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"Torah Observant"
- Thread starter annsni
- Start date
It is clear. Anyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God.
Now that we are born of God, we love God.
Now that we love God, we want to do all we can to show that love. Like my own children love me and obey me because they love me, I obey God because I love Him and want to please Him.
Hi annsni
You havent addressed verse 2
[2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS
The above response demonstrates there is no hope to attempt any kind of rational and reasonable discussion with you. You have not proven my exposition is mere opinion. You simply assert it is and expect readers to take your word for it! I don't require that kind of stupidity from any reader. I require them to use their God given mind and to obey Paul's command to "prove all things" by the contextual evidence that I place before them. You either are not capable of doing that or are not willing and yet you want to speak authoritative about what the Bible does and does not teach. That is simply irrational. You cannot teach what you do not know and you cannot condemn the intepretation of others if you cannot demonstrate by reasonable evidence their interpretation is incorrect.
Any reader looking at the response above and the other response that suggests we just provide competing lists of proof texts and thus pit scripture against scripture demonstrate you are not competent to teach anyone anything about this subject.
Your response to my exposition demonstrates you do not have any inward spiritual ability to discern or accept truth regardless how simple it is broken down and fed to you. The sad thing is this is true concerning the very truth that is necessary to beleive to be saved.
Hence, there is no point to continue this discussion. Instead I will pray for you that God may have mercy on your soul and give you a new heart that is able to preceive truth, see truth and hear truth. Until He does this it is like telling a blind man to see and a deaf man to hear.
So i guess what your saying is you have no scriptures to back up your interpreted opinions. Dont feel bad good Dr. I have found this is the case for "many"
Hi annsni
You havent addressed verse 2
[2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS
I believe I have. We keep God's commandments because we love Him. What is confusing about that?
ISAIAH 30
[15] For thus saith the Lord GOD, the Holy One of Israel; In returning and rest shall ye be saved; in quietness and in confidence shall be your strength: and ye would not.[16] But ye said, No; for we will flee upon horses; therefore shall ye flee: and, We will ride upon the swift; therefore shall they that pursue you be swift.
[17] One thousand shall flee at the rebuke of one; at the rebuke of five shall ye flee: till ye be left as a beacon upon the top of a mountain, and as an ensign on an hill
See ya later Doc
[15] For thus saith the Lord GOD, the Holy One of Israel; In returning and rest shall ye be saved; in quietness and in confidence shall be your strength: and ye would not.[16] But ye said, No; for we will flee upon horses; therefore shall ye flee: and, We will ride upon the swift; therefore shall they that pursue you be swift.
[17] One thousand shall flee at the rebuke of one; at the rebuke of five shall ye flee: till ye be left as a beacon upon the top of a mountain, and as an ensign on an hill
See ya later Doc
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I believe I have. We keep God's commandments because we love Him. What is confusing about that?
You do? Do you keep His 4th {His sabbath}
How about the commandment concerning graven images? Are they all around your church? In your house or car? Around your neck?
You do? Do you keep His 4th {His sabbath}
How about the commandment concerning graven images? Are they all around your church? In your house or car? Around your neck?
I keep Jesus' commands. I do not need to keep the commands that were not given to me. The 10 Commandments were given to the Israelites in the desert.
However, I don't have graven images in my home, church, car or even around my neck. Additionally, Jesus is my Sabbath.
I keep Jesus' commands. I do not need to keep the commands that were not given to me. The 10 Commandments were given to the Israelites in the desert.However, I don't have graven images in my home, church, car or even around my neck. Additionally, Jesus is my Sabbath.
They were also given to you to obey IF you believe the new testament scriptures
LUKE 18 [20] Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
The translated word for commandments in the above scripture is “entole”. As you can see its the 10 commandments. No doubt about it.
MATTHEW 19 [16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? [17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. [18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, [19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
The translated word for commandments in Matthew 19 is “entole”. Again the 10 commandments.
1 JOHN 5 [2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. [3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
The translated word for commandments in 1 John 5 is “entole”. Same exact word used in Luke and again in Matthew. Yup, Gods very own ten commandments.
HEBREWS 11 [22] By faith Joseph, when he died, made mention of the departing of the children of Israel; and gave COMMANDMENT concerning his bones.
entellomai,;from Greek 1722 (en) and the base of Greek 5056 (telos); to enjoin :- (give) charge, (give) command (-ments), injoin. Not the 10 commandments, but a simple command.
JOHN 14 [15] If ye love me, keep my COMMANDMENTS. [16] And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; [17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
These commandments are translated from the word “entole”. Same “entole” you find in Luke and again in Matthew. Gods 10 commandments.
REVELATION 22 [14] Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
The word commandments found in Rev.22 is in the greek the word entole. Pretty simple to figure out what the greek word "entole" means my Long Island friends.
Additionally, Jesus is my Sabbath.
Not sure i know what your saying here. Could you show me scripture to back up that statement.
Dr. Walter
New Member
So i guess what your saying is you have no scriptures to back up your interpreted opinions. Dont feel bad good Dr. I have found this is the case for "many"
More obvious evidence I have diagnosed your problem correctly. There is no rational thinking being expressed in your responses. Rational discussion is impossible with an irrational person.
More obvious evidence I have diagnosed your problem correctly. There is no rational thinking being expressed in your responses. Rational discussion is impossible with an irrational person.
Well Hello Doc
Didnt think i would be seeing you so soon. How ya been old boy. I really missed ya
Just funin ya Doc
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However, I don't have graven images in my home, church, car or even around my neck.
I belonged to a baptist church for a couple months when i 1st started to study the Word. There were crosses with the figure of a man all over the church i went to. Why is yours different? Prophecy points out that the gentiles would ignore this commandment
JEREMIAH 16 [19] O Lord, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ends of the earth, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit. [20] Shall a man make gods unto himself, and they are no gods?
No matter what kind of spin you might put on this commandment it wont matter. You could have the good Doctor do a 3 page disertation on why your now allowed to make these images. It wont matter. The Word will stand as written.
OK. So how do you interpret scripture below
1 JOHN 5 [1] Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. [2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
GE:
Your 'opinion' is obvious in this.
But you are blind to the meaning of the passage.
1 JOHN 5
Whosoever _BELIEVETH_ that Jesus is the Christ _IS_ born of God (before anything else): and every one that _LOVETH_ God also loveth Him that IS BEGOTTEN, _OF GOD_.
BY THIS (that we are ALL begotten of God) we _KNOW_ that _WHEN_ we love God and keep his commandments, we love the children (or begotten) of God also.
For this is the love _OF GOD_, that we keep his commandments: (it is not ‘of OURSELVES’). For indeed his commandments are not grievous” but relieving for we are saved BY GRACE only. “My yoke is light.”
I keep Jesus' commands. I do not need to keep the commands that were not given to me. The 10 Commandments were given to the Israelites in the desert.
However, I don't have graven images in my home, church, car or even around my neck. Additionally, Jesus is my Sabbath.
GE:
Perfect Roman Catholics.
You DO NOT keep Jesus' commandments; you don't even know what they are. You obviously do not know that Jesus' Commandments are thousand times more grievous than the Ten Commandments or the commandments for the transgression of them.
If you kept Jesus' commandments you would not have needed Him for a Saviour.
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Not sure i know what your saying here. Could you show me scripture to back up that statement.
Hebrews 4.
I belonged to a baptist church for a couple months when i 1st started to study the Word. There were crosses with the figure of a man all over the church i went to. Why is yours different? Prophecy points out that the gentiles would ignore this commandment
You must not have been in any Baptist church that I would know about. None of the ones that I've ever seen have had a crucifix. Each one instead has a cross. It's some of the other churches - Catholic and Episcopal are two that I know of - that have Jesus still on the cross.
JEREMIAH 16 [19] O Lord, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ends of the earth, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit. [20] Shall a man make gods unto himself, and they are no gods?
No matter what kind of spin you might put on this commandment it wont matter. You could have the good Doctor do a 3 page disertation on why your now allowed to make these images. It wont matter. The Word will stand as written.
What kind of spin are you talking about? What commandment is there in Jeremiah 16 that you listed? You mean having no gods before God? No worries there. I do wonder about the area you live though. Even in the most heathen northeast I do not experience what you are saying in Baptist and Baptist-like churches.
GE:
Perfect Roman Catholics.
You DO NOT keep Jesus' commandments; you don't even know what they are. You obviously do not know that Jesus' Commandments are thousand times more grievous than the Ten Commandments or the commandments for the transgression of them.
If you kept Jesus' commandments you would not have needed Him for a Saviour.
Oh? Even were I to keep every commandment, as this rich young ruler said he did, I would STILL need a Savior. But I do fall. I admit that. I do things I don't want to do but as I mature in the faith, I do those things less and less as the Spirit in me refines me.
Oh? Even were I to keep every commandment, as this rich young ruler said he did, I would STILL need a Savior. But I do fall. I admit that.
Aint no doubt about it. Annsni. Your words above are perfect. Praise be the Lord!!! Yeshua...the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords
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You must not have been in any Baptist church that I would know about. None of the ones that I've ever seen have had a crucifix. Each one instead has a cross. It's some of the other churches - Catholic and Episcopal are two that I know of - that have Jesus still on the cross.
It was about 20 yrs ago and you are most likely right. Thank you for the correction. I just took it for granted that this was the way it was.
Additionally, Jesus is my Sabbath.
I asked you where in scripture do you find that Jesus is now your sabbath rest and you directed me to Hebrews 4. Went through the whole chapter and could not find even a hint of that
HEBREWS 4
[1] Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.[2] For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.[3] FOR WE WHICH HAVE BELIEVED DO ENTER INTO REST, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
Have faith in the WORD. Enter into Gods rest. His sabbath day.
[4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works.[5] And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
Yup, the 7th day. That’s Gods sabbath day alright.
[6] Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:[7] Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
Some, to whom it was first preached had the spirit of unbelief and did not enter the sabbath rest (Ezek.20). They were destroyed. Do you hear his voice today? Right now. Don’t harden your heart as they did.
[8] For IF JESUS HAD GIVEN THEM REST, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.[9] THERE REMAINETH THEREFORE A REST to the people of God.
You’ve heard the many say “Jesus is my rest”. Well…verse 8 contradicts that? Anyways the rest (sabbath) remains. Ive heard “the many” say verse 9 is speaking of the 1000 yr period of rest. That rest has not yet arrived, so how could it remain? Oh well. Another thing that bothers me is the fact that many of the new books have changed the name of Jesus to Joshua. Why? What are they trying to hide? Plain to see. The "many" claim Jesus is their rest, while the bible (verse 8) says quite the opposite. Thus the need for the change of names
[10] For HE THAT IS ENTERED INTO HIS REST, he also hath ceased from his own works, AS GOD DID FROM HIS. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
Of course the above verses are speaking of the sabbath. Enter into the rest as God also did. Verse 4 says God entered into rest on the seventh day. The sabbath. Verse 11 says we are to enter into that very same rest.
Ive seen pages and pages written about above scriptures trying to explain that it doesnt really mean what it says. Just believe what it says and enter into the rest GOD created for us. The rest that sanctifys us and sets believers apart from those with the spirit of unbelief, like those who were destroyed in the wilderness (Ezek.20). Don’t harden your heart.