:

Perhaps you think the LORD and the Angels with the LORD, being looked upon by Abraham, all called MEN, were HUMAN MEN.....

I have already been very explicit;
Humans are created men out of the earth.
God is Spirit, also called a man, is not created and is not a HUMAN MAN out of the earth.
Angels are created spirits, also called a man, but are not HUMAN MEN created out of the earth.

What else are the others, Bigfoots?

Already explained to you. Seriously? You think "bigfoots" were introduced to a conversation about Biblical knowledge and the understanding thereof?

 

[Yeshua1]

The Deity of Jesus is eternal, but his humanity was indeed created, its called the Incarnation!

 

[Happy]

The Deity of Jesus is eternal, but his humanity was indeed created, its called the Incarnation!

Human men were created.

Jesus' taking upon Himself the FORM of a Human man, did not MAKE Jesus a HUMAN MAN.

Perhaps you are unaware, that which exists and IS NOT created CAN NOT BECOME CREATED.

Jesus CAN, HAS, DID and WILL appear in the likeness as a HUMAN MAN; However you SHOULD definitively TRUST and KNOW He IS the Lord, ABOVE ALL Lords, WHO speaks and things appear, WHOSE POWER is what effects creations to BE created.

And IF and WHEN YOU accomplish being in the LIKENESS of JESUS; that will not MAKE you God......
any more than JESUS being in the LIKENESS of a HUMAN MAN; makes Him a HUMAN man.

 

[Yeshua1]

Human men were created.

Jesus' taking upon Himself the FORM of a Human man, did not MAKE Jesus a HUMAN MAN.

Perhaps you are unaware, that which exists and IS NOT created CAN NOT BECOME CREATED.

Jesus CAN, HAS, DID and WILL appear in the likeness as a HUMAN MAN; However you SHOULD definitively TRUST and KNOW He IS the Lord, ABOVE ALL Lords, WHO speaks and things appear, WHOSE POWER is what effects creations to BE created.

And IF and WHEN YOU accomplish being in the LIKENESS of JESUS; that will not MAKE you God......
any more than JESUS being in the LIKENESS of a HUMAN MAN; makes Him a HUMAN man.

Jesus was born of a woman, as a human, who was also God, so again, to deny His humanity is to commit heresy!

 

[Happy]

Jesus was born of a woman, as a human, who was also God, so again, to deny His humanity is to commit heresy!

And?
Human men become born of God. Do you think that makes you a god?

What you fail to comprehend is Jesus (NOT SPERM, that enters a woman's Fallopian tubes) had to ENTER Mary's womb, before He could come forth from her womb.

Human men are procreated VIA a human male sperm fertilizing a human female egg IN the females Fallopian tubes. No such things apply to Jesus.

John.1

1. [13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Is it you don't understand scripture or you don't believe scripture?

 

[Gold Dragon]

The bible is very clear that Jesus was/is both fully God and fully human, so to deny either aspect woul;d be holding to a heresy!

Yes. He advocates a form of docetism which the early church declared heretical in the third century. He believes scripture supports him because of poor hermeneutics.

 

[Yeshua1]

Yes. He advocates docetism which the early church declared heretical in the third century. He believes scripture supports him because of poor hermeneutics.

To deny Jesus would make him like what JW hold to, as the archangel while on earth, and now a spirit creature!

 

[Gold Dragon]

To deny Jesus would make him like what JW hold to, as the archangel while on earth, and now a spirit creature!

I guess that puts him in a similar category as JWs as having significant problems with their christology. But their error is quite different to Happy's. The JWs believe Jesus is not God. I don't think Happy would go that far. I think he is still Trinitarian. It just his understanding of Jesus' personhood and dual nature that is incorrect, primarily because he has created an artificial distinction between the concepts of man and human, which is an English language phenomenon not found in the Greek.

 

[Yeshua1]

I guess that puts him in a similar category as JWs as having significant problems with their christology. But their error is quite different to Happy's. The JWs believe Jesus is not God. I don't think Happy would go that far. I think he is still Trinitarian. It just his understanding of Jesus' personhood and dual nature that is incorrect, primarily because he has created an artificial distinction between the concepts of man and human, which is an English language phenomenon not found in the Greek.

That Jesus would be God, and yet would be not a real human, so would be God "faking" being one of us, and being tempted in all things as we are, as that Jesus would just be God.

 

[BobRyan]

I'm just wondering, is this board mainly to discuss theistic evolution vs creationism, or is it non-theistic evolution? The resaon I ask, is that everyone who posts to these boards, is supposed to give a faith statement. Therefore I can't imagine that any atheists would be hanging out here. Is it fair to say that everyone here who believes in evolution is still a Christian?

Turns out -- there is almost no difference between the two.

 

[Yeshua1]

Turns out -- there is almost no difference between the two.

Between Atheism and theistic Evolution?