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Calvinism and Aminianism and their influence on Adventist belief

Hobie

Well-Known Member
Romans 3:11 says otherwise, ". . . There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. . . ."
Of ourselves we can do nothing, but the Holy Spirit presses up against us, and brings us to the realization of our sinful state and resides within. Notice what these text say:

1 Peter 1:11 King James Version (KJV)
11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

1 Corinthians 6:19 King James Version (KJV)
19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
 

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I went into both sides and I came across the tension between Calvinism and Arminianism . But I am not what you would call an expert on it by any stretch of the immaginatin, so please feel free to give more insight.

According to Calvinism:
"Salvation is accomplished by the almighty power of the triune God. The Father chose a people, the Son died for them, the Holy Spirit makes Christ's death effective by bringing the elect to faith and repentance, thereby causing them to willingly obey the Gospel. The entire process (election, redemption, regeneration) is the work of God and is by grace alone. Thus God, not man, determines who will be the recipients of the gift of salvation."

Thus they stand against the freewill of man being turned to God on its own as seen in the following statement...

"... and I will go as far as Martin Luther, in that strong assertion of his, where he says, ‘If any man doth ascribe of salvation, even the very least, to the free will of man, he knoweth nothing of grace, and he hath not learnt Jesus Christ aright.’ It may seem a harsh sentiment; but he who in his soul believes that man does of his own free will turn to God, cannot have been taught of God, for that is one of the first principles taught us when God begins with us, that we have neither will nor power, but that He gives both; that He is ‘Alpha and Omega’ in the salvation of men." (Charles H. Spurgeon from the sermon ‘Free Will A Slave’ (1855) referring to Luther's book The Bondage of the Will which is listed with other resources on this topic after this article).

Now Arminianism attempts to explain the relationship between God’s sovereignty and mankind’s free will, especially in relation to salvation. While Calvinism emphasizes the sovereignty of God, Arminianism emphasizes the responsibility of man. If Arminianism is broken down into five points, similar to the five points of Calvinism, these would be the five points:

(1) Partial Depravity – humanity is tainted by sin, but not to the extent that we cannot chose to come to God on our own. We are capable of choosing to accept salvation or reject it without any influence from God. Note - classical Arminianism rejects "partial depravity" and holds a view very close to Calvinistic "total depravity."
(2) Conditional Election – God chose who would be saved based on knowing beforehand who would believe. God chooses those who He knows will believe.
(3) Unlimited Atonement – Jesus died for everyone, even those who are not chosen and will not believe. Jesus’ death was for all of humanity, and anyone can be saved by belief in Him.
(4) Resistible Grace – God’s call on a person’s life to be saved can be resisted and/or rejected. We can resist God’s pull towards salvation if we choose to.
(5) Conditional Salvation – Christians can lose their salvation if they continue in a life of sin and/or fall away from God. The maintenance of salvation is required for a Christian to retain it.

Now some modern Arminians deny "conditional salvation" and instead hold to "eternal security." Now the only point of Arminianism which Calvinists would agree is point #3 – Unlimited Atonement as they see as most Christians that the Bible indicates that Jesus died for the sins of everyone in the entire world. 1 John 2:2 says, “He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.” 2 Peter 2:1 says that Jesus even bought the wicked who will reject him such as false prophets who are doomed: “But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them–bringing swift destruction on themselves.” Jesus’ death and atonement is available to everyone who will believe in Him. Jesus did not just die for those who will be saved but for the whole world, but only those who accept His gift gain eternal life.

Calvinism tends to not agree with the other four points of Arminianism pointin to Romans 3:10-18 which they feel argues for total depravity and that Romans 8:28-30 as showing that conditional election underemphasizes God’s sovereignty. Calvinist feel that resistible grace underestimates the power and determination of God and that conditional salvation makes salvation a work rather than a gift of grace

Adventism tends towards the Arminian (Free Will) view and away from Calivinism and this cause some conflict with Calvinist, for those who remember the dialogues initiated with Adventist by evangelicals Donald Barnhouse and Walter Martin, who sought clarification on what Adventists believed. The ones who fought the hardest from accepting Adventist were the Calvinist theologians and church leaders such as evangelical Anthony Hoekema (who felt Adventists were more in agreement with Arminianism), who argued that some Adventist doctrines were heterodox and did his best to keep them from being accepted.
Sda placed Ellen White on same level as the real Apostles of Christ, elevated her false teachings to be on par with scriptures, and teaching a salvation by both grace and good works!
 

37818

Well-Known Member
Of ourselves we can do nothing, but the Holy Spirit presses up against us, and brings us to the realization of our sinful state and resides within. Notice what these text say:

1 Peter 1:11 King James Version (KJV)
11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

1 Corinthians 6:19 King James Version (KJV)
19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
God does the saving. ". . . that not of yourselves: . . ." Ephesians 2:8. And God through Christ does the keeping, ". . . never perish . . . ." John 10:28.
 

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
God does the saving. ". . . that not of yourselves: . . ." Ephesians 2:8. And God through Christ does the keeping, ". . . never perish . . . ." John 10:28.
Ellen white missed those, as she claimed that the holy Spirit revealed to her that there must be a final justifaction/vindication afterdeath, so one still had areal chance of losing their salvation!
 

Hobie

Well-Known Member
God does the saving. ". . . that not of yourselves: . . ." Ephesians 2:8. And God through Christ does the keeping, ". . . never perish . . . ." John 10:28.
But I notice you leave out the work of the Holy Spirit...

John 3:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

John 6:63 King James Version (KJV)
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
 

37818

Well-Known Member
But I notice you leave out the work of the Holy Spirit...
You make a false assertion.
First off God is Holy and is Spirt. John 4:24, ". . . God is Spirit." The Holy Spirit is also the Spirit of Christ, Romans 8:9, ". . . if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. . . ."
And this to possess eternal life. 1 John 5:12, ". . . He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. . . ." And the Spirit is also a Person of Him(it)self by whom Christ dwells in those who are God's children, and by whom we know God and that we who are His are His, Romans 8:16, ". . . The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . . ."

One Spirit who is the One God by whom there are three Persons who are the One God. [Romans 8:9. Romans 8:16]
 
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Hobie

Well-Known Member
You make a false assertion.
First off God is Holy and is Spirt. John 4:24, ". . . God is Spirit." The Holy Spirit is also the Spirit of Christ, Romans 8:9, ". . . if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. . . ."
And this to possess eternal life. 1 John 5:12, ". . . He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. . . ." And the Spirit is also a Person of Him(it)self by whom Christ dwells in those who are God's children, and by whom we know God and that we who are His are His, Romans 8:16, ". . . The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . . ."
Sorry I didnt mean it that way, just a observation. But that is why you have to take into account the work of the Holy Spirit as it brings one to Christ. Thus we read:

John 3:1-8 King James Version (KJV)
1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
 
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37818

Well-Known Member
Sorry I didnt mean it that way, just a observation. But that is why you have to take into account the work of the Holy Spirit as it is what begins bringing a believer to Christ. Thus we read:

John 3:1-8 King James Version (KJV)
1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
2 Thessaloinians 2:13-14, ". . . But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. . . ."
 

Hobie

Well-Known Member
2 Thessaloinians 2:13-14, ". . . But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. . . ."
But notice how the Holy Spirit is spoken of:
Ezekiel 11:19
And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Ezekiel 36:26
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

Ezekiel 36:27
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Matthew 12:18
Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

But we still can reject the Holy Spirit:

Matthew 12:31-32 King James Version (KJV)
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
 

37818

Well-Known Member
@Hobie,
Jesus gave promises regarding the giving the Holy Spirit, an important one to remember, John 14:16, ". . . that he may abide with you for ever; . . ." Which makes the promise in, John 10:28, ". . . never perish . . . ," so.
 

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
But notice how the Holy Spirit is spoken of:
Ezekiel 11:19
And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Ezekiel 36:26
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

Ezekiel 36:27
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Matthew 12:18
Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

But we still can reject the Holy Spirit:

Matthew 12:31-32 King James Version (KJV)
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
Do you think that we can lose our eternal life now in Christ?
 

Hobie

Well-Known Member
Do you think that we can lose our eternal life now in Christ?
We need to turn to Gods Word for the answer...

Hebrews 10:26-31 King James Version (KJV)
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
 

Dave G

Well-Known Member
" But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
33 partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
34 For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
35 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
36 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if [any man] draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." ( Hebrews 10:39 )
 
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Hobie

Well-Known Member
" But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
33 partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
34 For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
35 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
36 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if [any man] draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." ( Hebrews 10:39 )
Amen, we must not draw back, may God help our lack of faith.
 

Dave G

Well-Known Member
Do you think that we can lose our eternal life now in Christ?
We need to turn to Gods Word for the answer...

" Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." ( John 5:24 ).

" And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day." ( John 6:39 ).

" That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none. " ( John 18:9 )

" Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:" ( Philippians 1:6 )
 

Dave G

Well-Known Member
Amen, we must not draw back, may God help our lack of faith.
" But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." ( Hebrews 10:39 )
 
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37818

Well-Known Member
. . . wherewith he was sanctified, . . .
If one understands ". . . through sanctification of the Spirit . . . ," precedes coming to salvation through faith, then one can understand some even resist that, ". . . always resist the Holy Ghost: . . ." Acts of the Apostles 7:51. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. 1 Peter 1:2. John 16:7-9. John 8:47. John 10:26-28.
 

Hobie

Well-Known Member
If one understands ". . . through sanctification of the Spirit . . . ," precedes coming to salvation through faith, then one can understand some even resist that, ". . . always resist the Holy Ghost: . . ." Acts of the Apostles 7:51. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. 1 Peter 1:2. John 16:7-9. John 8:47. John 10:26-28.
" But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." ( Hebrews 10:39 )

Need to keep in mind that many who claim they believe are still in the clasp of evil and iniquity and are blind to it...

Matthew 23:28
Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

Matthew 7:22-23 King James Version (KJV)
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
 

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
We need to turn to Gods Word for the answer...

Hebrews 10:26-31 King James Version (KJV)
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Written to Jewish believers , who were tempted to go back to the jewish temple and sacrifices, so the point would be not that really saved lose salvation, but that those merely professing salvation need to resist going back to OT system , as only Jesus Saves!
 
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