Who are the Arminians?

[JesusFan]

Correct & when you contrast the Baptist 1689 to the Westminster Confessions hold to you will see little difference till you come to Baptism. As Presbyterians, the text makes Infant Baptism into a Sacrament. With scriptural justification.
Would any Baptist agree wit dat.... No Way Jose!

However as a fairly recent convert to the Faith, I can use both Creeds & Confessions as guidelines & even challenge them for authenticity. Ive gone to Pastors & debated the confessions & asked if they could be edited or at least made note of before being a member of the church....I even changed my viewpoint after heavy study on the point in question. Guess I make things difficult! :smilewinkgrin:

I think they are fine IF you want to live and explain the faith by them, its just that they CANNOT produce growth as Bible does, as the HS works through bible, not them!


See them more like a staement of beliefs, intro to theology primers etc!

 

[Tom Butler]

No. They are scriptures organized according to man's opinion of them. Creeds are not scripture and are not inspired of God. Only God's Spirit can cause spiritual growth through God's word.

Let's be careful here. It sounds really spiritual to say that all we need are the scriptures and Holy Spirit illumination for spiritual growth.

If one carries that argument to its logical extension, then you must advocate that we close down this board, because everything we write involves expressing our opinions.

Then we shutdown all the publishing houses, including those which supply material to Sunday School teachers, because we don't need their stuff any more. It's just opinion. Of course, we won't need teachers, because anybody can stand there and read scripture. But spiritually-gifted teachers are specifically called for in the scriptures.

Next, we can do away with our preachers, since anybody can stand in the pulpit and read the scriptures. We can do that, sing a hymn or two, pray some, take up the offering and go home. Don't need preaching. But wait a minute. The scriptures specifically say we need pastors and teachers for the edifying of the church.

Wait a minute. We won't need hymns and gospel songs either, because those are just somebody's opinion.

I guess we'll have to close down all the Christian book stores, or at least everything except the Bible shelves, because everything else is just opinion.

I'm going to give you a scripture verse: 2 Thessalonians 2:7

For the mystery of iniquity does already work: only he who now lets will let, until he be taken out of the way.

In modern English, the word "let" means to allow. But in King James English, it means exactly the opposite--to restrain, hold back.

How do I know that?. Would the Holy Spirit guide me to the right rendering? Possibly, by placing me under a teacher or preacher, or a linguist, who would explain it to me. But it's highly doubtful that He would place it directly in your mind.

Remember when Philip explained Isaiah 53 to the Ethiopian eunuch? The eunuch didn't understand what he was reading. So the Holy Spirit sent Philip to explain it.

What if the eunuch had told Philip, "well, that's just your opinion."

Well, I think I've made my point, and invite you to respond with your thoughts.

 

[Aaron]

No. They are scriptures organized according to man's opinion of them. Creeds are not scripture and are not inspired of God. Only God's Spirit can cause spiritual growth through God's word.

You've just negated every sermon ever preached, set aside the gifts of prophecy and teaching, and rendered needless pastors and teachers. If you are as loyal to the Scriptures as you boast, you will quickly see the self-contradiction in your position.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

IE.... Your throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Who loves ya baby!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

You've just negated every sermon ever preached, set aside the gifts of prophecy and teaching, and rendered needless pastors and teachers. If you are as loyal to the Scriptures as you boast, you will quickly see the self-contradiction in your position.

Hey...I see a new portrait.....Isnt the beard a little hot during the summer? I prefer the Kojak look.

Who loves ya baby!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I think they are fine IF you want to live and explain the faith by them, its just that they CANNOT produce growth as Bible does, as the HS works through bible, not them!


See them more like a staement of beliefs, intro to theology primers etc!

Yes but how do you know its the HS....maybe its the devil talking to you? So then what do you compare it to?:smilewinkgrin:

Who loves ya baby!

 

[webdog]

Excellent replies, Amy :thumbs:

The irony is that some who call themselves calvinists are are also non-cal's as they attribute sin to God, something even calvinism does not.

...and I do not believe DHK or Skandelon believe they can lose their salvation, so they are not arminians as was stated early on.

 

[Amy.G]

The question is what or who causes spiritual growth. Only God can grow my spirit. I never said teachers aren't beneficial to the body of Christ. My disagreement is with saying that creeds cause spiritual growth. If you all will go back and read my posts, my disagreement started with Iconoclast saying that creeds produce spiritual growth. Please stop accusing me of saying things I didn't say.

The bible is the supreme authority on ALL things spiritual. Every word spoken by man must be compared to scripture to know if it is accurate. That is what I am trying to say.

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

 

[Amy.G]

Yes but how do you know its the HS....maybe its the devil talking to you? So then what do you compare it to?:smilewinkgrin:

Who loves ya baby!

What? Are you saying the devil speaks to spirit filled Christians through God's word?

 

[webdog]

Baptists who are not Calvinists are likely not Arminian. I call them simply non-Calvinists.

If you want one criterion it is that all Arminians believe one may lose his salvation. Catholics, Episcopalians, Methodists, Wesleyans and many Pentecostal groups fit the category That's why Baptists for the most part are not Arminian.

There are a couple of Baptist groups which could be classified such. Free Will Baptists and General Baptists would fit the bill.

So if you want to look for one definition, it is that Arminians believe in falling from grace.

This reply kind of throws a wrench in luke and iconoclast's declarations...

 

[JesusFan]

Yes but how do you know its the HS....maybe its the devil talking to you? So then what do you compare it to?:smilewinkgrin:

Who loves ya baby!

it will ALWAYS be same answer...

The Word of God!

God has promised to every Christian availability of the Illumination of HS to allow them to understand the bible and its teachings...

Not so anything else!

 

[InTheLight]

Just who are these Arminians and what qualifies them to be labeled such?

A nation and ethnic group native to the Caucasus and the Armenian Highland?

 

[JesusFan]

Let's be careful here. It sounds really spiritual to say that all we need are the scriptures and Holy Spirit illumination for spiritual growth.

If one carries that argument to its logical extension, then you must advocate that we close down this board, because everything we write involves expressing our opinions.

Then we shutdown all the publishing houses, including those which supply material to Sunday School teachers, because we don't need their stuff any more. It's just opinion. Of course, we won't need teachers, because anybody can stand there and read scripture. But spiritually-gifted teachers are specifically called for in the scriptures.

Next, we can do away with our preachers, since anybody can stand in the pulpit and read the scriptures. We can do that, sing a hymn or two, pray some, take up the offering and go home. Don't need preaching. But wait a minute. The scriptures specifically say we need pastors and teachers for the edifying of the church.

Wait a minute. We won't need hymns and gospel songs either, because those are just somebody's opinion.

I guess we'll have to close down all the Christian book stores, or at least everything except the Bible shelves, because everything else is just opinion.

I'm going to give you a scripture verse: 2 Thessalonians 2:7


In modern English, the word "let" means to allow. But in King James English, it means exactly the opposite--to restrain, hold back.

How do I know that?. Would the Holy Spirit guide me to the right rendering? Possibly, by placing me under a teacher or preacher, or a linguist, who would explain it to me. But it's highly doubtful that He would place it directly in your mind.

Remember when Philip explained Isaiah 53 to the Ethiopian eunuch? The eunuch didn't understand what he was reading. So the Holy Spirit sent Philip to explain it.

What if the eunuch had told Philip, "well, that's just your opinion."

Well, I think I've made my point, and invite you to respond with your thoughts.

Well..

Think that the creeds/confessions/other Christian Books etc are ALL useful IF they follow and adhere to sound Christian doctrine

Also think that all of these things are useful to help us grow in Christ

Also think that at times some p[ost the creeds so much to answer posts that it makes them seem more than the Bible!

JUST saying that ONLY inspired and FULLY authoratative source of the revelation from/of God is the Holy Spirit!

THAT is the one source HS will bring illumination to us from!

 

[Jkdbuck76]

I read that Arminius believed that technically speaking, one could lose salvation, but he couldn't say how.

But I think his predecessors did.

Maybe we need to read up on Arminius. Remember, a lot of Arminians consider themselves a part of the Reformed tradition.

 

[JesusFan]

I read that Arminius believed that technically speaking, one could lose salvation, but he couldn't say how.

But I think his predecessors did.

Maybe we need to read up on Arminius. Remember, a lot of Arminians consider themselves a part of the Reformed tradition.

Thnk he held that once saved, God would keep you, but that you could leave the faith IF you chose to, as God honors your free will!

 

[preachinjesus]

lol...ah yes, let's find these people out and line them up for their theological "comeuppance."

To state, again, the obvious...you all do know there are far more than just two theological options out there...

 

[JesusFan]

lol...ah yes, let's find these people out and line them up for their theological "comeuppance."

To state, again, the obvious...you all do know there are far more than just two theological options out there...

I Know of Arm/Cal/Lutheryn/Roman Catholic

Any one else?

 

[quantumfaith]

The question is what or who causes spiritual growth. Only God can grow my spirit. I never said teachers aren't beneficial to the body of Christ. My disagreement is with saying that creeds cause spiritual growth. If you all will go back and read my posts, my disagreement started with Iconoclast saying that creeds produce spiritual growth. Please stop accusing me of saying things I didn't say.

The bible is the supreme authority on ALL things spiritual. Every word spoken by man must be compared to scripture to know if it is accurate. That is what I am trying to say.

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[Aaron]

Hey...I see a new portrait.....Isnt the beard a little hot during the summer? I prefer the Kojak look.

Who loves ya baby!

Just a little different angle. The beard's a little warm, but the horns are cool!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Just a little different angle. The beard's a little warm, but the horns are cool!

Noted their plural:thumbs::smilewinkgrin: