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A Person, with a Weapon, Breaks into Your Home....

Would You Take a Life to Save Your Life/Loved One(s)?

  • Most defintiely...

    Votes: 43 91.5%
  • No....

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Situational ethics, and my mind is not made up...

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • There is no clear answer....

    Votes: 2 4.3%

  • Total voters
    47
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Not open for further replies.

Robert Snow

New Member
Well what do you call it when you want a gun? It's fear.

Let me ask you again. You failed to answer before, do you lock your doors at night? Using bible verses to espouse a pacifist stance is taking the verses out of context. We have a duty, from God, to protect our families to the best of our ability.

If someone could break into my house and somehow not arouse my chihuahuas, the last thing they would probably see is the red laser dot on their chest before I fired my pistol.
 

Steadfast Fred

Active Member
I do not own a gun. I will not bring a gun into my house.

My stance? Like Jim, I will use the Word of God. The weapons of our warfare are not carnal.

Jesus said in Matthew 5 that we are not to resist evil, but if one would smite us on the left cheek, we should offer the right also.

Use a gun? If you can provide Scripture where the Apostles used a gun in the face of danger, maybe my position will change.
 

righteousdude2

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Well, You Got Us With That One....

I do not own a gun. I will not bring a gun into my house.

My stance? Like Jim, I will use the Word of God. The weapons of our warfare are not carnal.

Jesus said in Matthew 5 that we are not to resist evil, but if one would smite us on the left cheek, we should offer the right also.

Use a gun? If you can provide Scripture where the Apostles used a gun in the face of danger, maybe my position will change.

....I guess you, and your wife will just have to suffer whatever evil whoever breaks into your home plans to do....and while they harm your wife and make you watch, I hope you really can calmly pray for a swift end to what they are there to do.

You and p-n-s are amazing individuals. To put it mildly, you will actually be loving your enemy to your death. If you can live with this decision, you are a bigger man, then me.

Thanks for you input. I was wondering where you had been. It's beena while since I've seen a post from you. I hope all is well??? :praying:
 

Steadfast Fred

Active Member
The Apostles also loved their enemies to their deaths, so I reckon I will be in good company if ever such an event takes place.

I only pray that God gives me the boldness to preach at such a time. What a powerful witness that could be!

We are well. I trust you are well also?
 

righteousdude2

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Well....

Well...

Here is some good scriptural information for the ones who advocate for the "shoot 'em right between the eyes" option....


http://www.plowcreek.org/bible_pacifism.htm

...there is room enough in the world of Christianity for those who cling to a pacifist view to life. It is a good thing for the pacificist that there are people willing to do what you don't believe in doing, because those folks keep you safe, and possibly alive.

Both views/sides have merit; it's just that I am not the type of person who could sit by and watch someone do harm to any of my loved ones. In clonclusion, I would hope that the pacifists are as tolerant towards my view as I am towards theirs. Selah!

Shalom!
 

Sapper Woody

Well-Known Member
Well...

Here is some good scriptural information for the ones who advocate for the "shoot 'em right between the eyes" option....


http://www.plowcreek.org/bible_pacifism.htm

The problem with those verses quoted in the link is that none of them actually support a pcifistic view when it comes to self defense, and defense of the home. Some of them don't have anything to do with the discussion at hand at all.

For instance:
Col 1.16 for in him [the son] all things in heaven and on earth were created, things visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or powers—all things have been created through him and for him.

Heb 1.2-3 In these last days [God] has spoken to us by a Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom he also created the worlds. 3 who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,

Lu 6:37 "Judge not, and you will not be judged; condemn not, and you will not be condemned; forgive, and you will be forgiven;

Mt 7:12 In everything do to others as you would have them do to you; for this is the law and the prophets

Lu 6:42 Or how can you say to your neighbor, ’Friend, let me take out the speck in your eye,’ when you yourself do not see the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbor’s eye.

Isa 31:1 Alas for those who go down to Egypt for help and who rely on horses, who trust in chariots because they are many and in horsemen because they are very strong, but do not look to the Holy One of Israel or consult the LORD!

Rom 5.8,10 8 But God shows his love for us in that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.... 10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life.

Eph 6.12 For our struggle is not against enemies of blood and flesh, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers of this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.

2 Co 10:4 The weapons with which we fight are not human weapons, but are mighty for God in overthrowing strong fortresses.


John 8.7 But when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

Rom 8.37 No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor rulers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.
None of those verses has anything at all to do with the subject matter at hand.

Now, let's look at the verses that could be construes to mean how some are taking them:

Mt 5:44 But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.

Lu 6:27 But I say to you that listen, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you. 29 If anyone strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also;

Lu 6:35 But love your enemies, do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return. Your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High; for he is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked.
These verses don't have anything to do with self defense. Also, it never says not to defend yourself against people. You can love someone, and still shoot them. When I had to shoot the Taliban, it was with a heavy heart, and I wished that I didn't have to do it. I still hold out the hope that I never have to again. I will if it comes to it, but I hope it does not.

But, also, these verses are talking about being a righteous person, and doing good, even though people hate you. It is not talking about a literally, physical enemy.

Lu 12:22 And he said to his disciples, "Therefore I tell you, do not be anxious about your life, what you shall eat, nor about your body, what you shall put on.
This is simply saying "Don't Worry". I am not worried. If an intruder breaks into my house with intent to harm me or my family, I know God will protect me through the use of a firearm.

Mt 26:52 Then Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back into its place; for all who take the sword will perish by the sword.
I can see how this could be taken to mean don't defend yourselves. But this is clearly a situational thing. Firstly, they were trying to impede God's will. They didn't know this, and were actually doing a good thing by trying to defend Christ. But, if they would have fought, they would have died, as they were surrounded by Roman soldiers. So, if they would have taken up a sword, they'd have died by the sword.

:9 Do not return evil for evil or reviling for reviling; but on the contrary bless, for to this you have been called, that you may obtain a blessing.

Ro 12.17-21 Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all. 18 If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. 19 Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave room for the wrath of God; for it is written, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord." 20 No, "if your enemies are hungry, feed them; if they are thirsty, give them something to drink; for by doing this you will heap burning coals on their heads."

1Th 5:15 See that none of you repays evil for evil, but always seek to do good to one another and to all.
These are self explanatory as well. These verses obviously do not go against the principle of protecting what you have. It is talking about not seeking vengeance. Vengeance does not equal justice. It also does not equal protecting what you have.

29 If anyone strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also;
This is the only verse that I can see where people might be able to make a solid case against self defense. But even then, if you want to interperet it that way, it's only talking about yourself.

The Bible clearly says that if we know to do good, and don't, we've sinned. It's good to stop a rapist from raping, so do it. It's good to protect your family, so do it.

In my case, if an intruder enters my house, if he's unarmed then I simply stop him. If he's armed, I shoot him, and even then only after giving him a chance to surrender. I am not bloodthirsty, and do not wish to kill anyone. But I will if I have to.

Even the Bible quoted in that link says
18 If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all.
If it is possible and as it depends on you. It doesn't depend on you if a man comes to harm. He's crossed that line that puts it on you, and it's on him at that point.

I am pretty open-minded in most areas. But this is one area that I am not. If you want to put yourself in danger by not resisting an intruder/attacker, then so be it. But to put your wife or your kids in danger is sin. It is not protecting what God has given you. It is the highest form of apathy (as opposed to love) that you can show a family member. It is dangerous, and it is un-Godly.
 

Steadfast Fred

Active Member
If someone broke into my home and I did nothing, I would not be putting my wife in danger... she would already be in danger, whether I did anything or not.
 

saturneptune

New Member
If someone broke into my home and I did nothing, I would not be putting my wife in danger... she would already be in danger, whether I did anything or not.
Maybe after the person that breaks in destroys your family, you all could take in a movie, stop by Waffle House for a cup of coffee.
 

Sapper Woody

Well-Known Member
If someone broke into my home and I did nothing, I would not be putting my wife in danger... she would already be in danger, whether I did anything or not.

And allowing her to continue in danger is just as bad. If you saw your child in the street, would you have the same attitude? "Oh well, my child is already in danger, and I didn't put her there, so all's good."
 

Robert Snow

New Member
I do not own a gun. I will not bring a gun into my house.

My stance? Like Jim, I will use the Word of God. The weapons of our warfare are not carnal.

Jesus said in Matthew 5 that we are not to resist evil, but if one would smite us on the left cheek, we should offer the right also.

Use a gun? If you can provide Scripture where the Apostles used a gun in the face of danger, maybe my position will change.

If you can provide Scripture where the Apostles used electricity in their homes...

Many years ago I worked as a prison guard here in Texas for a short while. If you met some of the people I met your viewpoint on guns and protecting your family might change.
 

Steadfast Fred

Active Member
If you can provide Scripture where the Apostles used electricity in their homes...

Many years ago I worked as a prison guard here in Texas for a short while. If you met some of the people I met your viewpoint on guns and protecting your family might change.

Probably not. I have lived around some rough characters, having brothers and cousins who were bikers and drug addicts.

I have seen gunplay. I have seen thefts and burglaries. People do a lot of crazy things to support their habits, even to the point of murder.

Before I got saved, I had the same mentality... kill or be killed, whatever you need, if the opportunity arises, take it. Take it by force if necessary.

After I got saved, I became a new creature. I no longer wanted to return evil for evil. I no longer wanted to do unto my neighbor before he did unto me. I no longer wanted to cap the person who did me wrong. God changed my heart.

If I have to suffer persecution, so be it. But I will not own a gun. If I have to face death, then I will face death. I will not lift a hand of violence against my enemy. I will not kill another human being.
 

Robert Snow

New Member
Probably not. I have lived around some rough characters, having brothers and cousins who were bikers and drug addicts.

I have seen gunplay. I have seen thefts and burglaries. People do a lot of crazy things to support their habits, even to the point of murder.

Before I got saved, I had the same mentality... kill or be killed, whatever you need, if the opportunity arises, take it. Take it by force if necessary.

After I got saved, I became a new creature. I no longer wanted to return evil for evil. I no longer wanted to do unto my neighbor before he did unto me. I no longer wanted to cap the person who did me wrong. God changed my heart.

If I have to suffer persecution, so be it. But I will not own a gun. If I have to face death, then I will face death. I will not lift a hand of violence against my enemy. I will not kill another human being.

You talk like everyone who owns a gun has returned to an evil way of life. This is not true. You also seem to have the attitude that protecting your family is evil.

I propose that to allow anyone to harm your family when you can stop it is the true evil. No only is it evil, it is cowardice. A person who thinks they see this in the Word of God is only fooling their self.

Thank God the Christians in the military do not share your pacifist views. If they did our great country, God has blessed us with, would not exist.

BTW, I shoot guns because I enjoy it. I've killed a lot of paper targets in my day. Hopefully I will never be forced to kill a human being, but if the need arises, I pray I will have the courage and willpower to do my duty. Righteousness doesn't reign while evil goes unopposed.
 

plain_n_simple

Active Member
Probably not. I have lived around some rough characters, having brothers and cousins who were bikers and drug addicts.

I have seen gunplay. I have seen thefts and burglaries. People do a lot of crazy things to support their habits, even to the point of murder.

Before I got saved, I had the same mentality... kill or be killed, whatever you need, if the opportunity arises, take it. Take it by force if necessary.

After I got saved, I became a new creature. I no longer wanted to return evil for evil. I no longer wanted to do unto my neighbor before he did unto me. I no longer wanted to cap the person who did me wrong. God changed my heart.

If I have to suffer persecution, so be it. But I will not own a gun. If I have to face death, then I will face death. I will not lift a hand of violence against my enemy. I will not kill another human being.
Now that is the mind of Christ...
 

Alcott

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
If I have to face death, then I will face death. I will not lift a hand of violence against my enemy. I will not kill another human being.

I hope you are not, and were not, deployed in the middle east, nor southeast Asia, nor Korea, nor Normandy.... or if you were you let the ones next to you know you wouldn't lift a hand in their defense.
 

Steadfast Fred

Active Member
Since there is no draft, I have no need to worry about being deployed to any war.

And I am sure that if I were called, the Armed Forces would quickly release me from any active duty given my stance.
 
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