Does God love everyone?

6 who will render to every man according to his works:
7 to them that by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and incorruption, eternal life:
13 for not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified: Ro 2
24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith. Jas 2

The verse is precisely addressing 'faith alone' as is popularly held today.

What exactly are you deriving from 2 Tim 2:15?:

"Give diligence to present thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, handling aright the word of truth."

 

James 2:
18 But someone may well say, “You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.” 19 You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder. 20 But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless? 21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar? 22 You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected; 23 and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness,” and he was called the friend of God. 24
​

There are some that (imo) may misunderstand the direction of this conversation taken from James.

I want to focus on the two words "you see." But first, look at "some will say."

"some will say" is a group in which James is taking as contentious. James is using the rest of this section to correct the area in which the "some will say."

Then James uses a key phrase (imo) "are you willing to recognize." He then goes on to show (as often done on the BB) the illustration and then the evidence supported by the illustration. Again, this is very similar to what is often done on the BB.

James uses "you see" at these parts. James is not using compare and contrast, but showing evidence of support.

So verses starting with 22 in essence James is saying, "Look at the example of Abraham and you will see..."

When James says, "You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone. In the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way? For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead." he is NOT saying faith alone or sola fida is enough.

James is saying that faith that doesn't result in works is not faith at all. That true faith ALWAYS will result in and be evidenced by works.

James is saying that justification is by the work done as a demonstration of Faith, and the no one who doesn't work or cannot show the work being done can rely upon faith, alone.

James is saying that a person who has no change in their life as a result of faith, has no real faith.

 

I agree that some hold to that view and but it isn't formally the doctrine of Sola Fide but a perversion of the true Gospel.

Just what the verse implies, people need to look beyond one verse or two, but at the whole. Those who believe true faith to be alone haven't done that.

 

I also believe Romans 2 that you've quoted is in the context of the whole world is lost, not that man is going to be saved from works of the law. He is showing the Jews have not and cannot keep the law, and that none are good, which is also the context, thus all have sinned and etc. Romans 2 taken as a doctrine of works salvation would then make the work of the cross a non-necessity.

 

So your's is the true and pure and unblemished version of 'faith alone'. Can you tell me the difference between your 'sola fide' and their 'sola fide'?

 

Wrong. It's in the context of "there is no respect of persons with God" leading up to the question posed in 3:1.

That's shallow. 2 Tim 2:15 - take your own reference seriously, dig deeper, and rightly divide. "When Gentiles that have not the law do by nature the things of the law .... they show the work of the law written in their hearts". The 'heart change', the 'circumcision of the heart', of Ro 2 is a direct outcome of the Redeemer's work. "The life giving Spirit" has always blown where He wills, thus is everyone born of the Spirit, not only of the Jews but also among the nations.

1 Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith Jehovah.

26 even the mystery which hath been hid for ages and generations: but now hath it been manifested to his saints,
27 to whom God was pleased to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Col 1

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice: and they shall become one flock, one shepherd. Jn 10

13 for not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified:
14 (for when Gentiles that have not the law do by nature the things of the law, these, not having the law, are the law unto themselves;
15 in that they show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness therewith, and their thoughts one with another accusing or else excusing them); Ro 2

1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what is the profit of circumcision? Ro 3

 

Good post.
This is what the Calvinist fails to recognize. Death is separation. Death does not equal being a corpse. The Bible draws no distinction. Those separated from always have the capability of hearing. If they didn't God would not give them, the unregenerate, such commands as:

Acts 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
--His command for all men is to repent. He has made allowance for all men to repent.
He has given the command for all men to believe on Him. This is the Father's will.

A corpse cannot believe; cannot repent. But the unregenerate is not a corpse.
He is separated. That is what spiritual death is--separation from God. If man himself doesn't obey God and intervene that man may go to hell? Why? Because God has given man the ministry of reconciliation.
To a Calvinist that sounds terrible, that another man should play a role in salvation. But who told you about Christ? Where did you hear about Him and His saving grace? Was it from a man or from the wind?

The truth is that God has given to every believer the ministry of reconciliation that the unsaved man may be reconciled to God. He is now separated from God. He needs the gospel to be reconciled to God. And God has appointed us, His Ambassadors, to bring the message of salvation to others that they may be reconciled to God.

2 Corinthians 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

 

I agree they take the illustration of death to a level not intended by God.

It is a bit of an inconsistency for them to ignore that man does play a role when man preaches the gospel. It is also inconsistent to claim that man's response is a work.

 

I already did.

 

You're reading your doctrine into it. You should listen to D M Lloyd-Jones break it down for you. Beware, he's sola fide, reformed, and likes puritans.

 

Man's response isn't a work.
Salvation is by grace through faith. Man accepts salvation as Christ's work of grace; his gift to us, accepted by faith. Faith is not a work. It must be accepted by faith.

 

My doctrine? Probably 95% of what I posted was scripture. As badly as you hate to hear it and as much as you're slave to your own presuppositions, faith without works is dead. It is NOT only by faith.

 

I don't see an answer from you. Can you please tell me the difference between your true 'sola fide' and their perverted 'sola fide'?

 

There are those that hear, but have no capacity to hear and those that hear and are given ears to hear.

The declaration by God given to all men, does not mean that all men have the innate capability to respond to the declaration. I think this is specifically shown in the Romans 11 passage.

You and I both agree that there will be a time when the blinding and deafness will be removed, until then, the declaration of Acts 17 remains a problem for those who want to embrace some views that engage in saying that there must be some innate ability in all humankind or God would not have given Acts 17.

Are you not neglecting Romans 8 and in particular the verses about the person who is of the flesh (unsaved)?

5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.​

I want to point out that the "ministry of reconciliation" does not replace the one who actually reconciles and the "ambassador" only speaks what the authority that endows (or charges) the ambassador and allows the ambassador to spoke on the authorities behalf.

These are shown in the passages from you quote of 2 Corinthians 5 with the highlights you have given (thank you):

2 Corinthians 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
​

To those of the Cal thinking, there are some non-cals who would take the ministry as their ministry (that is what papists do by priestly duties) or that such ambassadorship is found within the capacity of the unsaved to self generate. I am not certain that you would consider a papist view, but do you hold that the unsaved have some innate ability to self - generate a spiritual tune acceptable to God?

The Lord Jesus states that He often (through prophets and others sent) desired Jerusalem to awaken to their need. But they would not. The same thinking is with that of pharaoh who would be given both testimony and signs, yet would harden his heart - and God confirming that hardness.

That God knows, from eternity past, which hearts are already turned from light to embrace darkness (John 1) if follows that God only empowers those who have no turned to become His (John 1).

Being repetitious, John (1) in no reading or rendering can be taken as God giving everyone equal opportunity. But takes those who do not turn from the light and empowers them to believe. These are not self empowered, nor do they know of the empowering, until such time as they are presented with the Gospel and the Holy Spirit gives them the New Birth.

So, when one reads Acts 17 and tries to couple it with 2 Corinthians 5, there can be a move toward some view that does not maintain the standard and statements of the specific nature God must work through the command and the reconciliation offered by His ambassadors. This would of its own nature require that there be some human element in the empowerment, or some human ability in the Grace that implants belief expressed as faith.

 

I am not sure what Romans 11 has to do with this. I believe that all men have what is termed as "innate faith."
First, Jesus used little children as an example. Unless you be as little children you cannot enter into the kingdom of God, or have faith as a child. Their faith was very simplistic, trusting. They trusted their parents implicitly for all things.
Second, Jesus healed all who came to him whether they were saved or not. He healed often according to their faith even though they were not saved. They had faith in Christ as a healer, but not necessarily as a Savior or Messiah. Both Peter (Acts 516) healed all who came to them whether they were saved or not. But why did they all go out to be healed? Because they desired to be healed and believed they could be healed, not necessarily saved. Thus the unsaved demonstrates faith.
Third, we all have faith. It is the object of our faith that is important. We are commanded to put Jesus as the object of our faith. When he becomes the object of our faith (in opposition to money, the world, fame, etc.) then one can be saved.

God doesn't give a command that man cannot obey. Time after time he pleads for man to come to him with no strings attached.
Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

John 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

This passage of Scripture follows Romans 7, which gives a struggle of the two natures. Paul continues the theme. He is talking about the believer, not the unbeliever. The believer can act out of the flesh. The mind of the believer can act hostile toward God. In fact James says it can be as the enemy of God (James 4:4). When the mind of the believer is set on the things of the world or the things of the flesh it is not subject to the law of God, neither can it be. Those believers that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Heb.11:6 says the same thing. Without faith it is impossible to please God. If you are not acting in faith you are acting out of the flesh.
The entire discussion is a continuation from Romans 7:
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

True. The Great Commission as stated in Mat.28:18-20 makes that clear. Jesus said, "All authority is given unto me."
But in vs. 20 he said, "and lo I am with you always..." He meant that we have always, access to that same authority, as we go into the world as ambassadors for him.

These are shown in the passages from you quote of 2 Corinthians 5 with the highlights you have given (thank you):

2 Corinthians 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
​

I am not sure what you mean. Faith is faith and does not need to be "generated." It is innate. Little children have implicit faith in their parents. They came to Christ. Jesus said of a Roman centurion that he had more faith than all in Israel. He told Christ that he could heal his daughter without going to his house, but from afar. He had that faith. Yet, his faith was in Christ as a healer.
Cornelius was not saved but had faith in God.

I believe that account gives evidence that Pharaoh had already hardened his heart. The Lord only continued to do what Pharaoh had initially done himself.
Jesus showed his compassion for all of Israel, though he knew they would reject him. He prayed for them all without discrimination, which is a demonstration of his love for the entire world, not just the elect.

God knows from eternity past. That is true. But he does not influence in any way their choice to decide. Why would he do that? It is man's choice to choose or reject. The one's who crucified Christ will be held accountable for their actions even though it was prophesied. God did not force them to carry out this heinous crime.

And yet in Romans one, we see that they had a knowledge of the truth, deliberately turned from that knowledge, and worshiped idols instead. It clearly says that all mankind will stand before God and be "without excuse."

The ambassador is God's human element, God's agent that is commanded to carry the gospel.
Faith is man's obligation to respond. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. But he must hear first.
He has the faith. Faith is not given to the unregenerate. It is salvation that is the gift, not faith. It must be received by faith.

 

The blindness in Romans is about Israel not the while word

 

Not so, but OK.

Non sequitur. That is not a biblically accurate description of faith, nor does faith secure salvation. It is evidence of salvation, not the cause. Note Eph. 1:19.

I thought you stated man already has faith, so then why does the Word contradict what you believe and say it comes from the Word of God? Certainly you can spin this passage with your presuppositions, but your presups are not in that text. They're in your mind, but not in Scripture thus you read your doctrine into the Word instead of getting it from the Word itself.

Wait, what?

According to you all men have faith including the unregenerate. Then it is claimed as absurd by you for God to gift faith to the unregenerate, to whom you say have it in the first place. I wonder dhk from whence did this faith the unregenerate have, come from?

Salvation is evidenced by faith.

 

I had asked you :"Please tell me how His death drew all the residents of Hell to Himself" None of your references address my questions. No Scripture exists that would support such nonsense..

You sound like a 2 year old. A very naughty two year old.

You still belive the manmade myth of free will and your robot absurdity. Your arguments against Scripture are duly noted.

He doesn't merely "know" who the elect are --He actually has elected them before the world was created. He knows them --intimately. The Father draws them and gives them to Jesus. That's why they come.

It is speaking of all the non-elect. He doesn't know them --He has never loved them. Not knowing = hatred.

No matter how many times I have corrected you --you still persist in your nonsense. It's like you are blind. God certainly doesn't force salvation on anyone. He drwas them with loving kindness. But every single one of His elect are thus drawn into saving union with Jesus.

You err not knowing the Scriptures.

Poor DHK. You just can't get it right to save your soul. God gives faith and repentance to the elect. If not they would not be saved. Spiritual gifts, on the on the other hand are given to believers.

No, you are continuing your old lies.

Pharaoh was not a believer in God. But God raised Him up for the purpose that God would display His pwer and that His pwer would be proclaimed in all the earth. (Ro. 9:17. Every single person who has and shall live will give glory to God --belivers and unbelievers alike.

You oppose the Holy Word of God. There is only one God to whom you must give an account. You hate Him. Every time you spout your garbage it will add to your judgment.

 

It is Eph.1:19 that is irrelevant here.
We are obligated to respond by faith.
For by grace are you saved by faith.
Therefore being justified by faith we have peace with God. (Rom.5:1)
Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Romans 4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
--Faith is not a work, but by faith a man is justified.

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
--Salvation or eternal life has always been God's gift to mankind to be accepted by faith.
We are obligated to accept this gift by faith; if not one cannot be saved.

Jesus made this very clear:
Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

You are confused. Every person has faith. It is the object of the faith that is important.
I am a Canadian and only know a little of American politics, and don't want to get into it much.
But I am going to use it as an example for faith and trust, for trust is a synonym of faith.

Suppose when Obama first took the presidency, you thought in your mind you would be objective and give him a chance. You didn't trust him much because after all that you heard you just didn't know. You "trusted" him a little.
He served for four years, and you made your opinion. You either trusted him more or less--I don't know. Either your "faith" grew or lessened. He was the object of your faith. He still is as far as your political leader is concerned. Do you trust him? How much? More than at first or less?
What about the present Republican candidates: Trump, Cruz, Rubio, Bush, etc. Which one do you trust the most to be your President, if a Republican were to be elected? Who would you make the object of your faith. If you would do your homework you would find out as much as possible about each one. The more information you have the more comfortable you would be with that candidate and the more faith you would be able to put in that individual as a prospective candidate for the presidency. True?

IOW, faith comes through knowledge and experience. The more you know the more confident you can be. It also comes through experience. If you know the person you know that you can either trust the person or not. How much can you trust your wife, and why? You married her. She became the object of your love and trust. You put your faith in her. You have a relationship with her.

In order to be saved a person must hear the gospel, understand the gospel, be convinced that the gospel is true. He cannot be saved until he is absolutely sure that the facts of the gospel are true and that the power of the gospel can indeed save him.
Thus faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. The more he becomes familiar with the Word, the gospel and the Christ of the gospel, the more likely it is that he will be saved. Very few people were saved the first time they heard the gospel.
Why? Faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God.

All men have faith. Faith is innate. It doesn't have to be given to the unsaved if they already have it.
Jesus said little children have faith. Whence do you say it came from? How do they have faith to implicitly trust their parents. It is innate. Are you still confused. Calvin did a good job didn't he?

Partly true. After one is saved then God increases our faith, adds to our faith, and faith becomes a fruit of the Spirit. But that doesn't happen until one puts "their faith" or confidence in Christ.
Salvation must be accepted by faith. It is the gift of God, not faith, but salvation.