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Why did Christ say he would draw all men to himself.

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Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Iconoclast said:
It says sinners, not every single sinner.
Jesus will save every sinner the Father
Gave to Him, no more, no less.
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Your right Christ Jesus came to save sinners.
1Ti_2:6 who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,
He paid the ransom price for all but only those that will trust in Him will receive the benefit of that ransom be paid.
Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Those that believe are the ones that the Father will give to the Son.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
1Ti 2:1 Therefore I exhort first of all that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men,

Did you miss that part or do you just ignore what you do not like?
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Well if you think the bible is funny then you have more of a problem than I thought.
 
I

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
"Silverhair,

Those that believe are the ones that the Father will give to the Son.
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No...the texts say they are given before they believe. The fact you have to twist it shows you know your idea is false.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
LOL and that does not necessitate died and paid for every individual, just those who would believe.
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You really struggle wit the truths of the bible don't you. How many times do you have to be shown something before you will open your eyes. Or is it just the calvinist blinders that are causing the problem?
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
I'm not the one denying truth. But thanks for the ad hominem since you couldn't deal with the post.
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Oh I read your
Iconoclast said:
"Silverhair,



No...the texts say they are given before they believe. The fact you have to twist it shows you know your idea is false.[/QUOTE

So your saying that God gives people to Christ Jesus before they believe. In other words they are saved before they believe. You should check your bible before you say that.

Calvinists pick out verses that they think support their view but then ignore the rest of the bible. You have been shown enough verses just since I have been on this board and yet you persist in your errant ways.
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Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Iconoclast said:
[QUOTE="Silverhair,



Yes, but SBG says God wanted to save them...I asked if the flood helped with that.
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Did God want to save them, YES
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Remember God does not change, the Holy Spirit inspired this in the NT so it would be applicable in OT times as well.

'I asked if the flood helped with that' That seems like a dumb question to me. They were being judged for their sin but that would not alter the fact that God had wanted them to have believed in Him.
 
I

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
"Silverhair,


So your saying that God gives people to Christ Jesus before they believe. I
In other words they are saved before they believe. You should check your bible before you say that.
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Let me clarify. The bible declares God the Father gave a multitude of unbelieving sinners to the Son.
6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.

8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

The bible says it Calvinists believe it.


Calvinists pick out verses that they think support their view but then ignore the rest of the bible. You have been shown enough verses just since I have been on this board and yet you persist in your errant ways.
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All the Cals have offered you help, you do not want it.
 
A

AustinC

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
Did God want to save them, YES
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Remember God does not change, the Holy Spirit inspired this in the NT so it would be applicable in OT times as well.

'I asked if the flood helped with that' That seems like a dumb question to me. They were being judged for their sin but that would not alter the fact that God had wanted them to have believed in Him.
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How were they to know God? Romans 1 tells us that it doesn't happen through natural revelation alone. Romans 10:14 asks how they will hear.

How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching?

This was precisely the motivation of every Reformed missionary who agreed with Paul. People will die in their sins if we don't go tell them of Jesus.

Silverhair, history shows you are wrong.
 
I

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Silverhair said:
Did God want to save them, YES
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Remember God does not change, the Holy Spirit inspired this in the NT so it would be applicable in OT times as well.

'I asked if the flood helped with that' That seems like a dumb question to me. They were being judged for their sin but that would not alter the fact that God had wanted them to have believed in Him.
Click to expand...
God will save every single person he wants to be saved. He is not willing that any perish.2pet3:9
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Iconoclast said:
"Silverhair,




Let me clarify. The bible declares God the Father gave a multitude of unbelieving sinners to the Son.
6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.

8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

The bible says it Calvinists believe it.




All the Cals have offered you help, you do not want it.
Click to expand...


I have no problem with what you quoted but where I see the problem is that you want them given before they believe. The bible says you have to believe before you are saved, would you not agree?
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
You really struggle wit the truths of the bible don't you. How many times do you have to be shown something before you will open your eyes. Or is it just the calvinist blinders that are causing the problem?
Click to expand...
You don't show the Bible, just a denial and twisting of it.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

For God so loved the world, here we see that God loves His creation.
whoever believes in Him should not perish, that must be people, right.
God did not send His Son into the world, here we have Christ being born as a human being.
to condemn the world, What has sinned so as to be condemned?
but that the world through Him might be saved. So what is getting saved?
"He who believes in Him is not condemned. That would be people, right?

So when Christ Jesus says that He will draw all to Himself it is people not people groups He means. Christ saves individuals not people groups.
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strawman
 
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