1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Why James White Is Sick of The Calvinist Club

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Revmitchell, Dec 13, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Top Posters
Page 6 of 8
  1. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    If this is true, you have to remember that Adam, in his sinless and perfect humanity, sinned.
     
    #101 JonC, Feb 6, 2018
  2. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2018
    Messages:
    500
    Likes Received:
    57
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Just to clarify, Adam initially was not in such bondage. So free will may have been an option for him prior to the fall. Is that a correct statement?
     
    #102 delizzle, Feb 6, 2018
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I do NOT think God authors sin, but that after the fall, God is allowing all humans to receive the sin nature that Adam found to now be in Him!
     
    #103 Yeshua1, Feb 6, 2018
  4. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2018
    Messages:
    500
    Likes Received:
    57
    Faith:
    Baptist
    What was the result of Adam's Rebellion?
     
    #104 delizzle, Feb 6, 2018
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    He had the potential to sin being human, Jesus could not , as being very God also!
     
    #105 Yeshua1, Feb 6, 2018
  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Adam freely chose to rebel against God, yes....
     
    #106 Yeshua1, Feb 6, 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  7. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2018
    Messages:
    500
    Likes Received:
    57
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you practice infant baptism?
     
    #107 delizzle, Feb 6, 2018
  8. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So Jesus was less than human...less than Adam in terms of His humanity?
     
    #108 JonC, Feb 6, 2018
  9. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So God allowed or permitted man to receive the "sin nature" that Adam discovered in himself? Where did it come from? Did Adam have it before he sinned?
     
    #109 JonC, Feb 6, 2018
  10. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2014
    Messages:
    13,897
    Likes Received:
    2,498
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Again, word games. Think of God as an earthly king for a moment. He tells his servants, plant anything you like in your fields. A servant then freely chooses to plant corn. Another freely chooses to plant beans. God remained in control, yet gave His servants a free choice.
     
    #110 Reynolds, Feb 6, 2018
  11. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2003
    Messages:
    3,357
    Likes Received:
    243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    You’re looking at James anachronistically. He’s writing to a post-fall people and your applying it to the pre-fall world.

    That James says this, along with boatloads of biblical evidence shows you to be incorrect.

    Would you argue that the mankind God created on the garden desired “only evil continually?” For your idea to be correct you would have to do so.

    It is clear in nearly every page of scripture that something has happened to man between Genesis 3 and 4.

    The Archangel.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    #111 The Archangel, Feb 6, 2018
  12. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I would argue that Adam, being made in God's image, sought a type of equality with God as something to grasp. I would argue that Adam was tempted by his desires and transgressed God's command. Sin and death entered the world and men were enslaved, condemned and corrupt. And I would argue that as men sought their will God gave them over to unnatural desires.

    Jesus has a human nature to include natural desires of the flesh, yet He did not sin. No passage presents Jesus as being less than man in His humanity. No passage describes Adam as having anything but a human nature.
     
    #112 JonC, Feb 6, 2018
  13. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,686
    Likes Received:
    389
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Sorry. I must have done edits to that post and didn't realize my error. I meant to say that God certainly knew what would happen.
     
    #113 thatbrian, Feb 6, 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  14. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,686
    Likes Received:
    389
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Of course He did.

    No.

    No.

    Limited "freedom".

    Given the choice, no sinful man would take it because no man is free in the way in which you believe he is.
     
    #114 thatbrian, Feb 6, 2018
  15. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    On this board quite a bit
     
    #115 Revmitchell, Feb 6, 2018
  16. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2003
    Messages:
    3,357
    Likes Received:
    243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The problem is that Eve is tempted, and it’s not by something within herself. Adam, on the other hand, eats the fruit Eve gives him, and in that is some type of rebellious sin. So you’d have to argue Adam is created in some type of imperfection where he desires equality with God, which the text clearly does not support.

    The Archangel


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    #116 The Archangel, Feb 6, 2018
  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Scripture states that Eve saw that the fruit was "good for food", a "delight to the eyes", and desirable to make one wise. This certainly appeals to something within. Scripture does not present Adam or Eve as getting a new "sinful nature".
     
    #117 JonC, Feb 6, 2018
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Nope, am a Baptist, so practice believers!
     
    #118 Yeshua1, Feb 6, 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No. exactly the same in his humanity as Adam was before the fall!
     
    #119 Yeshua1, Feb 6, 2018
  20. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2003
    Messages:
    3,357
    Likes Received:
    243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Again, you’re ignoring the text. What you’ve quoted here is after the temptation. She sins after an external temptation. She uses her intellect to adjudicate the fruit, ignoring the law God had given.

    The Archangel


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    #120 The Archangel, Feb 6, 2018
Page 6 of 8
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...