Are all of God's Ten Commandments still valid?

[BobRyan]

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.


Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

================================
Bible texts both NT and OT about God's Commandments - Showing that the TEN Commandments are assigned the title "in scripture" as being "Commandments of God" -- and as also being "The Word of God"

10 Commandments are –
“Commandments of God” Neh 10:29
“Law of God” Neh 10:29
“Word of God” Mark 7:13
“Commandment of God” Mark 7:6-13
NT “Scripture” James 2:8
NT “Law” – James 2:9-11
NT Commandments Eph 6:2, Rom 13:9, Romans 7:7-10

Bob Ryan, for how many years now have you abused Sunday believers' conception of the Fourth Commandment?

If you are going to make a false accusation like that - you should at least dress it up a bit. Point to the 7 points and which one you think is incorrect in my claim.

Simply dancing around it - and then labeling it with a false accusation is not as compelling for the objective unbiased reader as you may have first imagined.



If you have a point - pick one in that list and prove that your accusation has substance.

 

[BobRyan]

Here you have a Baptist, Sunday-keeping forum, allowing me, to voice my faith that Jesus rose from the dead on the Sabbath and not on Sunday, but the Seventh-day Adventists KILL THE MESSENGER of the Message

Quite to the contrary as you and I both know - you could post that stuff all day long on "Club Adventist" just as you do here - claiming that you are not SDA at all.

And they would not block you from doing so --

I think adding those inconvenient facts to your complaint "makes a difference" because for many readers "details matter".

Here again - I think both you and I know this is true.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

The nonsense that DHK and I are in one accord on this topic is pretty hard to take seriously.

But the fact that the Ten Commandments are indeed the moral law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant is sooo glaringly obvious that even the majority of pro-sunday scholarship can see it.

They freely admit to the Bible fact that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are valid even while the ceremonial laws are fulfilled and ended after the cross.

"Baptist Confession of Faith"
"Westminster Confession of Faith"
C.H. Spurgeon
Andy Stanley
Matthew Henry
[FONT=&quot]Jamieson, Fausset, Brown[/FONT]
R.C Sproul
"D.L. Moody"
"Dies Domini"

How is it then that the majority of even pro-sunday scholarship has figured out this same Bible detail that the pro-Saturday Sabbath Christians have figured out?

It is because the use of the Ten Commandments in both OT and NT indicate that it is the moral law of God - written on the heart under the New Covenant, the one Gospel.

Deceitfulness is the same as lying.

Now and then you say something I find to be true.

That is one of those times.

Everyone of those men whom you quoted either have directly quoted being distanced from the SDA beliefs

Is this the point were we are all supposed to "imagine" that I said "the following pro-sunday groups are really SDA or pro-SDA"???

Is it your claim that you can simply make stuff up and it is supposed to be believed??

I don't find that to be a compelling form of debate. You are welcome to if it that is truly all you have.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

here is the "actual" claim made in the OP


Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.


Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

==============================

Even have it numbered for those who find "details" of the discussion to be illusive in their posts.

How "odd" that in all the complaining the false accusations do their level best to avoid the details in the actual OP.

How odd indeed.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[DHK]

here is the "actual" claim made in the OP


Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.


Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.

I go to church on Sunday, but I don't keep the Sabbath. Sunday is not the Sabbath, and never was. Just because someone mistakenly called it the Sabbath does not mean it is the Sabbath. You can label the moon as "Uranus," but that won't make it "Uranus," it just makes you very wrong. When others call "Sunday" the "Sabbath" they are very wrong no matter how sincere they maybe. They are sincere, but wrong. Sincerity doesn't earn brownie points; obedience is what God desires.

There is no law that obliges the Gentile believer to be under the Sabbath law.
You have not demonstrated that. It is significant that you are referencing people and not scripture.

1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3

No command is given. God rested or ceased from his creation.

2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.

God rested. No command is given for man to either rest or honor the Sabbath. Chapter and verse please!

3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.

And there is no command to keep the Sabbath.
NOTE: The only command to keep and honor the Sabbath is and was given to Israel, never to any one else.

4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God

Only as we generally speak of the Ten Commandments. However we are not under the Sabbath Day, and no one can keep the Sabbath Day. You don't keep the Sabbath Day do you? You may worship on Saturday, but that is not keeping the Sabbath Day. Study your Bible. YOU DO NOT KEEP THE SABBATH DAY ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURES!

5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant

Keeping the Sabbath is NOT part of God's moral law--never was.

6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.

Keeping the Sabbath is part of the Jewish law. Read Ex.31.

7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

No Gentile Believer is required to keep the Sabbath. If you are truthful you don't keep the Sabbath but hypocritically claim you do.
Back up your claims with scripture. Your man-made trade SDA tradition (actual woman-made tradition) is a false tradition. You don't keep the Sabbath according to the Scripture.

I agree with 6 out of 7

as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Most of us don't agree with them. And if explained and clarified in their proper text would proper context they would all probably agree with me, even Moody--who states plainly that he distances himself from the position of the SDA.

 

[Iconoclast]

22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

 

[BobRyan]

here is the "actual" claim made in the OP

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

==============================

Even have it numbered for those who find "details" of the discussion to be illusive in their posts.

How "odd" that in all the complaining the false accusations do their level best to avoid the details in the actual OP.

How odd indeed.

I go to church on Sunday, but I don't keep the Sabbath. Sunday is not the Sabbath, and never was. Just because someone mistakenly called it the Sabbath does not mean it is

I give an example of two pro-sunday groups - one (the majority) that affirms all 7 points listed.

And the other (might be yours) that opposes all 7 points that they affirm.

I affirm 6 of their 7 points - not all 7.

But I don't oppose all 7 points -- or I would be in your camp -- and I am not...

Obviously.

====================================

the Sabbath. You can label the moon as "Uranus," but that won't make it "Uranus," it just makes you very wrong. When others call "Sunday" the "Sabbath" they are very wrong no matter how sincere they maybe. They are sincere, but wrong. Sincerity doesn't earn brownie points; obedience is what God desires.

Interesting that you choose to take the one point in their 7 point list - where I differ with them - and you choose to bravely "also differ with them".

Was that intended as some sort of evidence against the OP????

If so - I find your logic illusive just then.

There is no law that obliges the Gentile believer to be under the Sabbath law.
You have not demonstrated that.

The texts I provide demonstrate that -- obviously.

But here at least you do show that you fully oppose all 7 points affirmed be the majority of even pro-sunday scholarship.

not just the 6 of those seven that the SDAs also affirm.

the OP does not claim that your group and mine would agree on all 7 points ... in fact the OP predicts your group and mine would agree on at most the 1 point you have mentioned.

The OP does not claim that your group that denies all 7 points would agree with the majority of even even pro-Sunday scholarship and your post affirms that point as well - you do not agree with them.

you cannot blame your differences with them on me. they flatly reject your views on 6 of those 7 points. obviously.

So then - this part of the OP is checking out pretty much as predicted.

Now for the 2nd half of your post.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[DHK]

22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

If there is any proof of a Coming Kingdom in which Jesus will rule on this earth, Icon, it is right here. Jesus will come again. He will come for the Jews, as a nation, who then will turn to him and be saved. In that Kingdom the Sabbath will be re-established. Again, it will be primarily for the Jews who he came to deliver, though all nations will be subject to them at that time instead of the other way around as it is now.
It proves the heresy of Replacement Theology wrong.
It proves that the church does not take the place of Israel.
It proves that the church is not spiritual Israel.
It proves that Israel still exists today, though they are not yet saved.
It proves that there will come a day that Israel will some day turn to Christ.

Someday all men WILL worship on the Sabbath, but that day is not now.
There are almost two billion Muslims on this earth today. Do they worship on the Sabbath? Of course not! The event is future.

 

[BobRyan]

Here is a perfect example of those 6 points -- (and perhaps even all 7) being affirmed.

I don't believe either D.L. Moody or C.H. Spurgeon were SDA - yet they could honestly admit to some Bible details that some here claim only SDAs could know about.

For example --

BY THE
DWIGHT L. MOODY​

The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17 ​

.
The Fourth Commandment

​

Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.​

[FONT=&quot]THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly? You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales? Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was. I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is just as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was[/FONT][FONT=&quot]- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins with the word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stone at Sinai. How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes; [/FONT] __________________


Now let's compare that to the statement in the OP

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.


Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

 

[BobRyan]

They all affirm that all TEN of the Ten commandments are included in the moral law of God that is binding on all mankind - even the saints from the days of Adam to this very day.

That is not an "SDA" statement - it is their own.

Why do they insist on this? Maybe it is because they know that in Jer 31:31-33 "The LAW of God is written on the heart" under the new Covenant and that this Law is the one that Jeremiah knew about - the one his contemporary readers knew about.

The Sabbath was "made for mankind - not mankind made for the Sabbath" according to Christ in Mark 2:27 - and this refers to the Gen 1:2-2:3 creation week where both are made.

So when we see in Is 66:23 that even into the New Earth "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL Mankind come before Me to bow down and worship"

In Matt 11 Christ did not abolish the 4th commandment. In fact Christ repeatedly challenges even one of his accusers to find a single commandment that he has nullified.

In Matt 5 Christ specifically condemns any teaching claiming that He has come to set aside or nullify the Law of God.

in Rom 3:31 Paul specifically addresses the question "do we then make void the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we establish the Law of God"

1Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the commandments of God"

 

[BobRyan]

22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

In the NASB that is "all mankind" -- so then an "all mankind" scope set for the Sabbath Commandment in the OT - in Is 66:23.

“And it shall be from new moon to new moon
And from
Sabbath to Sabbath,
All mankind will come to bow down before Me,” says the Lord.

So also in Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was MADE for mankind" A NT text.

when contrasting the moral law of God to the ceremonial law of God Paul says "what matters is KEEPING the commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19

So also does John 1 John 5:1-4

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

What about being at war with the Commandments of God and setting them aside for the sake of tradition? popularity?


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

 

[DHK]

Bob, you use deceit and lies, and deliberately so. With a game of semantics you make words mean what they do not mean. Then you try and and find common ground with the SDA which these men do not have. This is deceit, and it is transgressing the Ten Commandments, not keeping it. In the end you are worse of than when you began.

First what is the definition of "Ten Commandments"?
1. The Law.
2. The two great laws.
3. A listing of the ten commands as given by Jehovah to Moses in Exodus 20.
4. A general term referring to those commands as a group of laws in general "I keep "The Ten Commandments." The rich young ruler used it in this way.

Thus when a person says: "I believe in keeping the Ten Commandment," or "The Ten Commandments is the basis of our justice system," they are not necessarily referring to the Sabbath Day. They are referring to those commandments as a whole and in general, not necessarily your interpretation of them, and certainly not the Jewish interpretation of them.

None of the names given were of the nation of Israel.
None of the names given were of the cult SDA.
Therefore they all disagree with you. And you use their definitions and theology very deceitfully--a transgression of the Ten Commandments.

For example, I go to church on Sunday. Moody would say that I keep the Sabbath. But I disagree with Moody on his theology. I am not keeping the Sabbath. However, you use Moody as an example of one who keeps the Sabbath. That is dishonest. He does not in spite of his sermon. His sermon is all about worshiping on Sunday, nothing to do with the Sabbath.
Stop being dishonest.
Those men have nothing in common with the SDA's.

 

[BobRyan]

Bob, you use deceit and lies, and deliberately so. .

I use facts that all can see - you rely almost exclusively on vitriol and slander.

to each his own.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[DHK]

I use facts that all can see - you rely almost exclusively on vitriol and slander.

to each his own.

in Christ,

Bob

The people that you slander Bob, are Spurgeon and Moody. They do not keep the Sabbath: not the Jewish Sabbath, not the SDA Sabbath, not the Juma of Islam, etc. Why do you so slander them? They were godly men.
No this: The Sabbath of the SDA's is from a cult and the Sabbath from the Jews is from their ceremonial law. According to Exodus 31 it is to be kept by them and only them as a covenant between Jehovah and their generations forever.
You don't keep the Sabbath, according to the Scriptures. If you did you would join up with your local synagogue.

 

[BobRyan]

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Point 1.

For example, I go to church on Sunday. Moody would say that I keep the Sabbath.

That is because you are identifying Moody's 7th point above - that is also a common point held by them all.

Is it your claim that by affirming the details in my post about what Moody claims - you are advancing your opposition to my claim that this is how Moody views it??

Really??


Point 2.

In my posts I keep insisting that you are overtly opposing all 7 of the points Moody and the others affirm.

But I disagree with Moody on his theology.

Indeed you do. I suppose that is what I mean when I keep saying you are at war with all 7 of the points he and his fellow pro-Sunday scholars make (including the Baptist Confession of Faith).

Is it your claim that by affirming the details in my post about you being at war with all 7 of Moody's claims - you are advancing your opposition to my post??

Really??


Point 3;

However, you use Moody as an example of one who keeps the Sabbath.

You mean in my opposition to his claim of bending the Sabbath? My opposing his 7th point?

By my opposing him you want to imagine that I am arguing in favor of the idea that he is keeping the 7th day sabbath by doing what I strongly oppose?? really??

Really?? who is reading this thread at such a shallow level that they are going for that?? I can't imagine even one serious Bible student going through the thread - ignoring all the details and just latching on to name-calling and vitriol saying 'yep that proves it for me'.

Is there even one person doing that?

Who??

You seem to be engaged in a bit of storytelling for your own benefit. How is that supposed to be compelling for the rest of us "given the facts" are what they are?

I find your logic illusive at that point.

You have Iconoclast motivated to start watching for details to see how you do in this sort of exchange - are you sure you want to go for that sort of "solution"??

you are getting high marks on vitriol and name calling - but what about the facts in the discussion - the actual 7 point details? You seem to be falling behind when it comes to those 7 points and the claims that have been made about them in the OP.

in Christ,
Bob

 

[Iconoclast]

DHK;.


the text says

and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

you say;

He will come for the Jews, as a nation,

you say:

Someday all men WILL worship on the Sabbath, but that day is not now.

Peter quotes Joel;
16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh:
it is now:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs: all flesh...right now:thumbs:

 

[DHK]

DHK;.

and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

Peter quotes Joel;
16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh:
it is now:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs: all flesh...right now:thumbs:

The fulfillment of Joel, that is complete fulfillment has not happened yet. Like the passage in Isaiah, they both will be fulfilled in the future.
Anyone who believes that:
1. All flesh right now is filled with God's Spirit is plainly in error. And,
2. All mankind right now is worshiping God on the Sabbath is plainly in error.

How can anyone believe that in such a wicked world as this those two things are now taking place or even at any time in the past have taken place. Demonstrate it, not just believe by blind faith. Give evidence, not blind faith. What evidence do you have? This is wild, wild speculation beyond anything that a rational Christian would believe. Seriously!
Please! Bring forth credible evidence.

 

[DHK]

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.

you are getting high marks on vitriol and name calling - but what about the facts in the discussion - the actual 7 point details? You seem to be falling behind when it comes to those 7 points and the claims that have been made about them in the OP.

in Christ,
Bob

There is no common ground. The name I give your organization is a cult.
You do not keep the Sabbath. Here is what the Sabbath is like.
From Faucett's Bible Dictionary:

Its merciful character appears in its extension to the ox, ass, and cattle. Needless and avoidable work was forbidden (Ex 34:21; 35:3). But like other feasts it was to be a day of enjoyment (Isa 58:13; Ho 2:11). Only the covetous and carnal were impatient of its restraints (Am 8:5-6). In the sanctuary the morning and evening sacrifices were doubled, the shewbread was changed, and each of David's 24 courses of priests and Levites began duty on the Sabbath. The offerings symbolized the call to all Israel to give themselves to the Lord's service on the Sabbath more than on other days. The 12 loaves of shewbread representing the offerings of the 12 tribes symbolized the good works which they should render to Jehovah; diligence in His service receiving fresh quickening on the day of rest and holy convocation before Him. The Levites were dispersed throughout Israel to take advantage of these convocations, and in them "teach Israel God's law" (De 33:10).

Now, do you keep the Sabbath? Really? Be honest.

 

[BobRyan]

There is no common ground. The name I give your organization is a cult.
You do not keep the Sabbath. .

Your vitriol is in good form today DHK - how do you keep up the name-calling and vitriol so consistently. You must have a secret. Please share it with us.

P.S. it is no surprise here that I do keep the seventh day of the week as the "Sabbath of the Lord Thy God" -- as scripture commands.

I think we all knew that -- be honest.

Here is an honest statement from the OP -- 7 points you have yet to refute (possibly because you are so busy posting evidence after evidence that the points I list are exactly what you oppose and exactly what they promote -- (As the OP claims you would do) while then adding wild claims that you are opposing the claims made about certain pro-Sunday groups)

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Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.