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Which would be option 2... that God, for whatever reason, has chosen not to reveal the 'truth' of Calvinism to all his children. Why is that an incorrect assessment? So you can't refer me to any notable scholars/commentators who best represent most of your views on these matters? I know you...

I don't like it when people do that to me, so I apologize if I'm guilty of doing that to you. If you can point it out when I do it then I'll try to avoid it. Labeling and dismissing is a temptation for all of us during a debate and its the lazy man's way out. However, sometimes tags or labels...

Again, we are debating the means by which the spirit indwells...which the verses I presented clearly show is accomplish 'through faith' and not the other way around.

I know you still have a post of mine to reply to already, but I have interject here...don't we all agree that the spirit of God must dwell in us? Aren't we debating the means through which the spirit indwells? Look at Gal. 3: 'He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might...

I was once 'enlightened' as a hard core five pointer, but I guess God decided to take it away from me for a while...but maybe it will come back? :laugh: Seriously, I think the fact the many believers are not Calvinistic is revealing in regard to man's freedom of the will. If Calvinism is...

Not at all. Just thinking that our destiny is predetermined by someone other than ourselves, regardless of whether we know that destiny, can have the effect I described above. In fact, I know it first hand, as I used to be a Calvinist and remember thinking thing like, 'well I told that guy...

Biblicist, Don't you see your are just giving all unbelievers a really good excuse for their unbelief? Just affirm human responsibility and God's sovereignty and stop speculating at the rest, you are not helping anyone with a teaching the removes human responsibility. I know, I know, you...

I have to say, I understood your explanation about Israel being representatives of individuals but I didn't comprehend it. Maybe I need a Calvinistic quickening from God? :laugh: This specifically makes NO SENSE, nor is it biblical. He said he speaks in parables (which is NOT more light...

This point deserved a post of its own... I was hoping you would bring up that scripture...let's look at the entire context shall we? 13 This is why I speak to them in parables: "Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand. 14 In them is fulfilled the...

And as I have said you and I have different views on how one goes from being dead to living...i.e. becoming regenerated. I believe Paul is explaining how unsaved Gentiles are without excuse for their still being unsaved because they have CLEARLY SEEN and COMPREHENDED what there was to be known...

There are many scriptures which speak to the power of the Word. Jesus even said, "the very word I speak to you is spirit and life." He also says that his words are what will condemn those who reject them in the final day (Jn 12). If the word of God is preached and a man rejects it, is a lack...

You are the one saying that it says something that it doesn't...it says "The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness" You take that to mean "all men suppress the truth" even though all men...

That is a very good explanation James. Hatred sometimes connotes more a choice between someone being used for a 'noble purpose' (Jacob) and and 'common one.' (Esau) And it doesn't necessarily mean one is condemned and the other is not. Paul addresses this later in Romans 9 when he speaks of...

I disagree. I don't consider someone being confronted by the powerful, life-giving, Holy Spirit wrought, inspired gospel truth acting 'on their own accord.' Do you? I think more highly of the gospel appeal than that...

If that were the case, then Jesus shift to later include those who believe their message doesn't make much sense given that they had already been prayed for in the "as many as." It is a shift in your perceptive. You are thinking Jesus is speaking universally, when in reality he is speaking...

Right, all who suppress it....it never says everyone has suppressed it. In fact, we both agree that some (i.e. Abraham) have NOT suppressed it, but have in faith proclaimed it. Now, we should debate the means by which he, and others, came to believe as that is our point of contention. Is that...

John 17:3 is in reference to the twelve that were given to Christ by the Father. Christ, in the same chapter, also prays for all those who believe in their message. God loves all mankind and desires all to come to repentance. That is one of the most biblically supported truths in all of...

I thought that may have been what happened, but just wanted to be sure. :thumbs:

I think you misunderstand our view. We believe men are in bondage to sin, we just also affirm the biblical teaching that the truth can set men free. We believe men are under sin, we just also affirm the gospel of forgiveness for whosoever asks. We believe that no man can save himself...

I'm not sure how this response relates to my post? You will need to connect the dots for me. I was speaking about wrath/hatred and Grace/love of God...not sure what you are talking about?