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Right. The SBC figure you linked to is ONLY 'field personnel' of the IMB, which of course is International Missions. That doesn't include the NAMB which also supports missionaries throughout the United States, Puerto Rico, Canada, Guam, American Samoa, and the Virgin Islands (close to 5K)...

Fervor refers to "desire," and that is exactly what I was attempting to disprove. Even if it could be shown that the PCA is MORE effective at its size in reaching higher percentages of lost people (which in fact the stats don't support) that doesn't prove greater desire (fervor) for evangelism...

Do you mean like God inspiring the writing of events he can't possibly know because he doesn't remember them anymore? The difference between your view and mine is that I appeal to mystery so as to avoid drawing a false conclusion, while you draw a false conclusion by appealing to a mystery...

We were discussing Edwards quote and the argument over the origin of evil. I don't believe any specific text was in question. You've always rejected the idea of God's permitting of evil unless it was accompanied by his determining it as well. I'm getting tired of you calling me a liar when I...

Luke, if you go back to our original discussion we were talking about the origin of evil and God's decree of whatsoever comes to pass, remember? I appealed to J. Dahmer's henious crimes as something God would never cause/do/desire, though clearly he permitted them, remember? Your rebuttal was...

Then your argument goes to prove effectiveness in evangelism not motivation or desire for evangelism. I was only taking issue with your claim that one group is "more evangelistic" because of their theological perspective than the other. One could argue that the decline in Baptisms and...

Please don't misunderstand my intent. I'm not attempting to deny how well the PCA has done, I'm only attempting to show how ridiculous the claim that it is "more evangelistic" than the SBC, when the facts just don't bare that out. My pointing out its size difference was in effort to show how...

This method of biblical proof texting is tantamount to me quoting something like, "...and Judas went out and hung himself..." "...go and do likewise..." "...what thou doeth, doeth quickly...." It is absurd. You must know the circumstances of the passage and the issue being addressed by the...

Ok, so when is the molestation of a child ever "not evil?" What possible "motive" does the doer of that "deed" need to have for that "deed" to not be deemed "evil?" Luke, this concept that a deed is only evil when the motive is impure is unfounded. A lie is always a lie, even if the the...

Actually, believe it or not, you and I are in agreement on this point. :thumbsup:

I am not denying God's omniscience. I'm only admitting what some refuse to admit: It is impossible to understand how an infinite omniscient being makes a choice, comes up with a new thought, comes to know of something He didn't originate (i.e. a sinful intent). We MUST admit there is a level...

Suppose a person is drugged so as to lower their inhibitions and make them willing to do what they may not have chosen to do otherwise? They too would be acting "without compulsion," in that they are made to be willing, right? How is that much different from a system where God is the one who...

How does someone born totally blind (i.e. totally unable to see the truth and accept it), become more blind and more unable to see the truth and accept it? True. None can come unless drawn and God wasn't drawing anyone but a select few from Israel (i.e. the apostles) until after Christ was...

Yes, what I believe many people fail to see is that while Jesus was on earth his goal wasn't to convince as many people to believe in him as possible. In fact, it seemed to be quite the opposite. He hid the truth in parables revealing the mysteries only to a select few that the father had...

Can you describe the practical differences in the characteristics of one who is totally depraved versus one who is hardened? Are either any more or less able to see, hear, understand and respond, as the scriptures say they would be able to do had they not become hardened? If one is not born...

So, you are speculating that God may know of a murder but not know that the murder was violation of God's will? So, that would mean that God knew of Moses' murder but didn't know it violated His own plan, right? You don't find this a bit confounding and unnecessary? Why not just take the most...

I agree. Scripture is the authority and must be the basis for our conclusions. That being said, it should be noted that the bible never says we are born blind, deaf and hardened to the God's appeal for reconciliation. In fact, it teaches in numerous accounts that men "grown hardened" or...

As a former Calvinist myself, I will gladly concede the point that Calvinists are just as evangelistic as non-Calvinists, but I must take issue with this statement. In 2010: PCA reported 1455 churches with 346 thousand members SBC has over 37,000 churches with over 16 million members That stat...

Can you point me to a few which actually teach that God doesn't know about Peter's sin, which He later inspires to be written down in the scriptures? How about all the sins which were forgiven but later written by inspiration. How did God inspire the writing of that which he doesn't know? That...

Yeah, even in the compatibilistic view temptation exists, but my problem with their view is that it can't be distinguished from animal instinct. The compatibilist (which Luke claims to be) claims that a choice is free as long as it is in accordance with the man's desire. In other words, if...