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Featured Calvinism and Aminianism and their influence on Adventist belief

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Hobie, Feb 9, 2020.

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  1. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Of ourselves we can do nothing, but the Holy Spirit presses up against us, and brings us to the realization of our sinful state and resides within. Notice what these text say:

    1 Peter 1:11 King James Version (KJV)
    11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

    1 Corinthians 6:19 King James Version (KJV)
    19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
     
    #21 Hobie, Feb 18, 2020
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Sda placed Ellen White on same level as the real Apostles of Christ, elevated her false teachings to be on par with scriptures, and teaching a salvation by both grace and good works!
     
    #22 Yeshua1, Feb 18, 2020
  3. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    God does the saving. ". . . that not of yourselves: . . ." Ephesians 2:8. And God through Christ does the keeping, ". . . never perish . . . ." John 10:28.
     
    #23 37818, Feb 18, 2020
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  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Ellen white missed those, as she claimed that the holy Spirit revealed to her that there must be a final justifaction/vindication afterdeath, so one still had areal chance of losing their salvation!
     
    #24 Yeshua1, Feb 18, 2020
  5. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    But I notice you leave out the work of the Holy Spirit...

    John 3:5 King James Version (KJV)
    5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

    John 6:63 King James Version (KJV)
    63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
     
    #25 Hobie, Feb 18, 2020
  6. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    You make a false assertion.
    First off God is Holy and is Spirt. John 4:24, ". . . God is Spirit." The Holy Spirit is also the Spirit of Christ, Romans 8:9, ". . . if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. . . ."
    And this to possess eternal life. 1 John 5:12, ". . . He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. . . ." And the Spirit is also a Person of Him(it)self by whom Christ dwells in those who are God's children, and by whom we know God and that we who are His are His, Romans 8:16, ". . . The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . . ."

    One Spirit who is the One God by whom there are three Persons who are the One God. [Romans 8:9. Romans 8:16]
     
    #26 37818, Feb 19, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
  7. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Sorry I didnt mean it that way, just a observation. But that is why you have to take into account the work of the Holy Spirit as it brings one to Christ. Thus we read:

    John 3:1-8 King James Version (KJV)
    1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
    2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
    3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
    4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
    5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
    6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
    7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
    8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
     
    #27 Hobie, Feb 19, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
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  8. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    2 Thessaloinians 2:13-14, ". . . But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. . . ."
     
    #28 37818, Feb 19, 2020
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  9. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    But notice how the Holy Spirit is spoken of:
    Ezekiel 11:19
    And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

    Ezekiel 36:26
    A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

    Ezekiel 36:27
    And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

    Matthew 12:18
    Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

    But we still can reject the Holy Spirit:

    Matthew 12:31-32 King James Version (KJV)
    31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
    32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
     
    #29 Hobie, Feb 19, 2020
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  10. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    @Hobie,
    Jesus gave promises regarding the giving the Holy Spirit, an important one to remember, John 14:16, ". . . that he may abide with you for ever; . . ." Which makes the promise in, John 10:28, ". . . never perish . . . ," so.
     
    #30 37818, Feb 19, 2020
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Do you think that we can lose our eternal life now in Christ?
     
    #31 Yeshua1, Feb 19, 2020
  12. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    We need to turn to Gods Word for the answer...

    Hebrews 10:26-31 King James Version (KJV)
    26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
    27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
    28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
    29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
    30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
    31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
     
    #32 Hobie, Feb 19, 2020
  13. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    " But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
    33 partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
    34 For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
    35 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
    36 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
    37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
    38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if [any man] draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
    39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." ( Hebrews 10:39 )
     
    #33 Dave G, Feb 19, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
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  14. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Amen, we must not draw back, may God help our lack of faith.
     
    #34 Hobie, Feb 19, 2020
  15. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    " Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." ( John 5:24 ).

    " And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day." ( John 6:39 ).

    " That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none. " ( John 18:9 )

    " Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:" ( Philippians 1:6 )
     
    #35 Dave G, Feb 19, 2020
  16. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    " But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." ( Hebrews 10:39 )
     
    #36 Dave G, Feb 19, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
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  17. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    #37 37818, Feb 20, 2020
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  18. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Need to keep in mind that many who claim they believe are still in the clasp of evil and iniquity and are blind to it...

    Matthew 23:28
    Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

    Matthew 7:22-23 King James Version (KJV)
    22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
    23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
     
    #38 Hobie, Feb 20, 2020
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  19. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    ". . . , I never knew you: . . ."
     
    #39 37818, Feb 20, 2020
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  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Written to Jewish believers , who were tempted to go back to the jewish temple and sacrifices, so the point would be not that really saved lose salvation, but that those merely professing salvation need to resist going back to OT system , as only Jesus Saves!
     
    #40 Yeshua1, Feb 20, 2020
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