What or who is predestinated?

First of all, I am not your home boy. But since you brought the subject up, did you ever watch the Munsters in the 1960's?

 

It was actually Dale's post, saturneptune.

I wish the personal attacks would stop from both sides, already, and let's discuss these issues like brothers. I understand that even in families, there are quarrels, fighting and teasing, but at the end of the day, we are still brothers who will have an eternity to fellowship together. Let's get an early start now!

 

Who was predestinated to be conformed to the image of God's Son?

Those who, according to God's forknowledge, would obey the Gospel. Nobody was predestined to obey the Gospel. Those who God foreknew would obey the Gosple were predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son. It seems pretty simple to me.

BTW: If Christ has already made an efficacious atonement for the sins of an elect person, is that elect person actually lost during the period prior to their being saved? During the period before an elect person gets saved, how are they condemned already (for not believing) when their unbelief (which is a sin) has already been paid for by Christ on the cross?

Please do not answer these questions with more questions.

 

I would much rather stand up to you for all the remarks in the past you made against me if I have to stand up to someone. If you call him home boy what do you expect. I believe I remember you saying you was a "big" boy so go man go.
Don't forget the rooster though.

 

"Home boy" is a given and often used phrase that means..."local Buddy". I though he told us you guys are buddies and live close. If not..never mind.

So..you can not stand up to him. Ok...

 

Bob, I think he forgot the rooster.

 

Hello Blammo,

The elect.

This view is easily refuted for it is contrary to both common sense and Scripture!!! This has been shown over and over again. Election is to salvation, and therefore, must precede salvation. It is nonsense to talk about electing a man to something he already has. The man has salvation when he believes and hence election at that point would not be necessary.
ELECTION TOOK PLACE IN ETERNITY; SALVATION TAKES PLACE WHEN THE SINNER BELIEVES.

Are you talking to me...or God?

Yes...good idea. Only one thing. Its not in the Bible. Sorry

Get a new book. This has already been covered. Better yet...save your money by not buying a book and read the Bible. Another idea...read the thread.

You mean like Christ did?

 

Saturneptune;
The rooster won't forget him. You can count on that.

BTW James we are brothers in Christ.

 

Arthur,
If you cannot answer Blammo's question about the time before salvation in an elect person in a sane and civil manner, or if you do not know, try another thread.

 

It is what the Bible says:

Romans 8:28-30 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Once again, your arguement is not with me.

And, once again, you don't answer questions.

 

Hello webdog,

Let me submit to you this argument..

God harden the heart of Pharaoh...to bring glory to his name in the eyes of His people. God was about a take a ton of people home. It had nothing to do with Pharaoh choice. Knowing Pharaoh would sin God only used his sin, to glory His name. Each time Pharaoh said no...his lust for power to control and out wait God...made him determined (hardened) keep his power and control, and fell into Gods plan which God know he would God counted on it. I think it went something like this.

Moses...LET MY PEOPLE GO!
Pharaoh...NO!!
God...sends plague
Gods people...WOW..did you see what God did?

Moses...LET MY PEOPLE GO!
Pharaoh...NO!!
God...sends 2nd plague
Gods people...YES!! Our...God has power!!

Moses...LET MY PEOPLE GO!
Pharaoh...NO!!
God...sends 3rd plague
Gods people...THATS MY GOD THAT DID THAT!! He can do anything!!

And on....

So it is with all respect that I call this common free will argument as a stawman. God only use Pharaoh and baited Pharaoh (drawn by his own lust) into doing what he needed. I know some may not like that word "baited"....so choose your own word here. Pharaoh heart would only choose sin...and harden here means...he became even more determined to have his own will over some "God he could not see". After all...He was king over the land. Who is this God of the slaves telling him what to do??

I see it as Pharaoh did not choose God..as any other spiritually dead man. With each "NO"..the determined Pharaoh just kept going down that path away from God. It was God that caused this.

I do not see it that way at all. Pharaohs place before God was unchanged. Pharaoh was a non believer before and after this. If you live a life as Hitler and go to hell...or you live your life as a war hero and go to hell...both go to hell. God change nothing in Pharaoh place. He was dead in sins before...and after. He only used his lust to control him.

I would call this....SIN NATURE

 

Indeed it is.

 

BTW..as I have said before, my full view on predestination is posted on page 2 post #13 of this tread.

 

Notice: I did not add anything to the word of God. Look at how much you had to add to make it fit your doctrine.

You have accused me before of thinking the atonement was insufficient to save all that Christ died for. But, it didn't save you until you believed, did it?

 

whatever. I don't need the words. You overlooked most of them..I only helped point them out. yeah..lets do it this way..

in one short line tell me what predestined means. or...are you saying this one verse says it all?

 

If you will believe you will be conformed to the image of His Son.

 

Does the words.."it is is finished" mean anything to you?

Does the word ransom mean anything to you?

This simply shows you do not know the meaning of atonement, and the word ransom. RANSOM was the word you used..was it not?


Look the words up..and get back with us.

 

It means believers are destined to be conformed to the image of God's Son, and that destiny was decided before it happens. Also, according to the verse, this was due to the foreknowledge of God.

 

So you were born saved?

 

Yep, that's what I see. :thumbs: