Featured Old Testament men were not saved by "looking forward to the cross"

I had to deprogramme from this also . When I mentioned this in a bible study, it ruffled feathers . Its obvious the disciples were not 'looking forward to the cross '. Peter chops a man's ear off ,rather than let the cross happen.

 

It was always about election in Christ. WHich resulted in the New Birth and little information. Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit. So Abel, Job & friends, even Lot and all listed in Hebrews 11 were saved with little more than the promise God made to Abraham. If God blesses, salvation is the outcome. Jesus provided the complete revelation also preached at Pentecost by Peter, continuing through Paul.

“And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, ‘In thee shall all nations be blessed’.” Galatians 3:8 (NCPB)

 

Would you agree that Galations 5.22 is talking about the Fruit of The Spirit in context of AFTER conversion and not before ? There's no mention of ' fruit ' of the Holy Spirit in any pre conversion sense ?

 

*sigh*

The Gospel was preached to them as well as to us, Hebrews 4:2 , but it was preached through types and shadows. And faith is the means by which any work of God is accomplished. So though they might not have known Christ by the name Jesus, they knew Him as the Most High God, for whom Melchizedek was a priest, and they knew Him as the God of Abraham, as the Prophet who was to come as Moses, and as revelation was given, as the tabernacle, the priesthood, and the offerings.

It doesn't matter at all that they didn't have a more full understanding, just as it doesn't matter at all that anyone today have a full understanding. It's a Person that saves, not a doctrine, and that's reassuring, especially after seeing some of the Dispensational notions postulated in response to your error.

 

On and on Calvinists will post claims and offer deflections, but the OT saints gained approval through (or by means of) their faith in God and His promises. The coming Messiah's gospel was a mystery to them.

Why do Calvinists hoist this canard? According to their bogus doctrine, no one would seek God unless compelled by irresistible grace, so all the OT saints had to be compelled and given "saving faith." And that gift of course is faith in the gospel of Christ.

It is a ludicrous assertion, but there you have it.

But what is the actual biblical truth? Presented in post #5 by George and represented by me below:

The OT Saints gained approval by means of God crediting their faith (for example Abraham's) as righteousness and so when they physically died, their spirit/souls were taken to "Abraham's bosom" were they waited (in comfort) to be made perfect after Christ's death.

 

I can heartily agree with you that it is WHO you know (or more correctly, WHO KNOWS YOU) that saves, rather than WHAT we know. However I am reminded of a statement by R.C. Sproul at a Conference in Orlando where he stated that Everyone is a dispensationalist, unless you believe nothing changed when we were expelled from the garden of Eden.

There are at least 3 dispensations that all can agree on.

• Adam and God walking together in the garden of Eden.
• The present dispensation.
• The new Heaven and Earth when Jesus returns to dwell with His bride forever.

Beyond that, we are splitting hairs conjecturing about whether to subdivide “the present age” into smaller parts and where those divides should be. In some sense, God is constantly revealing more and doing something new, and in another sense, God never changes and his plan for us is the same as it was for Adam.

 

Is the 'good news 'about entering in to the '.rest 'the same as 1 cor .15 .1-4 . Anymore than being told to put blood on the door post and lintels , could be good news today ?

 

And can anyone be saved today apart from the good news we preach today ?
1cor 121For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

 

This may help those who may have already started to doubt Calivinism .

 

The truth is that only Jesus Saves. No where in scripture is anyone ever given Salvation by God or the Holy Spirit. Only Jesus saves.

 

Please show scripture for old testiment saints being saved?
If any one could have been saved before Christ there would have been no need of Christ to come.
MB

 

For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. 10 - 4 . Hebrews, that is; priestly prayers and faces of faith.

 

OK, I agree.

No one completely foresaw that the Messiah would actually come and die....
Or rise again.

If you would show me in the Scriptures where a believer was ever saved by their faith ( instead of through it ), I would appreciate it.
Until then, I maintain that one's faith does not save them...

God does, and their faith is a by-product of His work.
Even more, it is the evidence of that work ( Hebrews 11:1 ), and it was authored and finished by Jesus Christ ( Hebrews 12:2 ).
It may seem like a small detail with which to take exception, but to me it makes all the difference between grace and works.

Back to the OP:

As I see the Scriptures stating, no one is actually saved by doing something;
Looking to the cross or otherwise.
I agree that, similar to the serpent being lifted up, all who look to Christ in the spiritual sense will be saved.

But God's decision to save someone was and is always by His mercy and grace towards a person ( Titus 3:5-7 ).

 

1¶Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
??

 

You never responded to the verses I posted about Paul explaining clearly Faith is not a work .

 

God is pleased to save those that believe, not cause belief in those he saves. (1 Cor. 1:21; Rom. 10:9-10)" No God you cannot save those that use their own faculties, we must insist that this is a work and you are sovereign, we need this to be ,so that the rest of our system can work "

 

Dispensationalism with a captial D is a doctrine that teaches the church is a sort of parentheses in God's real plan which was the elevation of the Jews as the supreme rulers of of the world, Christ as King, with all nations under the law of sacrifice and offering.