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Preterists still won't give up...

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by robycop3, Dec 8, 2017.

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  1. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    History as you imagine it, not how it was delivered to you.

    Amos 9:11

    According the first apostolic council recorded in Acts 15, this prophecy has been fulfilled. Do you agree?
     
    #61 Aaron, Dec 12, 2017
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  2. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Not so. I have Encyclopsedia Britannica, Collier's Encyclopedia, & other works of history right in front of me, as well as the whole internet.

    Only partially. Judah has a sovereign nation again, but not the rest of Israel, far as we know.

    And gentiles were saved very early on, as Jesus Himself saved a Roman, a Samaritan, & a Canaanite woman. However, the prophecy is still being fulfilled, as most Christians today are gentiles, but very few Jews.

    As for the "tabernacle of David", Amos was referring to Jesus here. And yes, the apostles in Acts 15 knew the prophecy had been fulfilled in part. The council was about gentiles being saved.

    But the apostles' knowledge wasn't quite 100%. Whil3e sexual immorality has always been a sin, Paul later preached & wrote to not question the source of any meat set before you, but to thank God for it & eat. In most cases, one wouldn't know if it'd been offered to an idol, or been strangled And SOME blood remains in any meat. (As this is not the "Jabroney False Witless" forum, I won't discuss the blood thingie here.) Not even those apostles could get completely away from the "Mosaic" laws. (Remember Peter refusing to eat with gentiles til Paul admonished him? I assume this was after God had sent him to Cornelius' home.)

    But the prophecies we're concerned with here are the ESCHATOLOGICAL ones, the ones prets say are already fulfilled, but obviously AREN'T yet.
     
    #62 robycop3, Dec 12, 2017
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Many of the Ecf, and those such as Spurgeon held to Historical premil, and would see premil as explaining best the Kingdom reign of jesus here in all of its fullness , as that has not happened yet in history!
     
    #63 Yeshua1, Dec 12, 2017
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Are you familiar with that?
     
    #64 Yeshua1, Dec 12, 2017
  5. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    If you do not understand what I believe why do you misquote me?


    Yes it was, there is nothing that implies differently, you pervert that passage to fit your preconceived idea.

    are you taking that from Daniel 12:4 and thinking thats talking about technology?
     
    #65 prophecy70, Dec 12, 2017
  6. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    "I admitted to you formerly, that I and many others are of this opinion (temporal 1000 year reign), and [believe] that such will take place, as you assuredly are aware; but, on the other hand, I signified to you that many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians, think otherwise." (Dialogue with Trypho, CHAPTER LXXX Justin Martyr

    And Many did not believe it, so what it your point?
     
    #66 prophecy70, Dec 12, 2017
  7. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Point is that the historical church NEVER saw full preterist as being orthodox, as all have seen it as being heresy!
     
    #67 Yeshua1, Dec 12, 2017
  8. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    How is that relevant to the millennium?
     
    #68 prophecy70, Dec 12, 2017
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I was just asserting that full preterist is heresy.
     
    #69 Yeshua1, Dec 12, 2017
  10. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    The ECF taught and historicist view, The writer were mostly pre mil although Covenanter has quoted Justin as saying that there were many at his time that were a-mil. Maybe but as far as I can see they have not written such.

    The Kingdom of Jesus at present is the Church, where Christ Reigns. It will not come in all its fullness till Christ comes again and the saints take the kingdom.
     
    #70 David Kent, Dec 12, 2017
  11. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    That is a serious charge and one could equally say that futurism is a heresy,

    But they are both only interpretations and I disagree with both.
     
    #71 David Kent, Dec 12, 2017
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  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Premil right there!
     
    #72 Yeshua1, Dec 12, 2017
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The historical church has always claimed full blown preterism is heresy, as it denies the second coming as being future, and deny the physical resurrection of the saints. Futurism accepts both, so is not heresy, could be wrong, but does not rise to level of heresy!
     
    #73 Yeshua1, Dec 12, 2017
  14. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    I am not sure what Spurgeon taught, he seemed to change his teaching over the years. I have seen him quoted as pre mil but I have also seen a quote from him that said he didn't no a great deal about prophecy as he was called to preach the gospel rather than speculate about the future.

    A member of our church who is a retired pastor, gives a number of quotes from Spurgeon to say it is OK for us to celebrate Christmas, but I read in his Treasury of David, that he said that the Jews were told to celebrate only those festivals that God had ordained, and until somebody can show where scripture tells us to celebrate Christmas or Whitsun, we will not partake. (Writing from memory so wording won't be exact, but if anyone has the Treasury they may be able to correct me I think it was Psalm 80 or thereabouts.)
     
    #74 David Kent, Dec 12, 2017
  15. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    Duplicated
     
    #75 David Kent, Dec 12, 2017
  16. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    Triplicate
     
    #76 David Kent, Dec 12, 2017
  17. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    I was not saying either is heresy, that is what you said. I consider both to be from the same stable,

    I think heresy is teaching a different gospel of salvation. Only if you could prove that one or the other teaches that would I agree that it is heretical

    On that matter you could google Is Dispensationalism a return to New Testament
     
    #77 David Kent, Dec 12, 2017
  18. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Cuz apparently you believe some INCORRECT things.




    No, YOU have a preconceived idea. Nothing indicates Titus was that prince. Remember, he did NOT wanna destroy the temple.



    Yerp! Knowledge is increasing faster than ever before, and tech is among the areas in which it's increasing. NOTHING indicates otherwise.
     
    #78 robycop3, Dec 12, 2017
  19. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Correct. And Matt, 24:29-30 prove partial preterism false as well.
     
    #79 robycop3, Dec 12, 2017
  20. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    You believe a phantom planet is coming to earth. So ill stick with what I believe


    How is that preconceived? I take it at face value, the People of the prince came a destroyed the temple. It already happened in AD 70. Im not adding anything... you are.



    That has nothing to do with Daniel 12, but good try to take one verse out of the bible and add it to what you want.


    That is just ignorant, based on the gospel according to robycop3
     
    #80 prophecy70, Dec 12, 2017
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