I wasn’t recounting Scripture but Church history, all these breakaway human traditions are traditions of rebellious men, you can see when these traditions of men began. Easy to spot them many times because they are named after their human founders.
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- Thread starter Cathode
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I wasn’t recounting Scripture but Church history, all these breakaway human traditions are traditions of rebellious men, you can see when these traditions of men began. Easy to spot them many times because they are named after their human founders.
David Lamb
Well-Known Member
Of course the Waldensians were a "heretical human tradition" in the view of the Roman Catholic Church. As far as your earlier/later Waldensians comment is concerned, I did say, "many of the Waldensians," not "all."
Really, how do you justify this to a ROMAN Catholic. We have many of them coming into our church seeking relief from the storm…their minds are open to the gospel, one that emphasizes the truth of Gods love …but you wish to present the Word as punishment.
And your church uses the name ROMAN, pagans who ruled by war, persecution and domination. If I was to consider a Catholic doctrine, I’d gravitate to the Eastern rite church before diving in to religious tradition.
Not just heretical according to Catholics, but to the Orthodox, Coptic and all the ancient Apostolic Churches, East and West universally.
That’s right, one of the signs of human tradition is it’s disharmony and division as time progresses. Protestantism devolved into many human founded traditions from its inception, it’s a sign.
Denying the Real Presence in the Eucharist is nothing new, even Ignatius disciple of John encountered Gnostics who refused to believe The Eucharist was Jesus Flesh. These were not part of the Church.
And further back from that The Lord Himself faced the denials of those who could not accept that His Flesh was real food and Blood real drink.
It a phenomenon that all stems from a lack of faith in Jesus own words.
Catholics only believe it because Jesus said it.
We believe Jesus Flesh is real food and Blood is real drink.
“My flesh is real food, and my blood is real drink “
We believe that when we eat His Flesh and drink His Blood, that we abide in Him and He in us. True Communion, Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity.
“ He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood, abides in me, and I in him.”
We believe that when we eat Jesus flesh and drink His blood that we receive His Life, to the resurrection of our bodies to eternal life.
“ He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood, has eternal life and I will raise him up on the last day “
Salvation is based on Jesus words, those that accept His invitation to the feast and those who refuse His Table.
“ Unless you eat the flesh of the son of man, and drink His blood, you have no life in you. “
Only those who truly believe Jesus words will come to Him and eat Flesh and drink His Blood.
Doesn’t say Roman at all.
“Petilianus said: ‘If you declare that yon hold the Catholic Church, the word ‘catholic’ is merely the Greek equivalent for entire or whole. But it is clear that you are not in the whole, because you have gone aside into the part.’ Augustine answered: I too indeed have attained to a very slight knowledge of the Greek language, scarcely to be called knowledge at all, yet I am not shameless in saying that I know that means not ‘one,’ but ‘the whole;’ and that means “according to the whole:” whence the Catholic Church received its name, according to the saying of the Lord, ‘It is not for you to know the times, which the Father hath put in His own power. But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in Judea, and in Samaria, and even in the whole earth.’ Here you have the origin of the name ‘Catholic.’ Augustine, Answer to Letters of Petilian, 2:38 [90] (A.D. 400).
The Catholic Church rules by religion and not by force of Arms.
PLEASE….I was a Roman Catholic for 34 years…at least be truthful enough to recognize that your history is laden with pagan traditions! I would even embrace that and be ready to explain the evolution stages from pagan to Christianity. I’d prefer that you explain things like Thomas ‘a Kempis (My Imitation of Christ), St. Francis, Dominick, etc., ie those who gave up everything to follow Christ. See Protestants and Baptists don’t concentrate on individuals dedicating lives to God, rather it’s focused on Christs efforts to saving His chosen children. Maybe talk about Pope JohnPauls incicles …. There is much to unpack there. Provide some intelligent and well as spiritual balance… instead of dogma which has already been rejected.
No, I’ve thoroughly looked into it mate, couldn’t find anything pagan in the Catholic teachings.
What I did find out is that Catholicism is original and true Christianity.
Save yourself the trouble and just trust me on this. I’ve looked into it.
The Imitation of Christ is a very powerful spirituality especially for healing. I gave the book and some spiritual advice to a Protestant friend of mine, and it changed his life.
Following the method for a few weeks he found himself in a direct visual audience with Jesus who proceeded to heal all his wounds from the past.
When this was done, Jesus was just looking and smiling at him and what seemed like a door opened. As he was about go through it, he heard the most beautiful voice say ‘ Welcome to your new life ‘. This voice he knew was God The Father.
Then he found himself sitting on his bed side. He spent a week in tears before he told me about it. This is the brief outline of his experience, there was a lot more to it.
I have had powerful healing and experiences with this as well, that’s why I recommended it.
Not saying that everyone will have the same powerful experiences as he and I did, because Jesus approaches each soul differently, and because we are each unique.
But like I said him, if you get serious with Jesus, He gets serious with you.
It’s about our disposition, Jesus is always ready with His Love and Grace, it’s that we aren’t fully disposed to receive it, even as believers, we still hold back and have dark inner chambers of our hearts blocked off. Jesus wants to heal all that, and wants our entire heart.
And if we aren’t advancing spiritually we are falling behind, you can always be closer to our Infinite God.
Mystical experiences should not be sort out in curiosity however, the surer and purer way is by faith without condolences or signs. Loving and trusting Jesus with a simple faith is the better way, but be open to whatever Jesus Wills for you, He is in charge not us.
We must be indifferent to “experiences” in a sense and remember that Jesus is the focus of our souls.
Jesus is the guide to our inner life, without Him, don’t explore anything in the spiritual, nothing.
Your entire desire, disposition and focus should be to draw closer to Jesus.
Meditation on Jesus Passion and sufferings draws us close to His heart, we get taken by Grace to share in it and into great intimacy with Him.
We are there with Him transfixed in Adoration.
We can dispose ourselves, but only Grace can take us there.
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“Draw near to God and He will draw near to you.”
First we have be alone with God, generally this starts with a period of silence each day, a Sacred time dedicated to God alone. Have a fixed time.
In as far as possible gently recognise Jesus present with you, because He is.
Kneeling helps as it is a humility, and as Jesus becomes more present to us we should be found humble in His Presence.
When you are settled, recall your sins and deficiencies and lay them out before Him.
Recognise your absolute need of Jesus, you are not self sufficient.
When you are in Jesus Presence, you are entering into your inner self to be with Him.
“The Kingdom of Heaven is within you”
Say, Jesus, you are are my Lord and King, I love you, I hand over my will completely to your Holy Will, this time is totally yours to use or instruct me as you will.
1: You have made Sacrifice of your time for Him.
2: You have made Him the singular focus of your heart.
3: You have humbled yourself and acknowledged your deficiencies and your total reliance on Him.
4: You have acknowledged Him as King, there is no better guide in the Kingdom than the King Himself.
Keep doing this each day for starting out, along with your other prayers and scripture readings.
The inner life is greatest adventure of all with Jesus as your companion.
First we have be alone with God, generally this starts with a period of silence each day, a Sacred time dedicated to God alone. Have a fixed time.
In as far as possible gently recognise Jesus present with you, because He is.
Kneeling helps as it is a humility, and as Jesus becomes more present to us we should be found humble in His Presence.
When you are settled, recall your sins and deficiencies and lay them out before Him.
Recognise your absolute need of Jesus, you are not self sufficient.
When you are in Jesus Presence, you are entering into your inner self to be with Him.
“The Kingdom of Heaven is within you”
Say, Jesus, you are are my Lord and King, I love you, I hand over my will completely to your Holy Will, this time is totally yours to use or instruct me as you will.
1: You have made Sacrifice of your time for Him.
2: You have made Him the singular focus of your heart.
3: You have humbled yourself and acknowledged your deficiencies and your total reliance on Him.
4: You have acknowledged Him as King, there is no better guide in the Kingdom than the King Himself.
Keep doing this each day for starting out, along with your other prayers and scripture readings.
The inner life is greatest adventure of all with Jesus as your companion.
You, Cathode, and all people like you, You are a mere storyteller who attend the apostate and DEMONIC church of Rome that was linked to the murderers Caesars, killers of the Apostles and disciples of JESUS, today the Great Whore, wedded with the Devil, she is his woman, and as is written in Revelation 18:2-3, the Great Whore become the habitation of devils/demons, and the hold of every foul -every UNCLEAN- spirit, and a CAGE of every unclean and hateful bird, by allegory, Popes, and Cardinals, Bishosps, Priests, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her,. and all FOLLOWERS, all nations have drunk of the wine of the WRATH of her fornication.
John the Apostle saw and write, saying: Revelation 18:21 -> And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea(in the peoples, and nations, and multitudes of all tongues), saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all, so what John the Apostle wrote will fulfill LITERALLY from now on(Revelation 18:21), and day after day until be elected the NEXT and LAST Pope.
And Revelation 11:6 reveals that the two Candlesticks, i.e. the real BODY of Christ, FIRST the true Gentile Church of the Lord JESUS whose names is written in the book of life, and SECOND, the Jewish Church of the Lord, the 144K-Revelation 7:1-8- , both One Church, to them both is given and will have power over waters (peoples, and nations, and multitudes of all tongues) to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
Get ready
The NATIONS will be ANGRY, will be wrathed, evidently, but GOD's WRATH also comes upon them all-Revelation 11:18. JESUS warned:Luke 17:28-30:
28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
The time is of HARVEST, and the HARVEST is the END of the world, understand? Matthew 13:39
The tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall this be now in the end of this demonic world. - Revelation 11:15-18. The tares is now gathered out of GOD's kingdom and all things that offend, and them which do iniquity, and they shall be cast into a furnace of fire.
There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
And this is the message of the Lord JESUS: Depart from me, ye CURSED, into everlasting fire, prepared for the Devil and his messengers (2Corinthians 11:13-15 combined with Revelation 12:7-12 and 2 Corinthians 5:10. Yes, GOD cursed the Devil in the beginning, and JESUS already CURSED the followers and messengers of the Devil. These shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal-Matthew 25:46. Yeah, the punishment begins now, even now, and it will NEVER end, but never, there will be ONLY and ONLY PUNISHMENT from now on, yeah, will never END, it is for everlasting time.
The time is of HARVEST, and the HARVEST is the END of the world, understand? Matthew 13:39
The tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall this be now in the end of this demonic world. - Revelation 11:15-18. The tares is now gathered out of GOD's kingdom and all things that offend, and them which do iniquity, and they shall be cast into a furnace of fire.
There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
And this is the message of the Lord JESUS: Depart from me, ye CURSED, into everlasting fire, prepared for the Devil and his messengers (2Corinthians 11:13-15 combined with Revelation 12:7-12 and 2 Corinthians 5:10. Yes, GOD cursed the Devil in the beginning, and JESUS already CURSED the followers and messengers of the Devil. These shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal-Matthew 25:46. Yeah, the punishment begins now, even now, and it will NEVER end, but never, there will be ONLY and ONLY PUNISHMENT from now on, yeah, will never END, it is for everlasting time.
Get ready
Yo
You are an accuser brother….recognize it as a serious flaw because you will never win over anyone to your form of gospel by attack….rather they will & do put up a forse field impossible to penitrate. I fervently believe that the Holy Ghost is the one who delivers regeneration to the individual in order to convert and grow both understanding along with the growth of a conscience… so ease up on your accusatory activities … and walk in faith ( the one that moves mountains).
Nevi'im (Prophets) Yeshayahu (Isaiah) Chapter 30:32-33:
32And it shall be, every place where the established staff shall pass (or at every stroke of the rod of Judgment, which the Lord gives), upon which the Lord shall grant peace, [it shall be] with drums and with harps, and with WARS of waving will He fight with them.33For Tophteh is set up from yesterday, that too has been prepared for the king, it deepened, it widened its pile, of fire and much wood(the wicked mankind); the BREATH of the Lord is like a stream of BRIMSTONE, burning therein (or doth kindle it).
1Thessalonians 5:3- When they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and THEY SHALL NOT ESCAPE.
he Word is GOD, GOD Himself, self-executing, it's the Power.
Get ready
Revelation 21:8 - > 8 But the FEARFUL (the COWARDS), and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone(THE BREATH OF THE LORD): which is the second death.
He can not help himself.
“ Unless you become as little children, you can not enter the Kingdom of Heaven “
Unless we humble ourselves and recognise our powerlessness, weakness and nothingness, we do not have the disposition to enter The Kingdom. The way is narrow, only enough for a little child to pass through.
“Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will lift you up.”
Jesus can’t ignore a child in His Presence, He has to lift it up.
This little child keeps showing up each day in His Presence, whose only confidence is in His Love and Mercy. That confidence is irresistible to Jesus, it delights Him.
Jesus tells us the disposition we must have, we must be as little children.
The big arrogant loudmouth isn’t promised to be lifted up.
The child willingly conforms its will, places it’s absolute trust in Jesus, it is docile and open to His Love, care and Grace. Jesus can work with that.
We draw near to God by becoming as little children, it is this disposition God draws nearer to.
To enter the inner life, the way is narrow.
Unless we humble ourselves and recognise our powerlessness, weakness and nothingness, we do not have the disposition to enter The Kingdom. The way is narrow, only enough for a little child to pass through.
“Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will lift you up.”
Jesus can’t ignore a child in His Presence, He has to lift it up.
This little child keeps showing up each day in His Presence, whose only confidence is in His Love and Mercy. That confidence is irresistible to Jesus, it delights Him.
Jesus tells us the disposition we must have, we must be as little children.
The big arrogant loudmouth isn’t promised to be lifted up.
The child willingly conforms its will, places it’s absolute trust in Jesus, it is docile and open to His Love, care and Grace. Jesus can work with that.
We draw near to God by becoming as little children, it is this disposition God draws nearer to.
To enter the inner life, the way is narrow.
The accuser is the MAN of sin, son of perditon, the MORTAL tree of good and evil, the Old Serpent, called the Devil and Satan, and now in the time of Apocalypse his new name is red Dragon, so once you call the accuser your brother, then you confess to be brother of demons, as is written: 1Timothy 4:1-2:
1Now the Spirit (GOD is Spirit and the Word is GOD-Hebrews 1:1-3 and Matthew 4:4) speaketh EXPRESSLY, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits(spirits of demons), and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron.
But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceive. 2Timothy 3:13.
Without mental prayer we can not develop deep closeness to God.
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.”
Truly engaging with God requires an all in effort, of your whole being.
Jesus doesn’t understand half hearted, lukewarm and double mindedness. Shallow surface level does not interest Him, He doesn’t like it.
Entering the inner life requires single mindedness and daily perseverance with your set time with God. All your strength means hard daily discipline to have that set time with God, never skipping it.
You want to be a disciple that shows up daily, ready and willing in all weathers.
What do you think of an apprentice that shows up late or whenever he feels like it? You will say ‘ He is not serious ‘.
Same with Jesus, He sees you aren’t serious. He is the perfect Teacher for serious disciples.
The most profitable way to engage all your heart, soul, and mind is to persistently meditate on Jesus Passion and Death on the Cross.
You can not meditate on this long without Grace taking you there. By Grace your heart is filled with The great Love Jesus poured out there, your soul is filled with Awe and Adoration, your mind conforms to the mind of Christ, the Mind of Mercy.
Everything will be thrown at you to discourage you from meditating on Jesus Passion.
The Darkness gets extremely alarmed when people get serious in their spirituality .
This is when a Soul truly begins to understand itself and God and grow and bear fruit in Jesus.
The other thing that many never talk about, is having courage. Courage is vitally important, entering the inner Kingdom makes us spiritually sensitive and aware. It is not just confronting spiritual realities as tough as this can be. It is facing the ugliness of ourselves that is the most frightening thing to behold.
We have a certain base conception of ourselves, but as we proceed in the inner life we gain deep knowledge of ourselves which can be horrific. Each thought and motive is exposed as a detailed essay to us. We begin to see ourselves as God sees us, and in His Light and Perfection.
This is a hard thing to face, and a point of discouragement that we must pass through trusting completely in Jesus Mercy and Love. We must lean heavily on His Love.
It is a great Grace to be shown yourself in this life, because many only find out at Judgement just how cold, nasty and rotten they are.
There are a lot other things to say on this, but it’s a start.
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.”
Truly engaging with God requires an all in effort, of your whole being.
Jesus doesn’t understand half hearted, lukewarm and double mindedness. Shallow surface level does not interest Him, He doesn’t like it.
Entering the inner life requires single mindedness and daily perseverance with your set time with God. All your strength means hard daily discipline to have that set time with God, never skipping it.
You want to be a disciple that shows up daily, ready and willing in all weathers.
What do you think of an apprentice that shows up late or whenever he feels like it? You will say ‘ He is not serious ‘.
Same with Jesus, He sees you aren’t serious. He is the perfect Teacher for serious disciples.
The most profitable way to engage all your heart, soul, and mind is to persistently meditate on Jesus Passion and Death on the Cross.
You can not meditate on this long without Grace taking you there. By Grace your heart is filled with The great Love Jesus poured out there, your soul is filled with Awe and Adoration, your mind conforms to the mind of Christ, the Mind of Mercy.
Everything will be thrown at you to discourage you from meditating on Jesus Passion.
The Darkness gets extremely alarmed when people get serious in their spirituality .
This is when a Soul truly begins to understand itself and God and grow and bear fruit in Jesus.
The other thing that many never talk about, is having courage. Courage is vitally important, entering the inner Kingdom makes us spiritually sensitive and aware. It is not just confronting spiritual realities as tough as this can be. It is facing the ugliness of ourselves that is the most frightening thing to behold.
We have a certain base conception of ourselves, but as we proceed in the inner life we gain deep knowledge of ourselves which can be horrific. Each thought and motive is exposed as a detailed essay to us. We begin to see ourselves as God sees us, and in His Light and Perfection.
This is a hard thing to face, and a point of discouragement that we must pass through trusting completely in Jesus Mercy and Love. We must lean heavily on His Love.
It is a great Grace to be shown yourself in this life, because many only find out at Judgement just how cold, nasty and rotten they are.
There are a lot other things to say on this, but it’s a start.
You guys need to ratchet this animosity thing down you’re both becoming ridiculous …it’s hateful and accusatory and I’m not going to tolerate it any more. That will be both of your First & Last warning.
Both? Who do you mean?
Fasting is also a humility, it helps the general disposition before God, it helps a souls understanding its dependence on God for everything.
Just as self sufficiency closes off graces, humility opens us up to Graces and true spiritual sight.
Self sufficiency/ Pride and self indulgence repel God.
Humility and self denial are the beautiful aromas that draw God closer to us.
Pride blinds to the truth and blocks graces. Humility opens our eyes to the truth and opens our heart and mind to receive the truth.
Do you see that disposition is the starting point in the inner life.
First deny yourself, take up your Cross, and then follow Jesus.
Humility is the denial of self, it establishes and orders us on the right understanding of our nothingness and God’s Greatness and Holiness.
The foundation of our relationship with God must be rightly grounded first.
Self and ego are enemies of this relationships foundation. Nothing can be built on it until the foundation is rightly ordered.
If you are full of self, there is no room for Jesus.
Just as self sufficiency closes off graces, humility opens us up to Graces and true spiritual sight.
Self sufficiency/ Pride and self indulgence repel God.
Humility and self denial are the beautiful aromas that draw God closer to us.
Pride blinds to the truth and blocks graces. Humility opens our eyes to the truth and opens our heart and mind to receive the truth.
Do you see that disposition is the starting point in the inner life.
First deny yourself, take up your Cross, and then follow Jesus.
Humility is the denial of self, it establishes and orders us on the right understanding of our nothingness and God’s Greatness and Holiness.
The foundation of our relationship with God must be rightly grounded first.
Self and ego are enemies of this relationships foundation. Nothing can be built on it until the foundation is rightly ordered.
If you are full of self, there is no room for Jesus.