what happens if you die while you're sinning? Pt. 2

[James_Newman]

Romans 3:26-28
26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

 

[DeafPosttrib]

James,

The passage of Romans 3:26-28 is correct.

We do not saved by keep the laws, we do not saved by doing good works. We are saved by our FAITH only.

Notice, the word, 'faith' always often emphasis throughout in the Bible from the Old Testament to New Testament. Salvation always come through the faith only according Ephesians 2:8-9, not of by good works.

How did Abraham was saved? By through his Faith. What was his example of his faith?

Hebrews chapter 11 mentioned the list of the Old Testament saints of their faith, what they had done by through their ACTION with faith.

Also, we all know that God is holy, and in the heaven is a holy place. Heaven have no sin. We cannot enter into the heaven because of sins. We have confess our sins to Christ to forgive us our sins through his blood.

But, that is not all. Also, we are commanded to be holy life, because God is holy according to 1 Peter 1:15-16. Or else, we shall persih without repentance.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

[Claudia_T]

James,

Jesus had to die for two reasons...

1. Because the Law COULD NOT be abolished... it is the very character of God. Rom:3:31: Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

2. Because He offers His life and death as a sacrifice for our sins... IN ORDER THAT we will turn from our rebellion against God and walking in HIS ways instead of our own.
1Jn:3:8: He that committeth sin is of the devil ; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Jesus didnt die to give us license to sin!

He died so that we would be able to obey God.

Look, there arent going to be any rebels in Heaven!


God sent His son Jesus that we might be TRANSFORMED by the renewing of your mind...

If you decide to hang onto your sins then you are going to be detroyed with your sins.

If you rely only on the sacrifice of Jesus for your sins and trust to His merit, AND AND AND if it is in your heart to obey God THEN Jesus wil covr you with His blood and not until then.

Jesus will NOT cover the unrepentant sinner. PERIOD!!

Isa:30:1,9:
Woe to the rebellious children, saith the LORD, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin... this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the LORD

Who does THAT describe? hmmmmmmmmm??

 

[J. Jump]

In order to inherit eternal life

Here's the issue. You are comparing spiritual salvation with inheritance. Those aren't the same thing. Spiritual salvation is by grace through faith not of works. Grace is a gift not an inheritance.

So where it is speaking of inheriting eternal life can not be talking about salvation by grace through faith, becuase the context will not allow it.

Trying to make those two verses speak of the same thing is a contradiction, because a gift and inheritance are two totally different things.

We accept Jesus' death and shed blood as our substitute we are in possession of salvation. There is nothing that we have to wait for.

So again inheriting eternal life based on works and endurance can't be speaking to salvation by grace through faith.

 

[James_Newman]

Originally posted by Claudia_T:

Isa:30:1,9:
Woe to the rebellious children, saith the LORD, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin... this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the LORD

Who does THAT describe? hmmmmmmmmm??

It's funny you should ask. That describes the majority of Christiandom. And indeed, woe to anyone who thinks that they can sin without consequence. But I feel sorry for anyone who can't accept the free grace of God and thinks that somehow they have to have a part in their salvation.

 

[Claudia_T]

YOU CANNOT claim the blood of Jesus if you are unrepentant!

Dont you know that the works determine whether you have genuine faith or not??


Jms:2:14: What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him ?

(obvious answer is NO)

Jesus: "they that have DONE GOOD" shall come forth "unto the resurrection of life." John 5:29.

"I beheld," says the prophet Daniel, "till thrones were placed, and One that was Ancient of Days did sit: His raiment was white as snow, and the hair of His head like pure wool; His throne was fiery flames, and the wheels thereof burning fire. A fiery stream issued and came forth from before Him: thousand thousands ministered unto Him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before Him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened." Daniel 7:9, 10

There are books of record in heaven, and the names and deeds of men are registered there to determine the outcome of judgment
Daniel says: "The judgment was set, and the books were opened." And he ges on to say: "Another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works." Revelation 20:12.
Then there is the BOOK OF LIFE which has all the names of those who have ever claimed to follow God.
Jesus said: "Rejoice, because your names are written in heaven." Luke 10:20. Paul even said, "whose names are in the book of life." Philippians 4:3.
Revelation 21:27 says that the ONLY ones who enter the gates of heaven are those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of Life. Daniel said God’s people would be delivered "everyone that shall be found written in the book."
"Behold, it is written before Me, . . . your iniquities, and the iniquities of your fathers together, saith the Lord." Isaiah 65:6, 7.
"For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil." Ecclesiastes 12:14
Jesus said: "By thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned." Matthew 12:36, 37
God "will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts." I Corinthians 4:5.
James: "So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty." James 2:12
James ALSO talks about those who in the judgment are "accounted worthy" will have a part in the resurrection of the just.

Jesus: "they that have done good" shall come forth "unto the resurrection of life." John 5:29.
Jesus: "They which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, . . . are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection." Luke 20:35, 36.
"Whosoever hath sinned against Me, him will I blot out of My book." Exodus 32:33.
Ezekiel: "When the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, . . . all his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned." Ezekiel 18:24.
ONLY those who have repented of sin and who by faith claim the blood of Christ, AND become actual partakers of the righteousness of Christ will have their sins blotted out!
Isaiah: "I, even I, am He that blotteth out thy transgressions for Mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." Isaiah 43:25.
Jesus: "He that OVERCOMETH, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before My Father, and before His angels." Revelation 3:5;
"Whosoever therefore shall confess Me before men, him will I confess also before My Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny Me before men, him will I also deny before My Father which is in heaven." Matthew 10:32, 33.
Ti:1:16: They profess that they know God; BUT IN WORKS THEY DENY HIM him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Rv:20:12: And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rv:20:13: And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works .

You absolutely MUST repent and forsake your sins!!

When Jesus comes, NO MORE CHANCE!! Its OVER!!
"He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. And, behold, I come quickly; and My reward is with Me, to give every man ACCORDING TO HIS WORK shall be. " Revelation 22:11, 12.

 

[Claudia_T]

Jesus: "they that have DONE GOOD" shall come forth "unto the resurrection of life." John 5:29.

 

[DeafPosttrib]

J.J.,

Matthew 19:16-30 have do with salvation issue. No way, this passage could be apart from salvation. Because, a rich young man desired want to know how can he have ETERNAL LIFE. He was speaking of his future destiny beyond his death. It does matter with salvation. You cannot deny Matt. 19:16-30 is very clear speak of salvation issue, because of what Christ told so.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

[gekko]

lets lay it out simple style here:

sin unto death = wilful sin
sin not unto death = unwilful sin

read romans 7:14-end

 

[J. Jump]

DeafPostTrib,

Matthew 19 and the rich young ruler have absolutely nothing to do with salvation by grace through faith. There are two clear things that tell us this.

One the Jews were "saved" people already. They had already experienced God's grace through faith and were not in need of that message.

The other thing that tells us this was not about salvation by grace through faith is the context of the story.

What was this young man told to do? He wasn't told to believe. He was told to go DO something. He was told to do a work.

So can salvation by grace through faith come by our works? Not according to Ephesians 2:8-9.

If this passage in Matthew is talking about salvation by grace through faith then we have a clear contradiction in God's Word and we know that one of two things is possible. Either Matthew 19 doesn't talk about salvation by grace through fatih or God has contradicted Himself.

We know the latter is not possible, therefore the only conclusion that we can come to is that Matthew 19 doesn't have anything to do with salvation by grace through faith.

By the way if you will go to the original Greek language you will find that the word eternal is an adjective (aionios) which comes from the root word aion. Aion means a set amount of time with a beginning and an end.

So how can an adjective of a word that means time with a beginning and an end come to mean no time with no beginning and no end? How is that linguistically possible for the root word to mean something that is totally opposite of the adjective?

Can you think of another word in any other langauge that is like that?

 

[rbell]

Deafposttrib,

Just clearing up...it's LeBron James, not James Lebron.

(hey, might as well be factual, right?)

Anyhoo, back to today's silliness...

 

[Brother Bob]

James; You miss the whole point these brethren and sister have told you. None have said the Law gives salvation but you have the old sins against you and it takes faith in Christ and His Blood to wash you clean from your old sins. Now that you are clean can you go back to sinning, No!! that is what God said I will put my laws in their heart and write them in their mind. Then through the Holy Spirit you are able to fulfill the righteous of the Law by keeping the Lord's Commandments. These brethren speak well and sister so there is no need for me to add. I am proud of what I have just read from HP;, DP;, Claudia and gekko, if I understood all correctly, for it shows there are Christians that are able to explain the true doctrine as I have understood it all these years. I rest my case, amen

BBob

 

[standingfirminChrist]

DeafPostTrib referred to a verse in Matthew 24 saying the elect could be deceived.

That is not what the Bible says, it says 'if it were possible.' If it were possible again swings the pendulum back to the word impossible.

The word 'if' is a supposition word. It does not state absolute.

 

[J. Jump]

Brother Bob here again you miss what Scripture says. You say that you take your old sins to the cross where they are dealt with by faith in Christ's work on the cross.

That's where you need to end, becuase that's where the Bible ends. After that point (after faith) eternal salvation becomes a done deal. It's a closed case that is never to be reopened again.

Meaning what happens from that point forward has no bearing on that event that just took place.

That can be seen in Ephesians 2:8-9. It can also be seen in the footwashing ceremony.

Jesus was going to wash Peter. Peter said no way. Notice what Jesus said and what He did not say. When Peter said you are not going to wash me Jesus responded to Peter if I do not wash you then you have no part with Me. The key is "with" me. He did not say "in" Me. He said "with" Me. There is a HUGE difference.

So Peter says then wash all of me. Jesus responded that not all of him needed to be washed. Why is that? Becuase he was saved. His eternal destiny was already set. So he just needed parts of his body washed.

Why is that? So he could have a part "with" Christ. So what does "with" Christ mean. It means that if we don't repent of our sins, confess our sins, walk by faith, walk in the Spirit, etc...all of those things then we will have no part "with" Christ. What is Christ's part? The 1,000-year reign.

We will still be "in" Christ, we will just have no part "with" Christ.

Again if we would keep these two things separate our understanding would go so much more smoothly.

 

[Brother Bob]

JJ; You miss the point also. I am not saying you keep the Law to keep Salvation, I am saying you keep the Law because of Salvation. In other words you don't keep it but it keeps you through the Holy Spirit for He that is within you is stronger than he that is in the world. HP; explained a lot better than I have all of the last 3 or 4 days we been on this subject.

 

[DeafPosttrib]

standingfirminchrist,

I understand Matt. 24:24 very clear what Christ saying.

Of course, Christ is not saying that many elects will be deceived- ("aboslutely for sure"!).

He says, 'If it were possible'. He means that, NEVER, NEVER KNOW, it could be happen to any elect. Christ warns us, that we ought to watch out for false teachers and religions.

Matt. 7:15 commands us, that we MUST BE WATCH OUT for false teachers/pastors because of its context with Matt. 7:13-14, most are end up in hell, because being lead blind by the blind leaders.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

[J. Jump]

But Brother Bob you say that if it is not kept then the person goes to hell. Isn't that correct?

 

[Brother Bob]

I am saying "it will be kept" and if someone don't keep it they were never saved for God is stronger than the devil. That we are not of them who walk after the flesh but we walk after the Spirit.

 

[J. Jump]

There you have it...you are tying the law into eternal salvation where it doesn't belong.

Ephesians doesn't say that you are saved by grace through faith, but you really aren't saved unless you keep the law. It says by grace through faith period.

The law has nothing to do with eternal salvation, prior to, during or after salvation.

You do the same thing that all the other works people do. You try to say the right thing, but when it comes right down to the nitty gritty the truth eventually comes out. You are tying works to eternal salvation. You can convince yourself that you are not, but you clearly are.

 

[gekko]

J.Jump said "What was this young man told to do? He wasn't told to believe. He was told to go DO something. He was told to do a work."

yes. i can agree with that. but i believe you've worded it incorrectly. Jesus said to go and sell what he has and follow Him.

so Jesus told him to go sell his stuff - he didn't want to - he was greedy - coveteous. Jesus told him to not be coveteous (in so many words) which leads to Jesus essentially saying to the man "sin no more and follow me"

just like Jesus said to the woman caught in adultery. Jesus said "go and sin no more" he didn't say "go and sin a little less"