Wise and Foolish Virgins

[standingfirminChrist]

and the King would not give the necessary garments to those he knew would not beable to attend at all. who would not have a chance at all at the door.

the King would give the necessary garments and tools (oil lamp for instance) to those that would have a chance at coming to the marriage supper.

see what im getting at yet?
seems you've contradicted your argument SFIC.

haha. or maybe im misunderstanding again like i did with J.Jump. who knows.

No contradiction, gekko. The garment is provided by the king (see Matthew 22:11

Now, as to the 5 foolish virgins... true, they were invited. But we must not necessarily say they were first choice to the wedding. There may have been other attendee's that were invited and made excuses why they could not attend.

This certainly would line up with the king telling his servants to go into the highways and byways and bid all who will come, good or bad.

You pointed out earlier in this thread that in all accounts where the foolish were mentioned, it was speaking of an unsaved person... a person unprepared such as was these 5 foolish virgins.

The five foolish virgins expected to be carried into the ceremonies on the righteousness and purity of the wise virgins.

 

[J. Jump]

No problem seeing she clothed herself, but she clothed herself with linen provided by Him, not her own.

In Revelation 19, we see the Righteous King Jesus Christ, giving fine linen of righteousness to the wedding guest.

Well let's see if the text proves this to be true or not.

7 "Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready." 8 It was given to her to clothe herself in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

So it seems there is in fact no picture of Christ/Lamb/God giving anyone anything. The bride has made herself ready, not Christ/Lamb/God making her ready as you say.

How does she ready herself? She puts on linens. What does the text tell us the linen is? The righteous acts of the saints.

Sure sounds pretty plain and simple to me.

 

[J. Jump]

The garment is provided by the king (see Matthew 22:11)

Let's again just see what the text has to say.

But when the king came in to look over the dinner guests, he saw a man there who was not dressed in wedding clothes,

That says nothing about the king giving wedding clothes. It just says the man was not dressed in wedding clothes.

 

[gekko]

the foolish virgins were not soundly saved - just as the stony, thorny, and way-side ground hearers in the parable of the sower.

they could have been saved (i havn't seen any valid scriptural proof from either side. they both have holes)
but they sure weren't living like it.

they represent the majority of the north american church. who would just like to accept Christ and get on with their lives...

but the Lord knows their hearts. i wont try and tell people they are saved. i'll just tell people how to be saved.

 

[J. Jump]

the foolish virgins were not soundly saved

There is no such thing. You are either saved or you are unsaved. There's no middle ground.

No in the saved camp there are faithful, obedient, overcomers, and there are unfaithful, disobedient ones that are overcome, but they are saved just as much as the other group.

but they sure weren't living like it.

they represent the majority of the north american church. who would just like to accept Christ and get on with their lives...

That is true and instead of the church telling them there are going to be consequences, the church keeps lying to them and telling them they are either unsaved, or that they are saved and everything is okay and they will still go to heaven and get their mansion just like everybody else.

Both of which are damaging to the individual.

 

[gekko]

There is no such thing. You are either saved or you are unsaved. There's no middle ground.

No in the saved camp there are faithful, obedient, overcomers,

that's what i meant - that the soundly saved are those who are faithful, obedient, and overcomers.

but the stony ground hearers are those who are unfaithful and disobedient.

the Lord calls us to go through the narrow gate... and to walk on the narrow path. the narrow path consists of us being faithful, obedient and overcomers.

God is not a derelict Father - and will help those who have truly walked into the narrow gate and are truly walking on the narrow path but have slipped off that narrow path.

i see two doors going into the wide gate. you know what i mean. you see those huge gates at mansions and to the side you see a small door. that small door people are decieved by that. and think it is the narrow gate. but they have blinders on. and when they walk through they think they're on the right path when really they are on the wide path.

...

 

[J. Jump]

but the stony ground hearers are those who are unfaithful and disobedient.

So are these people saved or lost? If you say saved then we are in agreement, and I was just misreading what you were saying. If you say lost then I think my point is still valid.

 

[gekko]

they are saved. but they are not realizing they must walk on the path - they are walking off the path. and are not listening to God. they are foolish.

they make God a liar. making God out to be a derelict Father.
they havn't truly repented. havn't realized why they need to walk on the narrow path.

although they did walk on it at first... but when tribulation came... well. you know what i mean. they threw off the parachute.

 

[gekko]

i really dont know for sure though J.Jump whether the stony grounders are saved or not.

if they are not truly believing and repenting then they are not saved.

and the fruit of that will show.
you say that the fruit is not a guaruntee. but if God has started something in someone - God will finish it - and God will continue to do so.

 

[gekko]

its called evidence of faith. as talked about in James. no?

not evidence of being saved. evidence of faith.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Since the Lord Jesus Christ gave the command in John 5:39:

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

,

And since the things in the Old Testament are a type and shadow of the New Testament,

I went to the Old Testament to see marriages in the Bible. Here is a great passage that shows it is indeed Christ that clothes the Bride in Revelation, clothing her in His Righteousness, and not her clothing herself in the righteous acts of the saints.

Ezekiel 16
8 Now when I passed by thee, and looked upon thee, behold, thy time was the time of love; and I spread my skirt over thee, and covered thy
nakedness: yea, I sware unto thee, and entered into a covenant with thee, saith the Lord GOD, and thou becamest mine.
9 Then washed I thee with water; yea, I throughly washed away thy blood from thee, and I anointed thee with oil.
10 I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk.
11 I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck.
12 And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head.
13 Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey,
and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom.
14 And thy renown went forth among the heathen for thy beauty: for it was perfect through my comeliness, which I had put upon thee, saith the Lord GOD.

It is the Groom who provides for the Bride. It is the Groom who clothes the Bride. It is Christ who Clothes His Bride for that Great Marriage Supper of the Lamb. The Bride is clothed in His Righteousness and none else.

 

[J. Jump]

And since the things in the Old Testament are a type and shadow of the New Testament,

I went to the Old Testament to see marriages in the Bible.

Perfect idea. Now let's actually compare Scripture with right Scripture. Your passage is a nice passage and a great picture of the Father and His wife Israel. But that's not the picture of Christ and His bride.

You want to see a OT type of Christ and His bride look at Adam and Eve. The church is the body of Christ. And just like Eve came from part of Adam so Christ's bride will come from part of His body.

Look at the story of Isaac and Rebekah. Abraham (God) sent out his servant (Holy Spirit) and told him to go to his famiy (saved people) and find a bride for Isaac (Jesus). So he goes back to Abraham's people and part of that family becomes the bride. Not all the family, but part of the family.

You can see these truths in Ruth as well. "Wash yourself therefore, and anoint yourself and put on your best clothes, and go down to the threshing floor;

 

[standingfirminChrist]

John 5:19 19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

Since the Father clothed the Bride Israel, Christ indeed will clothe His Bride the Church. What things soever He doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

 

[J. Jump]

Quote:
John 5:19 19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

Since the Father clothed the Bride Israel, Christ indeed will clothe His Bride the Church. What things soever He doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

Like I said earlier when you cherry pick a verse and take it our of its context we can prove all kinds of things. What me to show you it's okay to kill someone? Want me to show you where it's okay for us to own slaves?

SFIC just because you type a verse in a message board doesn't mean it says what you are wanting it to say. The context of the passage was working signs.

 

[Linda64]

Like I said earlier when you cherry pick a verse and take it our of its context we can prove all kinds of things. What me to show you it's okay to kill someone? Want me to show you where it's okay for us to own slaves?

Maybe you should go out to the cherry tree orchard and pick some cherries yourself. I haven't seen you pickin any cherries that are applicable to this thread, yet you accuse my husband of doing so--something is wrong with this picture.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

You mention Rebekkah... I say sure. Lets look at verse 53, shall we?

Genesis 24:53 And the servant brought forth jewels of silver, and jewels of gold, and raiment, and gave them to Rebekah: he gave also to her brother and to her mother precious things.

Wow, is Rebekkah being offered garments? Since you said Isaac and Rebekkah are a picture of Christ and His Bride. This further shows Christ provides the clothing for His Bride, not her family or anyone else's garments.

Our own righteousness is filth in God's eyes. We must be clothed in His righteousness and His alone.

 

[gekko]

so i guess the gist of things is that if you dont look good going to the wedding feast- you'll get kicked out.

is this what this is lining up to be?

 

[Linda64]

so i guess the gist of things is that if you dont look good going to the wedding feast- you'll get kicked out.

is this what this is lining up to be?

No--the gist of things is that you need to be clothed in Christ's righteousness (saved) in order to be at the wedding feast. Jesus will NOT kick out His own. The church is His bride.

Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (Titus 3:5)

 

[J. Jump]

Maybe you should go out to the cherry tree orchard and pick some cherries yourself. I haven't seen you pickin any cherries that are applicable to this thread, yet you accuse my husband of doing so--something is wrong with this picture.

Linda if you haven't figured it out yet, cherry picking verses in Scripture is EXTREMELY dangerous. You can prove just about any kind of false teaching you want to when cherry picking verses.

Your husband does a fantastic job of it, and that's why it's easy to tell he doesn't know the flow of Scripture well.

I don't want to pick cherries (although I love cherries), because it's not the way to interpret Scripture. You have to compare like Scripture with like Scripture. Not this Scripture with that Scripture because it proves my point.

Scripture gets to tell us what it means, not we get to tell Scripture what it means by making our own combonations.

 

[J. Jump]

The church is His bride.

You all keep saying that but you can't show it in Scripture.

And when you think you have a Scripture that says the entire church is going to be the bride.

Then please tell me how that meshes with the type of Adam/Eve because not all of Adam's body became Eve, only a part of his body.

And then tell me how that meshes with Isaac and Rebekah and how not the entire family became the bride, but only part of it.